January 18, 2018, 12:22:33 PM

Author Topic: The big man, the boss; Big Sam  (Read 34438 times)

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December 24, 2017, 03:19:07 PM
Reply #525
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ajax_andy


I can tell you now, I'll slaughter him.

Which a lot of fans seem to do in his 2nd season in charge of a club which makes me think there's a larger chance than not of him still playing that way next year.

Time will tell, he's doing great so far but he'll need to find a way of being effective against the better teams that isn't parking the bus and hoping to grind out a nil nil

deCoubertin

December 24, 2017, 03:30:35 PM
Reply #526
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pjk


I think in order to keep the job past this season he will need to show signs of better football. But for now, a blueprint of beating all the shit teams and being solid and getting a point against the top 6 sides will be surprisingly effective at rocketing us up the table

Sam deserves the benefit of the doubt for now due to the sheer amount of games we’ve had in such a short space of time, the appalling form we had going into his appointment, the amount of injuries we have, the individual form of big chunks of the squad and the total lack of shape and defensive organisation we had prior to his apppointment

At the moment we really couldn’t have played open attacking football and beaten Liverpool away and Chelsea at home. A point was good in both games given how often we’ve had a spanking at Anfield in recent years and how good the champions form has been in the last 10 matches

If Sam steers us to 7th and the team is more solid, with lots of young players having gained valuable first team minutes, then I think he’s done a good job.

We will need to see better football if he’s to take the job beyond next season though



This is what's got me baffled, as to the reactions to a 1-1 at Anfield and a 0-0 at home to Chelsea. We beat the other four teams fairly and squarely. No hammering away to the other lot and no mauling against Chelsea like we took against Arsenal 5-2 at home. Once again, everyone has the answers, but they're not taking home 6 million quid a year for putting it right. Sam Allardyce despite his shortcomings, is doing exactly what he was recruited to do. When, or if, we start taking unacceptable beatings this Forum is going to light up like the proverbial Christmas tree. Or, would that be more like Dante's Inferno. :)
Steinbeck's maxim: “Socialism never took root in America because the poor see themselves not as an exploited proletariat but as temporarily embarrassed millionaires.”.

December 24, 2017, 03:30:53 PM
Reply #527
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Bluedylan


Which a lot of fans seem to do in his 2nd season in charge of a club which makes me think there's a larger chance than not of him still playing that way next year.

Time will tell, he's doing great so far but he'll need to find a way of being effective against the better teams that isn't parking the bus and hoping to grind out a nil nil

Yep, I think that's fair. It's probably where some of the disagreements are coming from.

Of course he's done well so far and you'd have to be a madman or a liar not to acknowledge that.

But some of us are projecting the situation forward (maybe unfairly) and wondering how the situation might look in a year's time and wondering if the pattern of some of his previous clubs might be repeated.

He's making the right noises about improving the football, which is good. One thing saying it like, and another thing coaching it. Koeman often said it and was getting progressively further away from it.

A counter argument is that he hasn't had the finances to play better football until now, which is valid. Time will tell, and he clearly realised that this is his big chance and that we will want more than West Ham or Palace fans in both style and substance, and Moshiri will want more himself.

We'll see.
Jeff: That's not the way to win.
Kathie: Is there a way to win?
Jeff: There's a way to lose more slowly.


December 24, 2017, 03:35:46 PM
Reply #528
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Simon Paul

Administrator
He's here until the end of his contract unless we get relegated, which we won't this season

We may even qualify for Europa League next season (even this at a push) but that's when the test comes

We made the mistake of believing Moyes was good enough to take us beyond UEFA Cup football. We should say thanks to Allardyce and move on in 18 months.

He will be 65 and - in the past - at that stage the club would be offering silly length contracts to make him stay, like we did Moyes and Martinez.

We would be more attractive to better, younger managers with a different approach to the game then.

We sunk to a point where we were desperate for a manager who had never been anywhere bigger than Newcastle, we need to bounce back from that ASAP. We've started the first part with the points.

Let's not get complacent and give a pensioner a five year deal and end up treading water as we head towards the docks - we want to be in a speedboat, not water wings.

December 24, 2017, 04:28:34 PM
Reply #529
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van der Meyde


I believe that the best way for us to be a successful team, long term, is to be able to play football and control games and periods in games. Hoofball will get us to 7th fairly easily every season, but it's very unlikely to take us any higher than that (imo).

(Took me ages to get around to finish typing this up, but now everyone's already said basically the same thing... still posting it though. :))

I think this is pretty much the only explanation that gets me nodding along with the need to play a bit better.

In the main, I get my entertainment from the results. Two hours after the match, I don't care about the style if we've got a result. If we've lost though, the negativity stays with me for days (and this is only compounded by Twitter and messageboards).

Long term though, @Bluedylan is right, we will be in a much better position to compete for honours if we can keep the ball better in games like yesterday and away from home.

