October 17, 2019, 10:05:25 PM

Author Topic: Silva’s Playbook  (Read 126856 times)

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February 13, 2019, 11:39:40 PM
Reply #1620
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Martip



Sure, you can. The midfield looks entirely different with Davies in the team, giving the other midfielders another option off the ball.
Personally I think people are over egging what Tom has brought to the table mainly as their frustration in Sig has come to the boil. From what I've seen he's a busy little player but certainly shouldn't be in the side over Sig....I know others disagree but I've not seen the shining light over the last 3 losses.

While we are on the subject of Tom, although I 've nothing against the lad,  I 've got to say I'm not a big fan of giving the captaincy to a youngster who has yet to hold down a first team spot. Feels like we have given the privledge  away too cheaply and it really should be earned by performances on the pitch.



« Last Edit: February 13, 2019, 11:49:23 PM by Martip »


February 14, 2019, 12:13:08 AM
Reply #1621
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brap2

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Just looking at numbers is how Steve Walsh and Koeman functioned, and we saw how that went.

They were looking at the wrong numbers.
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

February 14, 2019, 02:08:52 AM
Reply #1622
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eyesalwaysblue


Personally I think people are over egging what Tom has brought to the table mainly as their frustration in Sig has come to the boil. From what I've seen he's a busy little player but certainly shouldn't be in the side over Sig....I know others disagree but I've not seen the shining light over the last 3 losses.

While we are on the subject of Tom, although I 've nothing against the lad,  I 've got to say I'm not a big fan of giving the captaincy to a youngster who has yet to hold down a first team spot. Feels like we have given the privledge  away too cheaply and it really should be earned by performances on the pitch.




Maybe Davies should have been included way before he was, might be the best of a bad bunch as an alternative but he's had shite as managers and is still only 20
I still despise Clive Thomas..


February 14, 2019, 02:56:06 AM
Reply #1623
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Silas

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Bernard is sound, Sigurddsson is sound and Davies is sound we need to be looking at how these players thrive as they should all have a role to play but we aren't utilising any of them particularly well

February 14, 2019, 03:47:40 AM
Reply #1624
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bluenuck


Bernard is sound, Sigurddsson is sound and Davies is sound we need to be looking at how these players thrive as they should all have a role to play but we aren't utilising any of them particularly well

He's utilizing none of them well. This is the biggest problem.

We could put David Silva in our team and he would have zero attempted thru balls because none of our forwards make runs in behind the defense. They stand there like statues. I don't know if this is how they are told to play, or if this is just how they play...

The question is, is if You give Sig a front three just close to as good as Salah Mane and Firmino will he get them the ball???

February 14, 2019, 03:50:56 AM
Reply #1625
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KoemansNumberTens


He's utilizing none of them well. This is the biggest problem.

We could put David Silva in our team and he would have zero attempted thru balls because none of our forwards make runs in behind the defense. They stand there like statues. I don't know if this is how they are told to play, or if this is just how they play...

The question is, is if You give Sig a front three just close to as good as Salah Mane and Firmino will he get them the ball???


He doesn’t get on the ball enough. Doesn’t make enough passes. It would be the same in any team. He’s always gonna be behind what would be good for a playmaker in that team


February 14, 2019, 04:11:26 AM
Reply #1626
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brap2

NSNO Subscriber
He's utilizing none of them well. This is the biggest problem.

We could put David Silva in our team and he would have zero attempted thru balls because none of our forwards make runs in behind the defense. They stand there like statues. I don't know if this is how they are told to play, or if this is just how they play...

The question is, is if You give Sig a front three just close to as good as Salah Mane and Firmino will he get them the ball???


No!

His *volume* of good passing isn't enough as a player.

He is the supposed to be the supply line, if you put better players ahead of him, all you do is reduce their volume of their supply.

His quality is good, and he backs that up (usually) with good quality from set pieces, but not enough to make up for the deficiency in volume.
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

February 14, 2019, 04:15:00 AM
Reply #1627
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bluenuck


No!

His *volume* of good passing isn't enough as a player.

He is the supposed to be the supply line, if you put better players ahead of him, all you do is reduce their volume of their supply.

His quality is good, and he backs that up (usually) with good quality from set pieces, but not enough to make up for the deficiency in volume.

Is there a stat that shows players' "runs"? Or "runs in behind defense"?

I get the criticism that he doesn't get on the ball enough, and that that would effect the general Volume of passing from him. But the volume of good passing would be effected by our forwards standing around doing nothing when he actually does get the ball. No?

If everyone is standing around when he's on the ball he's gonna try for a worldy or pass it back or sideways.

February 14, 2019, 04:32:50 AM
Reply #1628
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brap2

NSNO Subscriber
Is there a stat that shows players' "runs"? Or "runs in behind defense"?

I get the criticism that he doesn't get on the ball enough, and that that would effect the general Volume of passing from him. But the volume of good passing would be effected by our forwards standing around doing nothing when he actually does get the ball. No?

