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NSNO Forums => The Everton Forum => Topic started by: Silas on December 11, 2017, 01:20:54 AM

Title: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Silas on December 11, 2017, 01:20:54 AM
Pickford 6 - his kicking was horrible but he dealt with everything else well and no chance for he goal.

Martina 3 -  before turning in a calamity of a performance he actually started ok. What was most worrying is he how gutless he was in the tackle

Holgate 7 - thought he was a calm presence

Williams 7 - he enjoys defending from deep were he doesn't need to chase players

Kenny 7 - a bright spot full of desire and kept Mane relatively quiet MOTM

Rooney 7 -  daft putting him out wide he worked hard but no surprise quality shone through when in the centre to provide the penalty and a calm finish

Gueye 6 - thought he struggled with the ball but maintained his position well and tackled hard

Davies 5 - not sure what to do with him right now. He doesn't seem to be excelling in any one position. Shouldn't really be starting games

Sigurddsson 6 - worked hard defensively more than anything else. Didn't do much apart from that

Niasse 5 - was never going to get chances in the box which is the main reason to play him. Not sure what his position was and struggled

Calvert Lewin 6 - struggled with little to work with and sometimes seemed to give up a little but did well to win penalty

Subs

Lennon 6 - we looker better for him being on and helped Kenny

Schneiderlin 6 - thought he did OK and was positionally more sound than Davies

Jags Na
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Faceatthefence on December 11, 2017, 01:25:11 AM
5 for Davies is generous as bad as cuco today,dont know where the player inside him as vacated to.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: MmmBlueRamirez on December 11, 2017, 01:32:43 AM
Kenny MOTM.

Again.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: The Blue 3/4 of Liverpool on December 11, 2017, 01:34:04 AM
10/10 for Rooney’s arse muscles for not collapsing when taking the pen.

Now level with Lukaku on 8 goals :)

Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 11, 2017, 01:34:24 AM
Is pickfords distribution good or just always quick and a bit of a lottery
Think the ratings for all the defenders are really harsh. Martina wasn't great but he wasn't a 3 either. The other 3 were very good as was gueye. Attacking wise we offered nowt really. Desperately need bolaise Coleman and barkley (or a replacement) back and a targetman
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Martip on December 11, 2017, 01:35:02 AM
Loved Kenny today....growing into a player game by game

Cuco was horrific  :bonk:
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Heisenberg on December 11, 2017, 01:37:40 AM
Martina wasnt gutless in the tackle. He was just so obviously trying to tackle with the wrong foot each time leaving his standing position weak
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: blue slug on December 11, 2017, 01:46:44 AM
A bit generous with some of the ratings there
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Ross on December 11, 2017, 02:04:35 AM
Thought Rooney was very poor myself, great pass and solid penalty aside, he was anonymous and his covering as a right side midfielder left Kenny exposed far more than Lennon would have without the outlet on the break.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Shogun on December 11, 2017, 02:10:16 AM
Pickford - 6 - Despite the post-match narrative. He had nothing to do.

Kenny - 8 - Defended strongly throughout and showed a boss attitude. MOTM

Holgate - 8 - Don't think he did anything wrong and even took the ball off Lovren's toes to prevent a likely goal.

Williams - 7 - He's hardly put a foot wrong in the last four matches. I'm docking him a point for committing to a tackle up the pitch which let Mane through (with three other LFC players) just before HT.

Martina - 3 - Didn't actually think he was that bad earlier on in the game. Will cut him some slack playing out of position against the league's top scorers. He's never been good enough really.

Davies - 5 - Tough for someone like him considering how poor we were in possession.

Gana - 7 - Thought he'd be restricted after the yellow but he wasn't. Put in a lot of good tackles and even got us up the pitch a couple of times in the second half.

Rooney - 7 - Nonsense playing him on the right. One bit of quality came from him and he scored from the spot.

Sigurdsson - 5 - Considering he had to play Left Back as well for most of the match then he did ok but struggled to impact the game.

Niasse - 5 - We were too deep to really get his part of the game plan to work.

DCL - 5 - I know he won the pen and put in a good shift overall but he didn't make the ball stick at all.

