June 22, 2018, 08:38:47 PM

Author Topic: [News]Bramley Moore Dock update  (Read 263455 times)

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February 16, 2018, 08:50:04 PM
Reply #3000
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van der Meyde


Will Allsops cloud was stopped because of heritage fears. The first plans for King Edward tower (and the 2nd i think).
The Lime street regeneration was put on hold for a decade due to it. (the road, not the area around the station - that had other issues).
Edge Lane has been stopped from being widened in areas due to the types of houses it would have had to bulldoze.

The city then went through a great little period of building anyway - Liverpool One, the Met Quarter, Mann Island, Old Hall Street and the ongoing sensor city.
The credit crunch outright stopped 2 major schemes (jennifer & central village). Jennifer, albeit in slightly scaled back form, has been able to pick back you again.

But CABE (manchester based) and English Heritage (London based) have interrupted/delayed/stopped quite a bit of work in this city.
Cheers Mick. The cloud would have been a wonderful addition.

It's not an easy balance between preservation and development, is it? Blocking development of Lime St because of the Futurist was always a joke because by that point there was little left worthwhile to keep. The damage there was done years ago. (That said, did we really need more student housing in town..?)

I wish developers and heritage organisations could work together a bit more. What use are the docks if they're derelict? Who sees the dock wall, the clock, the docks themselves these days anyway? But they're also all distinctive features that I'd love to be preserved as much possible. It's one of the reasons that I'm so excited about potentially moving down to the docks, it's somewhere that will be unique in English football with loads of history around us.

Without heritage concerns though, what's stopping developers from destroying what makes the docks and city unique? Yes, parts of docks may need to be filled in. I wouldn't have a problem with parts of the dock wall being knocked through either. We're lucky to have half this stuff and without heritage organisations, I think we'd be at risk of large parts of the city centre become soulless, identikit versions of almost every other city in the country. Left to their own devices would you trust the developers to get the balance right? Because I wouldn't.
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February 16, 2018, 08:52:21 PM
Reply #3001
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Alanvideo


UNESCO is a lot of bollocks. I've never decided against going on holiday somewhere based on wether or not they have world heritage status.
What a load of nonsense.
...........the loss of World Heritage status wouldn't affect individuals but it might discourage cruise firms from including Liverpool on their itineraries. Then it's up to the council to promote the city even more. I don't see it as much of a problem though.
We are special ,we are Everton.

February 16, 2018, 08:57:18 PM
Reply #3002
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Mick 1995

NSNO Subscriber
Without heritage concerns though, what's stopping developers from destroying what makes the docks and city unique? Yes, parts of docks may need to be filled in. I wouldn't have a problem with parts of the dock wall being knocked through either. We're lucky to have half this stuff and without heritage organisations, I think we'd be at risk of large parts of the city centre become soulless, identikit versions of almost every other city in the country. Left to their own devices would you trust the developers to get the balance right? Because I wouldn't.

I do agree that history should be preserved.
I just can't shake the feeling that the fact these institutions are from Manchester and London is relevant.
Do you reckon they would have stopped something as transformational in either of those two cities?

But yes. In an ideal world we would have brand new, imposing architecture sitting next to our clearly preserved history.
Like Hong Kong, but probably a bit smaller hahaha


February 16, 2018, 09:31:35 PM
Reply #3003
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Ross


UNESCO are cowards and full of hot air. Nothing will come of their bravado.

Maybe, maybe not with regards to the Unesco heritage status, time will only tell with that.

But the fact the Peel are redesigning their plans and the council are proposing “a raft of measures aimed at preserving the city's heritage status“ suggests they want it keeping and by introducing new planning guidelines while we’re trying to get through current designs could put the brakes on for a while I could imagine. If they’re looking at new sympathetic guidelines being introduced to keep Unesco happy they’re hardly going to give our plans a clear lane in the summer for fear of the precedent being set for the future.
There are only two things I can't stand in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures... and the Dutch.

February 16, 2018, 09:37:26 PM
Reply #3004
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van der Meyde


I do agree that history should be preserved.
I just can't shake the feeling that the fact these institutions are from Manchester and London is relevant.
Do you reckon they would have stopped something as transformational in either of those two cities?

But yes. In an ideal world we would have brand new, imposing architecture sitting next to our clearly preserved history.
Like Hong Kong, but probably a bit smaller hahaha
Well, I wouldn't suggest they're actively trying to sabotage Liverpool's development. ;)

It's easy to lose sight of how things actually are if you're not based there though.
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February 16, 2018, 09:37:50 PM
Reply #3005
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Ross


Personally, I'd be tempted to call their bluff and offer to package their shitty plaque and pop it in the post to them.
What does Liverpool actually gain from the UNESCO status. We have some fabulous architecture in this city. A fucking plaque and the seal of approval doesn't make it any more or less beautiful.
People come to Liverpool because of the Beatles and, although it pains me to say it, to worship at Big Fuck Off Stand FC. They come to Liverpool because of some of the achievements of people who were born and bred here. They come because it's a fantastic city, not because a gang of UNESCO pricks decided it was a World Heritage Site.
Tell them to fuck right off. We have to move with the times.

