November 18, 2017, 05:20:24 AM

Author Topic: Everton V Stoke  (Read 13339 times)

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August 07, 2017, 03:11:02 PM
Reply #45
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Escla

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Normally I'd agree but the options arent good. And if it's a thread for what you would do then there is an argument for it rather than what will Koeman do, because it wont be Kenny.

But Martina didnt look great in the other game and Holgate while good at the defensive part really is a hindrance to our play. It isnt just poor crosses when he gets forward it is lack of belief in his forward passes in attacking areas so we end up getting it out to him in space and it breaks down with a poor cross or we get it to him with a chance to build a move forward and he comes back inside to a centre half and we lose any momentum.

I dont think any of us could see with confidence Kenny is ready to play full back in the PL and in an ideal world Coleman would have been here and we could have loaned him out without worry, but given we dont have a good option at right back it would have been nice to see a bit more of him in friendlies and maybe even the home game in the Europa.

Agree Martina didn't look great against Rumbelows but thought he was much improved yesterday and no worse than a few others,  let's give the lad a chance, it's still a new bunch of players trying to gel.

August 07, 2017, 03:18:06 PM
Reply #46
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brap2

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Or Koeman knows already what he can do at CB after being here a year so wanted him to play RB to see how he gets on against decent opposition

Holgate has played more at RB than CB surely. Has he ever played a competitive game at CB for us?
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

August 07, 2017, 03:18:52 PM
Reply #47
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GLewis

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Re Kenny, it could well be that his defending isn't up to scratch yet.

It took a Coleman loan, a stint in midfield and still quite a few mistakes that cost goals / pens before he became very dependable.

August 07, 2017, 03:53:12 PM
Reply #48
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Lxxx


I think it's nailed on that Martina will start against the grocks of Stoke. He's a bigger lad than Kenny and he'll want his height at set plays as well as when they try and arrow balls cross field to Crouch.

August 07, 2017, 04:09:02 PM
Reply #49
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pjk


Martina was a different player yesterday, in comparison to his two earlier outings. In the two earlier appearances, he looked exactly like a free signing with nowhere else to go, but luckily, he had a mate in Koeman to come and play for. After yesterday, any criticism I was building up for him has been put on the back burner. He was one of our better players, going on his performance yesterday. On a free doesn't always mean shit straight away. People need to get off the “he's shit” idea until he proves he is, or not; as the case may be.

I also liked the performance from Kenny. He looks as if he could be another youngster on the way through. (Kudos to David Unsworth, he's doing an incredible job. His results speak for themselves.)  :)

Steinbeck's maxim: “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”.

August 07, 2017, 04:19:56 PM
Reply #50
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Lxxx


Martina was a different player yesterday, in comparison to his two earlier outings. In the two earlier appearances, he looked exactly like a free signing with nowhere else to go, but luckily, he had a mate in Koeman to come and play for. After yesterday, any criticism I was building up for him has been put on the back burner. He was one of our better players, going on his performance yesterday. On a free doesn't always mean shit straight away. People need to get off the “he's shit” idea until he proves he is, or not; as the case may be.

I also liked the performance from Kenny. He looks as if he could be another youngster on the way through. (Kudos to David Unsworth, he's doing an incredible job. His results speak for themselves.)  :)



If you analyse it Kenny isn't another of our youngsters being brought through.

DCL and Lookman were bought in the last 12 months, Holgate not long before that and the rest of the talented bunch in the U-23's are all out on loan. There's only Davies who has made the leap.

Don't get me wrong Unsy has done a great job but that's not showing in terms of the 1st team, yet.

August 07, 2017, 04:24:55 PM
Reply #51
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pjk


If you analyse it Kenny isn't another of our youngsters being brought through.

DCL and Lookman were bought in the last 12 months, Holgate not long before that and the rest of the talented bunch in the U-23's are all out on loan. There's only Davies who has made the leap.

Don't get me wrong Unsy has done a great job but that's not showing in terms of the 1st team, yet.