Subs:

Schneiderlin - 4 - Generally a fan but he's shite.
Lennon - 6 - Quietly got us a bit further up the pitch at times.
Jagielka - 6 - Not much to say


Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Tony Clifton on December 11, 2017, 02:14:09 AM
Kenny just shaded MOTM from Williams for me.  Holgate up there too.  Thought Gueye had a decent game too, despite the early yellow. Still got too many mistakes in us, and that wastefulness in possession, but heads are no longer dropping.  The two Sam's breathing down necks from the touchline is making a difference.  Anyone read the Echo ratings?  Not sure they were watching the same game.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Heisenberg on December 11, 2017, 02:15:12 AM
Shouldn't have messed with the team. Actually made us alot more unbalanced. No wide players and rooney out of the centre where hes been performing best
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: SANA_DR0 on December 11, 2017, 02:25:57 AM
Kenny MOTM, Holgate not far behind him.

everyone else a 6 or a 7 i guess.. besides Martina. 4 would be generous for him.


:Pickfords kicks are amazing.. shame they go straight through to the oppositions goalkeeper too much.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Heisenberg on December 11, 2017, 02:25:59 AM
Oh and 6 for siggurdson was generous. He done absolutely nothing. Can't remember him even having a kick in there half other than the hopeful shot. He's useless when the ball is in play
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Shogun on December 11, 2017, 02:34:04 AM
Oh and 6 for siggurdson was generous. He done absolutely nothing. Can't remember him even having a kick in there half other than the hopeful shot. He's useless when the ball is in play

He had to double up on Salah most of the match.

Most of our midfielder's are going to come out as poor ratings when the game plan is to bypass them.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 11, 2017, 02:42:47 AM
He had to double up on Salah most of the match.

Most of our midfielder's are going to come out as poor ratings when the game plan is to bypass them.

Agree with you on today's game but he's clearly not the playmaker we need. He's a player who has great moments. We need players who take control of games if we are going to look upwards to the top 6
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: TheRam on December 11, 2017, 02:50:35 AM
I don't think I saw anyone actually try and pass the ball to him to be fair.

He put a shift in and took on the managers instructions which is all you can ask for in games like that

He's played really well in recent weeks.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Fynci on December 11, 2017, 03:04:09 AM
Martina is not a LB. He was poor but he shouldn’t have been in that position in the first place. The fact we have no backup is where the blame should really lie.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: howard1334 on December 11, 2017, 03:10:23 AM
Perhaps the development over the last 3 prem games that I am most excited about is Holgate's emergence as a viable CB option. It has been great to see.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: The Analog Kid on December 11, 2017, 03:20:50 AM
Who got MotM on Sky? Kenny got it on the BBC
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Trowel on December 11, 2017, 03:32:47 AM
Who got MotM on Sky? Kenny got it on the BBC
Kenny also.

http://www.skysports.com/football/liverpool-vs-everton/373250
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Macca77 on December 11, 2017, 03:39:26 AM
Kenny by miles, he was immense
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: sam of the south on December 11, 2017, 04:09:41 AM
My favourite Kenny moment was when he stopped Mane (I think) in the first half, and as the ball went out for a throw he started pogoing up and down with a bit of 'ave some of that, you fucking red shite' passion! 😜
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: WeimaranerBlues on December 11, 2017, 04:24:33 AM
Kenny just shaded MOTM from Williams for me.  Holgate up there too.  Thought Gueye had a decent game too, despite the early yellow. Still got too many mistakes in us, and that wastefulness in possession, but heads are no longer dropping.  The two Sam's breathing down necks from the touchline is making a difference.  Anyone read the Echo ratings?  Not sure they were watching the same game.

Always check them to have a laugh,  always thought on principle that if you defend as a unit/tactics and restrict the opposition to 3 shots on target away from Home then you should get a decent score so , its not like they run us ragged with last ditch tackles &Pickford making save after save

Kenny MOTM and an 8 rest 7 and Martina 4. 
Midfield 6 with Davies 5
DC-L 6 Naisse 5
Lennon 6 Morgs 5
But them Echo stats are utter bollocks Joe Gomez a fucking 9 , he had fuckall to do
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: sam of the south on December 11, 2017, 04:24:36 AM
Perhaps the development over the last 3 prem games that I am most excited about is Holgate's emergence as a viable CB option. It has been great to see.