Apparently Dresden lost 5% off it’s tourism industry the following years it was removed. Not sure what Liverpool’s tourism sector brings to the City but I’d imagine that would be a fair chunk of change and something the council won’t take lightly.
There are only two things I can't stand in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures... and the Dutch.


February 16, 2018, 09:38:45 PM
Reply #3006
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van der Meyde


Maybe, maybe not with regards to the Unesco heritage status, time will only tell with that.

But the fact the Peel are redesigning their plans and the council are proposing “a raft of measures aimed at preserving the city's heritage status“ suggests they want it keeping and by introducing new planning guidelines while we’re trying to get through current designs could put the brakes on for a while I could imagine. If they’re looking at new sympathetic guidelines being introduced to keep Unesco happy they’re hardly going to give our plans a clear lane in the summer for fear of the precedent being set for the future.
I think the new stadium is sufficiently far away and isn't likely to be tall enough to cause an issue persoanally.

I think they'll be more concerned with skyscrapers and the like.
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February 16, 2018, 10:02:23 PM
Reply #3007
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Ross


I think the new stadium is sufficiently far away and isn't likely to be tall enough to cause an issue persoanally.

I think they'll be more concerned with skyscrapers and the like.

Not sure the distance matters but I agree it’s likely to effect other designs more.

I just can’t see what was already going to be a difficult applicant being greenlit while new parameters are being drawn up, and given how quick governmental departments work I doubt these new guidelines will be in place for the summer when we’re due to submit our application.
There are only two things I can't stand in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures... and the Dutch.

February 16, 2018, 10:38:04 PM
Reply #3008
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MmmBlueRamirez


Who’d of thought that UNESCO was also infiltrated by kopites. Bastards are like cockroaches.
Farming Karma like the Dalai Llama

February 16, 2018, 11:27:18 PM
Reply #3009
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van der Meyde


Not sure the distance matters but I agree it’s likely to effect other designs more.

I just can’t see what was already going to be a difficult applicant being greenlit while new parameters are being drawn up, and given how quick governmental departments work I doubt these new guidelines will be in place for the summer when we’re due to submit our application.
It wouldn't in terms of still having to work around the dock wall, the clock and the docks.

I think a lot of concerns are around having sky scrapers near the Three Graces though, so being right at the end of the development that's less of an issue. The complaints aren't wholly about building there - unlike Mick I think heritage bodies understand the need for development ;) - but the nature of what's being built there isn't wholly at peace with its environs.
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February 17, 2018, 03:58:32 AM
Reply #3010
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Mick 1995

NSNO Subscriber
Oh, this one is all UNESCO and they couldn't give a flying fuck about development.

Their concern is literally (and I'm paraphrasing here like, but close) Liverpool waters would "draw the eye" north along the skyline away from the current main feature.

CABE and EH are the guys that gutted the original LW scheme by having them reduce all of the building height and frequency of the top two areas due to an old dockwall 20foot below ground. In case anybody wanted to dig it up and look at it in situ in the future.

February 17, 2018, 06:35:47 PM
Reply #3011
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van der Meyde


Oh, this one is all UNESCO and they couldn't give a flying fuck about development.

Their concern is literally (and I'm paraphrasing here like, but close) Liverpool waters would "draw the eye" north along the skyline away from the current main feature.

CABE and EH are the guys that gutted the original LW scheme by having them reduce all of the building height and frequency of the top two areas due to an old dockwall 20foot below ground. In case anybody wanted to dig it up and look at it in situ in the future.
Oh, well in that case, fuck them. :)

Dresden's domestic tourism fell 5% in 2015 vs 2008, but overall visitor numbers have continued to rise and so has tourism revenue.
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February 19, 2018, 05:33:49 AM
Reply #3012
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Ari


Is someone in here considering buying a pub near Bramley-Moore Dock... now is the time...

February 19, 2018, 05:48:16 AM
Reply #3013
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Alanvideo


Is someone in here considering buying a pub near Bramley-Moore Dock... now is the time...
................I would guess every derelict pub or building within a mile radius will have been 'claimed ' by now.
We are special ,we are Everton.

February 19, 2018, 03:00:28 PM
Reply #3014
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Bally

Administrator
................I would guess every derelict pub or building within a mile radius will have been 'claimed ' by now.
Most of them where just closed up with  the interior still intact and I imagine they will be applying for grants to renovate them as soon as Everton put a metaphorical spade in the ground.
It's the roll I way