We restricted Chelsea and Liverpool to, in the main, pot shots. But they had so many of them that when they did beat Pickford we relied on them being cleared off the line or not hitting the target. You play those games over 10 times it's almost a coin flip on whether we lose or draw. The chances of us winning them are minimal.

I do think Allardyce has taken a reasonable course so far though. The fragility around the team - and around the crowd - was toxic.

Now we've become more solid, I'm hoping there'll be small improvements over the next couple of months and I'm hoping that will come with increased confidence too. I don't think drastic changes are needed personally either.

Pickford had plenty of opportunities for him to roll the ball out quickly to defenders  rather than launch it yesterday, but he didn't trust them not to lose it. As Schneiderlin becomes more positive, hopefully that will feed through to the rest. The centre halves who will play it to him, rather than Pickford etc.

A few small improvements like that will probably see us do a lot better as we have a lot of decent footballers. Hopefully Allardyce can implement them soon enough.
...

December 24, 2017, 04:55:43 PM
Reply #530
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BlueBeagle


He's here until the end of his contract unless we get relegated, which we won't this season

We may even qualify for Europa League next season (even this at a push) but that's when the test comes

We made the mistake of believing Moyes was good enough to take us beyond UEFA Cup football. We should say thanks to Allardyce and move on in 18 months.

He will be 65 and - in the past - at that stage the club would be offering silly length contracts to make him stay, like we did Moyes and Martinez.

We would be more attractive to better, younger managers with a different approach to the game then.

We sunk to a point where we were desperate for a manager who had never been anywhere bigger than Newcastle, we need to bounce back from that ASAP. We've started the first part with the points.

Let's not get complacent and give a pensioner a five year deal and end up treading water as we head towards the docks - we want to be in a speedboat, not water wings.

So no matter how he does in the next 18 months, we fuck him off because he's 65 and we're moving to a new stadium at some point?


December 24, 2017, 05:05:29 PM
Reply #531
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Simon Paul

Administrator
So no matter how he does in the next 18 months, we fuck him off because he's 65 and we're moving to a new stadium at some point?

And because to be a top six side you don't have Sam allardyce as manager

December 24, 2017, 05:07:53 PM
Reply #532
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blargins

NSNO Subscriber
And because to be a top six side you don't have Sam allardyce as manager
What happens if he has us finishing fifth next season?
"Life shrinks or expands in proportion to one's courage." Anais Nin

December 24, 2017, 05:08:37 PM
Reply #533
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Simon Paul

Administrator
What happens if he has us finishing fifth next season?

We say thanks and get someone in who can get us higher more frequently. Moyes had us to fourth once.

December 24, 2017, 05:12:07 PM
Reply #534
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eyesalwaysblue


Christmas Sprouts....Big Sam blanches his the day before, drains them and pops them in the fridge overnight, then just before the big big meal he fries them in butter with bacon bits and a smidge of black pepper. Big Sam says "even the under 21s will eat these mothers"    Merry christmas Big Sam.
I still despise Clive Thomas..

December 24, 2017, 05:15:02 PM
Reply #535
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Lxxx


And because to be a top six side you don't have Sam allardyce as manager

He's never had a crack at the top 6 in his career so he can't be judged on his inability to crack it until such a time. I was very sceptical about his appointment, more so because of how I perceive him as a person than his ability as a manager but to be fair I'll judge now as I find and so far I can't knock him.

You've been critical of Moyes, Koeman and now Allardyce on here with only our worst manager in the last decade, Martinez, being spared. I find that quite strange.   

December 24, 2017, 05:15:33 PM
Reply #536
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KoemansNumberTens


We say thanks and get someone in who can get us higher more frequently. Moyes had us to fourth once.

More frequently than once in 1 full season? That's a big ask

December 24, 2017, 05:18:02 PM
Reply #537
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Mayor Farnum


I think we may be underestimating the strength of the top six and overestimating our ability to attract the type of players capable of delivering top six.

December 24, 2017, 05:22:22 PM
Reply #538
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eyesalwaysblue


I think we may be underestimating the strength of the top six and overestimating our ability to attract the type of players capable of delivering top six.
In the words of the great Steven Fry former lead singer with ABC "lower your sights but raise your aim"
I still despise Clive Thomas..

December 24, 2017, 05:31:18 PM
Reply #539
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Simon Paul

Administrator
He's never had a crack at the top 6 in his career so he can't be judged on his inability to crack it until such a time. I was very sceptical about his appointment, more so because of how I perceive him as a person than his ability as a manager but to be fair I'll judge now as I find and so far I can't knock him.

You've been critical of Moyes, Koeman and now Allardyce on here with only our worst manager in the last decade, Martinez, being spared. I find that quite strange.

You've missed my posts where I say we played attacking football but got webbed under him then. I find it quite strange that you would purposely ignore that post which was among the others you've clearly read.