@Evertonian in NC (http://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3784) is wanking himself silly at this
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: The Analog Kid on December 11, 2017, 04:30:01 AM
My favourite Kenny moment was when he stopped Mane (I think) in the first half, and as the ball went out for a throw he started pogoing up and down with a bit of 'ave some of that, you fucking red shite' passion! 😜

That was the moment I posted the “Kenny is fucking loving this”

He was proper getting stuck in!
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: sam of the south on December 11, 2017, 04:43:39 AM
That was the moment I posted the “Kenny is fucking loving this”

He was proper getting stuck in!

Yeah, it gave me a proper chubby 🍆
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: blueski on December 11, 2017, 06:02:00 AM
numbers aside I think DCL's performance is a little underrated - he was effectively alone up top the whole game with a lot on his shoulders to provide an outlet and win balls

he actually won the ball fairly often and I think the fact that he was immediately mobbed by 3-4 defenders with no one giving him an easy outlet made it look a little ineffectual

won us a crafty pen as well

with a shred of support around him he might have been able to platform us some possession in dangerous areas
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Duncs_a_legend on December 11, 2017, 06:07:24 AM
Some harsh scores on Martina and Gueye I think.

I think Kenny was MOTM. Everyone else was quite average, I'm not sure Martina was any worse than Davies.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: MarcusFenix on December 11, 2017, 01:55:13 PM
Some harsh scores on Martina and Gueye I think.


3s and 4s for Martina is very harsh IMO. Yes he is very much a square peg in a round hole but that's not his fault.

He was up against one of the most in form players in Europe currently, he stuck to his task as manfully as he could and helped the defence as a whole to restrict that rampant attacking force to relatively few clear cut opportunities.

Obviously wouldn't mark him a 7 or 8 but I think a 6 would certainly be more reflective of how he played as part of the whole defensive unit in an alien position.

Just remember also that Kenny, Williams and Holgate were playing in their natural, preferred positions
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 11, 2017, 02:25:33 PM
Pickford 6 Has he had an easier game?
Kenny 8
Martina 6
Holgate 7
Williams 7
Davies 5
Gueye 6
Siggurdsson 6
Rooney 6
DCL 6
Niasse 4

Schneiderlin 5
Lennon 6
Jagielka na
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Waltzer on December 11, 2017, 02:40:05 PM

:Pickfords kicks are amazing.. shame they go straight through to the oppositions goalkeeper too much.

I assumed he'd been tasked with getting our shot count up he did it so often?
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: MmmBlueRamirez on December 11, 2017, 03:18:25 PM
Perhaps the development over the last 3 prem games that I am most excited about is Holgate's emergence as a viable CB option. It has been great to see.

I’e not really noticed that Holgates even playing in the last few games.

That’s either the sign of a class player or his CD partner is working twice as hard.

I suspect the former.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Django on December 11, 2017, 04:11:38 PM
Pickford - 6 - Great goalkeeping especially with how slippy that ball probably was. Kicking not so great, was partly the problem as to why we couldn't keep hold of the ball. Gonna need a proven target man under Allardyce.

Kenny - 8 - Amazing what a run of games does to a player. Great to see him fronting up one of the league's best and coming out on top. Bullied Robertson at times as well. Got a great pass on him as well as he displayed in the build up to the pen.

Holgate - 7 - Really solid. I'm happy to see us jibbing off the play from the back nonsense in games like that, just want to see your centre halves get rid and win headers, which he did supremely. He'll learn a lot more defending like that than from having his confidence ruined. Probably see a better Michael Keane too eventually.

Williams - 7 - A one man rock performance from him that hasn't been seen since his Swansea days. Not asked to do anything special except use his strengths. Good to see.

Martina - 4 - Feel for him, out of his depth in his favoured position and expected to play against the most in-form player in the league on his wrong foot. Actually did really well to close the angle down on Mane but was too weak in the tackle, which happens when you're off balance permanently. Can't believe we allowed all them LBs leave us and didn't include Garbutt in the squad, who surely would of looked better than him.

