December 11, 2017, 08:19:26 AM

Poll

What should we do? (RESET 29 SEPTEMBER, AFTER LIMASSOL GAME)

Fire him now before our season goes tits up
Give him till Christmas.. If performances and results aren't where they should be for what he's spent, he's out
Let's just see how things are at the end of the season
The season has barely begun, he's a great manager and we should get 100% behind him
Ohhh Davey Moyes, Davey Davey Davey Moyes...
Fuck off with your polls, you cunt

Author Topic: Should we sack Koeman?  (Read 61767 times)

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September 30, 2017, 01:49:10 AM
Reply #870
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SANA_DR0


thread reset, same answer.. Davey Davey Moyesss. least he had a game plan when we played fucking shit, least if we where playing shit, the players where 110% committed, thus we stole lots of 1-0's.

if we cant play football, and the performances are wank, least instill some pride in your team, have a game plan, sneak 1-0s.

i guess we're supposed to be proud/happy that Koeman said that if we won 2-1 last night, it would be different, we where playing the equivalent of Sunderland. if not the Sunderland reserve team.

This was the easiest match of all the 4 home games in a row, the opposition knew we where fucking shit and attacked us from the first minute, oh Davey Moyes oh David Moyes...

Now we're shitting ourselves cos we have Burnley, and we're going to play the same negative formation that invites the opposition to attack us, wish to the god i dont believe in that we finally play 2 strikers and atleast 1 winger from the start.
drop Rooney and Klaassen, play our record signing! let him have some room to operate in.
Unsworth has a 100% League record at home
Norwich 3-0 15th May 2016
Watford 3-2 5th Nov 2017
West Ham 4-0 29th Nov 2017
To Be Continued.....

deCoubertin

September 30, 2017, 01:50:16 AM
Reply #871
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bacon sarnie


Is he still here?

September 30, 2017, 01:50:57 AM
Reply #872
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Ell Capitan

NSNO Subscriber
I just reset the poll for this thread... Be interesting to see how the mood has changed.

For the record, final results were 70 for giving him to the end of the season, 37 each for Christmas and he's a great manager, 19 to fire him now and 13 for the big D.


September 30, 2017, 02:10:57 AM
Reply #873
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Ravardo


Ive gone from the wait until xmas too hooray its xmas fuck off

September 30, 2017, 02:14:22 AM
Reply #874
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wepull


Well there are a lot of things which are going wrong with us currently but I genuinely believe we have a much better squad than last year. Our options from the bench even with so many players injured are far better than I can remember in the last 15 years and we can surely build from there.

My main issue with Koeman(i.e. ignoring our current slump) is that I genuinely don't remember us playing free flowing football under him. Even last year when we were winning matches, I never really saw any kind of attractiveness in our play. Martinez' first season and Moyes' last few seasons in parts we played really good football and were really pleasing to see. Even his Southampton side was a bit dull compared to that of Pochettino. I am not sure Koeman knows how to build a team which plays attractive football and when you are trying to enter the top 6, you would want your team to be actually have the ability to dismantle the opposite team with brilliant plays.

September 30, 2017, 02:14:54 AM
Reply #875
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brap2

NSNO Subscriber
Give Koeman more time to fashion something out of this group of players? Okay, fine.

But give Koeman more money to spend? He can get fucked if that's his only answer.

The squad is far from perfect but there's a competent eleven in there. If he really wants this job, he needs to work harder to find it.

What? Are you happy with this eleven are you?
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.


September 30, 2017, 02:27:24 AM
Reply #876
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Hawkandro


I would hope a team that consists of the former Wales captain, the former United and England captain, the former Burnley captain, two former Swansea captains and the former captain of Ajax would offer more fight and leadership. That is the most worrying aspect, that we are still as soft as we appeared under Martinez.
Yes, we're being condescending. Yes, that means we're talking down to you.

September 30, 2017, 02:31:10 AM
Reply #877
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KoemansNumberTens


I think the problem his is that he probably deserves til the end of the season. He probably has earned the right to fail before we sack him. However I'm not sure I'd trust him with another penny. So how can he continue

September 30, 2017, 02:32:08 AM
Reply #878
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Realist


I think the problem his is that he probably deserves til the end of the season. He probably has earned the right to fail before we sack him. However I'm not sure I'd trust him with another penny. So how can he continue

Can I use cash out on our bet?

September 30, 2017, 02:37:27 AM
Reply #879
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SANA_DR0


End of the season is way to long for me, especially if get even worse/dont improve... and atm. there are no signs of improvement. Genuinly thought he may have learn his lessons in playing the players/formation that he has been doing..

hypothetically speaking.. end of season we do shit...Koeman leaves, gets new job,  Everton would be in turmoil... (not sure which division we would be in either.. only Palace have been poorer than us this season in the prem.)
Unsworth has a 100% League record at home
Norwich 3-0 15th May 2016
Watford 3-2 5th Nov 2017
West Ham 4-0 29th Nov 2017
To Be Continued.....

September 30, 2017, 02:47:25 AM
Reply #880
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KoemansNumberTens


Can I use cash out on our bet?

Of course. You owe me 80 quid. When can I get it?

September 30, 2017, 02:48:09 AM
Reply #881
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van der Meyde


To be fair I feel like I've outlined them quite clearly above.