If everyone is standing around when he's on the ball he's gonna try for a worldy or pass it back or sideways.

There may well be something like that but I don't know it I don't think.

If I had to make an argument, I would say can we confer that from other stuff?

How are his volumes at other clubs?

How are his volumes at us but with different combinations of players?

How are the volumes of other players at our club? How do they change with different combinations of players ahead of them?

How do players of similar quality clubs with similar quality forward players get on, volume wise?

I can't give you the answers to all of that, but I'd be fairly confident in putting a wager on most of them.
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

February 14, 2019, 05:33:29 AM
Reply #1629
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van der Meyde


It's probably worth bearing in mind that a lack of involvement in games isn't specific to Sigurdsson. Richarlison and Walcott touch the ball even less.

This isn't (just) because of our style or forwards either - their passing numbers elsewhere is fairly similar.

As ever it comes down to squad/team building. You can carry one or two of these players - Son isn't all that involved for Spurs, relatively speaking; neither are Salah and Mane. You can't carry all three of them at once though, which is what we've regularly been doing this season.

God knows what the solution is, mind. Realistically the only way we're going to get more of a foothold on the ball is by either playing an extra man in midfield (Davies) or by starting Lookman/Bernard who get more involved - yet still not really enough to compensate.
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 05:59:12 AM by van der Meyde »
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February 14, 2019, 01:02:09 PM
Reply #1630
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brap2

NSNO Subscriber
The deeper the red block, the worse against league average we are.

The deeper blue the block, the better against league average we are.

In the offense one, look at those nice big oceans of red in the middle of the pitch for touches, penetrative passing and chance creation.

On the defensive one, it basically says our press is really ineffective Vs league average, and that we are bad at stopping chances being created from some of the most dangerous areas on the pitch.

Source : https://tacticsplatform.com/2019/02/13/scouting-offense-characteristics-of-european-teams/ (offensive only, got the defensive one from a tweet by @toffeeanalysis quoting original author as @tacticsplatform)
« Last Edit: February 14, 2019, 01:08:49 PM by brap2 »
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

February 14, 2019, 03:03:21 PM
Reply #1631
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sam of the south


The deeper the red block, the worse against league average we are.

The deeper blue the block, the better against league average we are.

In the offense one, look at those nice big oceans of red in the middle of the pitch for touches, penetrative passing and chance creation.

On the defensive one, it basically says our press is really ineffective Vs league average, and that we are bad at stopping chances being created from some of the most dangerous areas on the pitch.

Source : https://tacticsplatform.com/2019/02/13/scouting-offense-characteristics-of-european-teams/ (offensive only, got the defensive one from a tweet by @toffeeanalysis quoting original author as @tacticsplatform)

So what are the main reasons for these stats, do you think? Does it go back to lacking enough cover in CM to stop the opposition slicing through the middle, and lacking an ACM that gets on the ball enough?
“I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately, to front only the essential facts of life, and see if I could not learn what it had to teach, and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived.”
Henry David Thoreau

February 14, 2019, 03:54:40 PM
Reply #1632
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brap2

NSNO Subscriber
So what are the main reasons for these stats, do you think? Does it go back to lacking enough cover in CM to stop the opposition slicing through the middle, and lacking an ACM that gets on the ball enough?

Fuck knows, quite advanced stuff this isn't it haha. I'm sure there's good stuff about us there too, but when you compare our heat maps to heat maps of teams that are doing well it is a marked difference.

Defensively speaking, I'd want to avoid blaming individual players (although the space around Keane/Coleman does catch your eye a bit) because a lot of defense stuff is passive and about shape and stuff...

Offensively though you are right that it's just a fact we aren't having the enough of the ball in key areas. We have absolutely zero build up in the middle - now this is definitely a feature of Silva's football but it also says that we don't have an alternative to just giving it to Digne and hoping he picks someone out in the box, or giving it to Digne and hoping he can run 30 yards up the pitch.

'Show them to the outside' - no need gaffer they refuse to do anything else.
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

February 15, 2019, 09:46:35 PM
Reply #1633
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blue1948


No!

His *volume* of good passing isn't enough as a player.

He is the supposed to be the supply line, if you put better players ahead of him, all you do is reduce their volume of their supply.

His quality is good, and he backs that up (usually) with good quality from set pieces, but not enough to make up for the deficiency in volume.

I don't think we need volume just three assists per game and we would be on a different planet.

February 16, 2019, 04:10:33 PM
Reply #1634
Online

plumber


I think Sigurdsson is getting some undeserved stick here.
He'll never be the most creative player but a half decent manager could use him much better.

Agree more or less with this:
https://royalbluemersey.sbnation.com/2019/2/11/18220123/everton-tactical-analysis-set-piece-defending-richarlison-sigurdsson-marco-silva-is-an-idiot