Gueye - 7 - Looks like he's gonna be vital under big Sam. Back to his best yesterday.

Davies - 5 - Struggle to know what he's bringing to the team lately apart from the threat of a yellow card. Still going to be a boss player but probably needs a break followed by a solid run in the team playing in the same position week in week out.

Sigurdsson - 6 - Put a shift in and works hard defensively. Needs to play in his correct position and to have the team play to his strengths a bit more or he'll never impact on these types of games.

Rooney - 6 - Struggled a bit playing out of position, but no one wanted it more than him. He's still an asset in the big games. His brain on the pitch is better than anyone's and it looks like him and DCL have an understanding with them through balls.

Oumar Baye Niasse - 5 - Thought he did as much as expected of him really. He lacks quality but will harass defences for as long as he's on the pitch. He'll get us 10+ goals easily this season.

DCL - 7 - Bereft of any service but his head never dropped and that's what won us the penalty. He's really coming on as a player now.

Subs -
Lennon - 6 - got us up the pitch and was a good outball as well as tracking back. Would of started him tbh.

Schniederlin - 5 - Really want him to get back to his best, but still looks off the pace and generally bobbins.

Jags - 5 - Came on late, didn't do much. Didn't have to while Henderson and Milner where playing sideways like the Disgrace of Gijon.

Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: mikey_blue on December 11, 2017, 04:14:28 PM
https://twitter.com/thebig_sam/status/939891693993816064
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: TheTone on December 11, 2017, 08:28:07 PM
regarding Sigurdsson

puts in a shift to be fair to him but disappointed with his close ball control and he is a lot slower than I thought

has played better in recent games though , hoping he can go up another few levels as he must be nearing peak fitness now at this stage
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: D15TIN on December 11, 2017, 09:50:44 PM
Pickford 7 - Did well, feel calm when he's in goal, had no chance with the goal, distribution a little off yesterday

Martina 5 - Was the weakest player, but we already knew that, all things considered against one of europes strongest attacks, playing on his wrong side, we collectively reduced them to very little clear chances.

Williams 7 - Solid, looking a lot stronger under Sam

Holgate 7 - as above

Kenny 8 - Thought he was excellent, really mature performance, like he'd been playing derbies for years

Gana 8 - Back to his old self yesterday, was everywhere

Davies 5 - Quite poor, had a feeling he'd struggle, lost the ball a few times before being subbed

Rooney 7 - pace of Liverpool showed his age a little, but played a beauty of a ball for DCL as we know, and then kept his nerve

Sigurdsson 6 - Worked hard, the small number of set pieces weren't his best, was quiet

DCL - 7 Worked hard as always, great first touch from rooneys ball, did his job with very little service

Niasse 5 - Same as Davies, didn't really get involved enough, rightly subbed
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Macca77 on December 11, 2017, 10:47:03 PM
6's for Rooney, Gana, Williams and Pickford
8 for Kenny
3 for Martina
4 for Davies
5's for the resr
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Bluedylan on December 11, 2017, 10:52:37 PM
Niasse was awful. One of the worst 'hold the ball up, buy your team time and get them up the pitch' attempts I've ever seen. It was utterly pathetic. He was much worse than Martina, who had a thankless task, out of position and isolated against one of the form players in world football.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: BlueForYou on December 11, 2017, 11:06:45 PM
Job done

Next.........................
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: TheRam on December 11, 2017, 11:08:13 PM
Kenny aside I thought gana was our best player and has been for a good few weeks now.

Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: cantoffee on December 11, 2017, 11:08:17 PM
Niasse was awful. One of the worst 'hold the ball up, buy your team time and get them up the pitch' attempts I've ever seen. It was utterly pathetic. He was much worse than Martina, who had a thankless task, out of position and isolated against one of the form players in world football.
Yea he really couldn't do anything.

Tough task but every time the ball went in to him on the ground or in the air it came right back at us.

He just doesn't have the hold up play for games like that.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: D15TIN on December 11, 2017, 11:12:27 PM
I’e not really noticed that Holgates even playing in the last few games.