I don't get you there mate?



Steinbeck's maxim: “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”.

August 07, 2017, 04:34:15 PM
Reply #52
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Lxxx




I don't get you there mate?





' I also liked the performance from Kenny. He looks as if he could be another youngster on the way through. (Kudos to David Unsworth, he's doing an incredible job. His results speak for themselves.) '

Contrary to what we like to think there isn't a conveyor belt of talented youngsters being nurtured through to the 1st team squad. Only Davies has been brought through the system in the past few years. That's not to say Unsy isn't doing a great job but sometimes we imagine a reality which isn't there.

August 07, 2017, 04:37:39 PM
Reply #53
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Escla

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Martina was a different player yesterday, in comparison to his two earlier outings. In the two earlier appearances, he looked exactly like a free signing with nowhere else to go, but luckily, he had a mate in Koeman to come and play for. After yesterday, any criticism I was building up for him has been put on the back burner. He was one of our better players, going on his performance yesterday. On a free doesn't always mean shit straight away. People need to get off the “he's shit” idea until he proves he is, or not; as the case may be.

I also liked the performance from Kenny. He looks as if he could be another youngster on the way through. (Kudos to David Unsworth, he's doing an incredible job. His results speak for themselves.)  :)

This says it all, post of the day for me.

August 07, 2017, 04:37:46 PM
Reply #54
Online

pjk


' I also liked the performance from Kenny. He looks as if he could be another youngster on the way through. (Kudos to David Unsworth, he's doing an incredible job. His results speak for themselves.) '

Contrary to what we like to think there isn't a conveyor belt of talented youngsters being nurtured through to the 1st team squad. Only Davies has been brought through the system in the past few years. That's not to say Unsy isn't doing a great job but sometimes we imagine a reality which isn't there.



If you analyse it Kenny isn't another of our youngsters being brought through.




I did a quick analysis of it and .... Well yeah, he is!
Steinbeck's maxim: “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”.

August 07, 2017, 04:40:49 PM
Reply #55
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Lxxx



If you analyse it Kenny isn't another of our youngsters being brought through.




I did a quick analysis of it and .... Well yeah, he is!

As you were then.

August 07, 2017, 04:42:58 PM
Reply #56
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pjk


As you were then.



So you agree with me. He is another one of our youngster's coming through?
Steinbeck's maxim: “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”.

August 07, 2017, 05:05:10 PM
Reply #57
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GLewis

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So you agree with me. He is another one of our youngster's coming through?

He means that in terms of players that have come through our academy from say, u11 level, there's only Davies that's done it recently.

The others, Holgate, DCL, Lookman have all been signed from other teams having played professional games for those teams.

As yet, Kenny, Dowell etc haven't actually broken through so if we're judging our academy on player development we've had 1 player through (recently). Which isn't a long list.

August 07, 2017, 05:52:31 PM
Reply #58
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blargins

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He's got to start somewhere? Consistent and level headed lad, captain of league winning U23. Sure, it would be a challenge for him, but faith in youth seems to be working well for us lately. Otherwise it's wait for league cup against lower league team, or a dead rubber Europa group game? I think he's earned a chance. I suspect Koeman is weighing it up against Martina and whoever this defensive utility man will be. For Kenny, Coleman being injured is the best chance he'll get for several years. So why not Stoke at home?

So start him in pre-season friendlies where the results don't matter. The fact he hasn't played a single game says he's not considered good enough for first team action yet.
"All the adversity I've had in my life, all my troubles and obstacles, have strengthened me... You may not realize it when it happens, but a kick in the teeth may be the best thing in the world for you."
- Walt Disney

August 07, 2017, 06:03:25 PM
Reply #59
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Lxxx


He looks a confident boy and if we didn't have the run of games we have at the start maybe Koeman would be a little more inclined to see if he could sink or swim. As it is if he gets roasted by Sane, Hazard, Rashford and Eriksen all in his first few games at the top level we might never see him again. I think Koeman is wise to ease him in and play him selectively.