I thought we undersold and overbought. I thought the recruitment was poor and as I've said before I'd like a smarter man than me to look at the historical results of sides who've sold their best striker for thirty years, sides who've had wholesale changes and sides who have been trying to take a step up in level with such fierce competition. A cursory glance at milans season so far doesn't dissuade me that these are all factors.
That would be the Milan who have 12 points from 6 games in the league and are top of their Europa group with a 5 point gap to 3rd, would it? :)

This caught my interest on a good day though, so I've spent a bit of time having a look at how your points total and goal difference varies with both number of players brought in and for those that lost an important attacker. The big caveat is that the search methodology used to collate examples would never pass peer review for publication.

There are also many limitations to this kind of analysis, which is why it's not really done. How do you rigorously account for confounding factors? Is the amount actually spent important when assessing this, probably but when heavy inflation is involved there's not a simple way to account for that. I've limited this to summer transfer windows and the first 6 games of the season through laziness; you'd hope that factors like fixture difficulty and transfers late in the transfer window will average out, but it's not easy to test for that. This data is over a number of different leagues, how does average league strength affect the results? How

All that said, here's a load of useless stats!

In this dataset, 23 teams signed 6 or more players (average of 8) in the transfer window, with 12 of these teams losing at least one star attacking player. The median finishing position the season before was 7th and after 6 games, the average number of points was 10.8 with a goal difference of +3.08. There was no relationship between number of players signed and points total, but there was a weak correlation (r = -0.37 for the maths nerds) between number of players signed and goal difference, with teams that signed more players having a slightly worse goal difference.

Here's a graph showing all that crap...



So, we might be a bit below average, but 4 other teams have picked up 7 points or less in this small group of teams. Brendan Rodgers was sacked in 2014/15 with Liverpool on 7 points, going on to finish 6th; the next season Koeman's Southampton had 6 points from the first 6 games, but went on to finish 6th. Sevilla went on to finish 5th and 7th after their poor starts.

For wider context, after 6 games, the average team will have picked up 8.3 points after 6 games. So given the games we've played, we're not really that far behind in terms of points given our fixtures.

The other main question is how other teams have done after losing a key attacker. The average number of points for a team that's not established in the top 4 and has lost a key attacker (n=12) is 9.5 with a goal difference of around 2. There's a stronger relationship between goal difference and number of players signed (r = -0.56; -0.70 if you exclude us this season).



As I said before, there are many limiting factors to any kind of analysis along these lines. Even then, it probably does indicate that we should be more considerate of the situation.

I can't really say it's changed my mind on Koeman though personally. It's more about the process than the results for me. :)

(Oh, and if anybody wants to look at the teams I included in all this, the spreadsheet is here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B0ZHi3fNbv1TTUNPdk0zTmtMbWM)
« Last Edit: September 30, 2017, 02:52:11 AM by van der Meyde »
...

September 30, 2017, 02:59:56 AM
Reply #882
Offline

plumber


That would be the Milan who have 12 points from 6 games in the league and are top of their Europa group with a 5 point gap to 3rd, would it? :)

This caught my interest on a good day though, so I've spent a bit of time having a look at how your points total and goal difference varies with both number of players brought in and for those that lost an important attacker. The big caveat is that the search methodology used to collate examples would never pass peer review for publication.

There are also many limitations to this kind of analysis, which is why it's not really done. How do you rigorously account for confounding factors? Is the amount actually spent important when assessing this, probably but when heavy inflation is involved there's not a simple way to account for that. I've limited this to summer transfer windows and the first 6 games of the season through laziness; you'd hope that factors like fixture difficulty and transfers late in the transfer window will average out, but it's not easy to test for that. This data is over a number of different leagues, how does average league strength affect the results? How

All that said, here's a load of useless stats!

In this dataset, 23 teams signed 6 or more players (average of 8) in the transfer window, with 12 of these teams losing at least one star attacking player. The median finishing position the season before was 7th and after 6 games, the average number of points was 10.8 with a goal difference of +3.08. There was no relationship between number of players signed and points total, but there was a weak correlation (r = -0.37 for the maths nerds) between number of players signed and goal difference, with teams that signed more players having a slightly worse goal difference.

Here's a graph showing all that crap...



So, we might be a bit below average, but 4 other teams have picked up 7 points or less in this small group of teams. Brendan Rodgers was sacked in 2014/15 with Liverpool on 7 points, going on to finish 6th; the next season Koeman's Southampton had 6 points from the first 6 games, but went on to finish 6th. Sevilla went on to finish 5th and 7th after their poor starts.

For wider context, after 6 games, the average team will have picked up 8.3 points after 6 games. So given the games we've played, we're not really that far behind in terms of points given our fixtures.

The other main question is how other teams have done after losing a key attacker. The average number of points for a team that's not established in the top 4 and has lost a key attacker (n=12) is 9.5 with a goal difference of around 2. There's a stronger relationship between goal difference and number of players signed (r = -0.56; -0.70 if you exclude us this season).



As I said before, there are many limiting factors to any kind of analysis along these lines. Even then, it probably does indicate that we should be more considerate of the situation.

I can't really say it's changed my mind on Koeman though personally. It's more about the process than the results for me. :)

(Oh, and if anybody wants to look at the teams I included in all this, the spreadsheet is here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B0ZHi3fNbv1TTUNPdk0zTmtMbWM)

I think you should try to find a girlfriend.

September 30, 2017, 03:02:25 AM
Reply #883
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van der Meyde


I think you should try to find a girlfriend.
My wife's at work and I'm bored. :)
...

September 30, 2017, 03:25:18 AM
Reply #884
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BlueForYou


Get 100% behind him and he'll become a great manager
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Harry Catterick