That’s either the sign of a class player or his CD partner is working twice as hard.

I suspect the former.
I think that's definitely a good sign
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 11, 2017, 11:13:37 PM
Kenny aside I thought gana was our best player and has been for a good few weeks now.
He's a dream player for Allardyce
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Gash on December 12, 2017, 12:33:57 AM
Niasse was awful. One of the worst 'hold the ball up, buy your team time and get them up the pitch' attempts I've ever seen. It was utterly pathetic. He was much worse than Martina, who had a thankless task, out of position and isolated against one of the form players in world football.

It's a big flaw of his, a fundamental part of being a fooballer is being able to control a football.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 12, 2017, 01:49:00 PM
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/cuco-martina-fact-evertons-unsung-14025430
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: GLewis on December 12, 2017, 02:07:21 PM
Did feel that some of the criticisms were way over the top given that it wasn’t as though they were pouring through that side every time.

Certainly can’t see the logic in scoring him worse that Davies and Niasse who were in their normal positions and were rubbish.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Toddacelli on December 12, 2017, 02:22:04 PM
Kenny aside I thought gana was our best player and has been for a good few weeks now.



Yeah some of the shouts when he had a dip in form when he was tasked with getting further forward and creating something - awful. He's great at what he does - let's just use him that way.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Toddacelli on December 12, 2017, 02:27:41 PM
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/cuco-martina-fact-evertons-unsung-14025430

Interesting! Everyone who's ever had anything to say about Martina should read this.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Gash on December 12, 2017, 03:15:35 PM
Interesting! Everyone who's ever had anything to say about Martina should read this.

Why? He's generally been poor.

He probably had higher stats because most of their play was coming down his side, his only saving grace was they took Salah off. I wonder how many of these tackles and clearances were after he was subbed? He might have been playing out of position but it doesn't change the fact that even playing his correct position, he's not very good.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Confucius on December 12, 2017, 03:31:50 PM
Why? He's generally been poor.

He probably had higher stats because most of their play was coming down his side, his only saving grace was they took Salah off. I wonder how many of these tackles and clearances were after he was subbed? He might have been playing out of position but it doesn't change the fact that even playing his correct position, he's not very good.


Yeah, don't let facts get in the way of your opinion.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Gash on December 12, 2017, 03:37:07 PM

Yeah, don't let facts get in the way of your opinion.

He was poor and largely has been since he arrived, that's a fact.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Confucius on December 12, 2017, 03:43:30 PM
He was poor and largely has been since he arrived, that's a fact.

He has largely been poor yes, true. He wasn't poor Sunday. He had one of the worlds in form players against him and bar one Worldey of a goal(which he was fouled in the build up to) Salah was kept relatively quiet.

Important stats for a defender like clearances, interceptions and tackles show him have had a much better game than poor.

Sure you might not rate him and it might be justified, by at least try to critique his performances objectively.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: TheRam on December 12, 2017, 03:48:29 PM
Thought he was dreadful myself like.

He wasn't fouled in the goal he was just pathetically weak as usual.

It's negligent that we have such a sub standard player getting regular game time here.

His grim little limp he does every game hoping he gets sub winds me up as well.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Gash on December 12, 2017, 03:51:29 PM
Sure you might not rate him and it might be justified, by at least try to critique his performances objectively.

I am and in my opinion he was poor and those stats aren't going to change that opinion, football isn't played on a sheet of paper. It's not just my opinion, I'm not sure if you saw the game but all through it people were saying he struggled and even the commentators mentioned he had a hard time.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Confucius on December 12, 2017, 04:01:00 PM
I am and in my opinion he was poor and those stats aren't going to change that opinion, football isn't played on a sheet of paper. It's not just my opinion, I'm not sure if you saw the game but all through it people were saying he struggled and even the commentators mentioned he had a hard time.

Yeah he struggled but I remember many tackles and stopping Salah getting a cross into him having to back track and play a less dangerous ball. All on his weaker foot. If Baines had played right back and played similarly we would all be applauding him.

