October 23, 2019, 01:58:31 AM

Author Topic: Ashley Williams  (Read 19703 times)

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October 10, 2017, 07:37:35 PM
Read 19703 times


Jags is still better and should be a starter with Keane for me. However when we have 3 games in a week Koeman doesnt seem to want to play Jags or Williams in all the games he has tended to take them both out for 1 game in the week. So while we have the Europa, and league cup for one game at least...I'd imagine we will see Jags and Williams rotating over the next couple of months with Keane being a constant and occasionally all 3 if he goes 3 at the back.

October 11, 2017, 01:01:51 AM
Reply #1


How do you find out if an 18 year old is good/not good enough to play in the Premiership?

If you don't play them at 18 just because of their age, ie, they are good enough - that is discrimination

Racism was mentioned on another topic and like age, sex, religion and disability, is a protected characteristic

We don't as fans know or find out because we don't see them for hours every day on the training field. I've no idea if he is good enough or not, but there will be plenty of people watching him and the others every day who see what he is good at, what he isn't, what areas he can develop and also what his attitude is like, what personality is and how someone him or any other youngster might cope physically and mentally with playing top level football at a young age.

There is a huge amount to consider about when a player is ready to play top level football. And that's before the fact that centre half outside of keeper is probably the hardest position for a young player to come in because you can't bring them off the bench to ease them in, and the mistakes that get made costs games so it's harsh for them to come into and it's hard for managers when jobs are on the line to do it.

Stones was an anomaly to be as good as he was at 19, despite how people's views seemed to drop on him later in his time with us he was and still is a world class talent in that position. It's easy for us as fans to just say play a young player because if they play badly, affects them mentally, loses us games, hinders their chance of a successful career because they aren't ready there is nothing on the line for us making that call but there is for the manager, player and staff but they have the best view because of working with them over a long period of time.
« Last Edit: October 11, 2017, 01:02:52 AM by Rhys »

October 11, 2017, 04:11:25 AM
Reply #2


Typical of your posts you are stating the obvious ,sorry ,not so obvious is the fact that lots of players start their first team careers at 16/17 ,just lower down in the leagues .Tom Davies is barely older than him but that is fine -If he is good enough he is old enough -the only way to find out is to play him .The comment about the training ground giving the management all they need to know is wrong ,no one can be sure until they have to do it on the pitch .

But thats a myth that you dont know what they can do until they play, we dont know because thats where we get to see them. If we could see them in training every day we would have a much better idea of if a young player was ready and I'm sure there are plenty of the u23 squad we could look at and say that player isnt good enough/ready to play for the first team without them getting first team minutes. There is a massive clamour for Lookman to play, if we saw him train and not look ready there might be more of a feeling that he isnt good enough yet. (theoretical if that is the reason why he isnt playing of course..) And that is before you look at what they are doing in u23 games themselves.

There is an element of you dont know for sure and people might surprise you when they get picked, as I'm sure Davies surprised Koeman when he got his chance last year. But you are implying the only way of knowing if a young player is ready is by playing them, which is wrong.

Also how many players play in the premier league 16/17? It is very rare that players get played at that age because they need to physically able to cope as much as anything. Plus the point about Davies as I said it is easier for managers to use young players in midfield or attack than it is at centre half as shown by Davies coming off the bench a fair bit before getting the regular spot he did last season. At centre half you dont get those opportunities to get some minutes, impress and eventually get a chance to start some games.

And the point about plenty of 16-17 in the lower leagues, probably easier to loan him out and get some league experience rather than just throw him into the premier league in a tough position. You see people like Galloway who is of a decent level gets loaned out to the championship rather than stick him and see how he does here.