Salah is currently playing better than Ronaldo. Let that sink in. And Cuco Martina kept him relatively quiet while playing in the wrong side.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Gash on December 12, 2017, 04:03:46 PM
Yeah he struggled but I remember many tackles and stopping Salah getting a cross into him having to back track and play a less dangerous ball. All on his weaker foot. If Baines had played right back and played similarly we would all be applauding him.

Salah is currently playing better than Ronaldo. Let that sink in. And Cuco Martina kept him relatively quiet while playing in the wrong side.

Go on, just admit it, you didn't see the game. ;)
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Confucius on December 12, 2017, 04:11:24 PM
Go on, just admit it, you didn't see the game. ;)

HAHA! I did watch it. On a massive screen with 3 tiny kids jumping all over me as much as possible.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: van der Meyde on December 12, 2017, 04:33:06 PM
Why? He's generally been poor.

He probably had higher stats because most of their play was coming down his side, his only saving grace was they took Salah off. I wonder how many of these tackles and clearances were after he was subbed? He might have been playing out of position but it doesn't change the fact that even playing his correct position, he's not very good.
Yes, exactly. This kind of use of statistics is very simplistic.

That said, I personally thought that Martina did okay. I thought at the time he was at fault for their goal, but looking at it again I'm not sure if Salah doesn't just plain push him over.

Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Toddacelli on December 12, 2017, 04:38:38 PM
Why? He's generally been poor.

He probably had higher stats because most of their play was coming down his side, his only saving grace was they took Salah off. I wonder how many of these tackles and clearances were after he was subbed? He might have been playing out of position but it doesn't change the fact that even playing his correct position, he's not very good.

I didn't mean it would change your mind or anything - to be clear, I agree with you on how poor he has been. But despite my low opinion of him I found these stats interesting. It makes me think that he's probably trying harder than I previously gave him credit for.

And he has had a couple of decent games, in amongst the stinkers.

Stats can be misleading but it's all information and how you use it - I found this interesting, I hope you do too.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: GLewis on December 12, 2017, 04:39:25 PM
I thought he made a mistake for the goal.

But equally even if they did attack down his side all the time he didn’t get rinsed time and time again.

He at least gave a decent account of himself so shouldn’t be judged the worst player on the pitch.

Doing that would seem to be down to general opinion of him, which is fair on the whole but not for this game I wouldn’t say.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: TheTone on December 12, 2017, 04:39:51 PM
anyone see Martinas celebration when we were awarded the pen ? He was going mental  lolol

he reminds me of an outfield player having to go in goal, awkward as fuck but some how blags through it

Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Lazarou on December 12, 2017, 04:41:19 PM
I know Cuco was on the left side for a right sided defender, but his attempt at block tackles was very unorthodox, a sort of waft with the outside of his foot rather than a block tackle, he actually technically won the ball a few times but it was that weak a tackle, Salah immediately got the ball back.

Don't rate him at all.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: GLewis on December 12, 2017, 04:51:21 PM
I know Cuco was on the left side for a right sided defender, but his attempt at block tackles was very unorthodox, a sort of waft with the outside of his foot rather than a block tackle, he actually technically won the ball a few times but it was that weak a tackle, Salah immediately got the ball back.

Don't rate him at all.

Don’t think anyone rates him overall!

More that is 3/10 fair in comparison to others?
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Lazarou on December 12, 2017, 04:57:48 PM
Don’t think anyone rates him overall!

More that is 3/10 fair in comparison to others?

Like a politician that did not even answer the question  :whistle:

3/10 is probably harsh because if he was that bad I am sure we would have had more problems from Salah in the match than we actually did, they did not appear to go after him all match.

For a decent sized bloke against a player like Salah he was incredibly weak for the goal but then he is not the first defender to look like a mug against him.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Deano Blue Boy on December 12, 2017, 05:27:19 PM
I don't know how people can remember much from these games.  Games like these I tend to just look blindly at the screen with adrenaline bumping to fuck.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Lazarou on December 12, 2017, 05:40:44 PM
I don't know how people can remember much from these games.  Games like these I tend to just look blindly at the screen with adrenaline bumping to fuck.

Do you not make notes, I thought everyone did  ;)
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: kramer0 on December 12, 2017, 05:41:08 PM
I'm impressed that Martina stayed in position for the entire match. If you had told me he was capable of that even a few weeks ago, I would have said you were crazy.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: D15TIN on December 12, 2017, 09:16:30 PM
Baines wouldn't have been much better than Martina, that's the shocking thing - were so much in need of a LB - we should have one ready to sign the first week of Jan
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: TheTone on December 13, 2017, 01:57:58 AM
Aldo still rattling on

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/john-aldridge-enough-is-enough-for-liverpool-dejan-lovren-is-not-cut-out-to-be-a-starting-centre-back-36401932.html
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: sam of the south on December 13, 2017, 02:20:36 AM
Aldo still rattling on

https://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/premier-league/john-aldridge-enough-is-enough-for-liverpool-dejan-lovren-is-not-cut-out-to-be-a-starting-centre-back-36401932.html

He's such a dull, sly-faced bell
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: School of Science on December 13, 2017, 02:41:25 AM
He's such a dull, sly-faced bell

The arrogant Allerdyce ! Did not see Klopps interview then Aldo ?
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: gizzblue on December 13, 2017, 03:34:21 AM
I don't know how people can remember much from these games.  Games like these I tend to just look blindly at the screen with adrenaline bumping to fuck.
Glutten for punishment I rewatch even after being the match ....a few of us do on here.

We must be mad .
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: sam of the south on December 13, 2017, 04:07:39 AM
The arrogant Allerdyce ! Did not see Klopps interview then Aldo ?

I had a kopite banging on about Allardyce's arrogance the other day, and similarly I was astounded by the irony
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Bally on December 13, 2017, 04:43:05 AM
Glutten for punishment I rewatch even after being the match ....a few of us do on here.

We must be mad .
How do you rewatch it?
Have I asked this before?
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: BlueBeagle on December 13, 2017, 04:46:57 AM
I miss Radio City coverage of games if I'm in the car when a game happens to be being played but at the same time it's an absolute blessing not to have to listen to that fucking mug 'Aldo'
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: gizzblue on December 13, 2017, 05:00:36 AM
How do you rewatch it?
Have I asked this before?
Don't think you have, ive got a dvr  set up to my internet out kid set up... although I actually used sky on the Darby 👍
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Tony Clifton on December 13, 2017, 05:49:22 AM
Aldo still rattling on

Missing all the key points, and contradicting himself as usual, the bad simpleton.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: brap2 on December 13, 2017, 05:51:19 AM
I thought he made a mistake for the goal.

But equally even if they did attack down his side all the time he didn’t get rinsed time and time again.

He at least gave a decent account of himself so shouldn’t be judged the worst player on the pitch.

Doing that would seem to be down to general opinion of him, which is fair on the whole but not for this game I wouldn’t say.

People are conflating not rating him and not rating his performance.

Yeah he got done and yeah that 50/50 was powderpoof, but he was against one of he best players in the league and they targeted him. We’ve seen worse 1v1 match ups this year and that says to me he wasn’t terrible.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: ally2 on December 13, 2017, 05:55:08 AM
Surprised he can write. I can just imagine him sitting at the keyboard typing with his forefingers at 10 key presses/minute whilst trying to remember what the mouse is for.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Tony Clifton on December 13, 2017, 06:00:36 AM
I miss Radio City coverage of games if I'm in the car when a game happens to be being played but at the same time it's an absolute blessing not to have to listen to that fucking mug 'Aldo'

Yeah, he hasn't even got a face for radio has he?  The sound of his voice almost makes me want to hurt myself.
Title: Re: Match Ratings versus Liverpool
Post by: Tony Clifton on December 13, 2017, 06:04:41 AM
People are conflating not rating him and not rating his performance.

Yeah he got done and yeah that 50/50 was powderpoof, but he was against one of he best players in the league and they targeted him. We’ve seen worse 1v1 match ups this year and that says to me he wasn’t terrible.

I think he'd do better there if he just stayed on his toes - he's a bit flat-footed isn't he?

Anyway, I'm hoping a few weeks from now we can move on from both Martina and Baines.  And then some (hello Kevin Mirallas, Phil Jagielka...) ;)