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NSNO Forums => The Everton Forum => Topic started by: brap2 on February 13, 2018, 02:12:06 PM

Title: How should we set up away?
Post by: brap2 on February 13, 2018, 02:12:06 PM
Itís clearly a problem for us and has been a while. Last time iI remember us being half OK away from home was Martinez was it? Think that was a team with more pace and goals on the break and wouldnít be surprised if that was the answer...

Back 5

Beni Rooney Gana (more tackles and work?)

Walcott DCL Bolasie (more pace but less guile, plenty of work from DCL and will keep the ball well?)

Donít think we can play the same way away from home and we need to find some kind of formula...
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Juanito on February 13, 2018, 02:19:04 PM
I wouldnít mind a back three but not one of slow, static hoofers with Martina as a left wing back - that was horrendous.

I remember Holgate played so well against City at Goodison last season as the right sided centre half and it looked like his best position. I would like to see;

              Pickford
       Holgate Keane  Mori
Coleman  Gana  Davies  Baines
    Walcott  Tosun  Sigurdsson

Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Shogun on February 13, 2018, 02:34:42 PM
Our best team

Pickford
Coleman CB CB LB
Rooney Gana Davies
Walcott ST Sigurdsson

Have we acatually played anything like that away from home this season?
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Juanito on February 13, 2018, 02:35:41 PM
Itís clearly a problem for us and has been a while. Last time iI remember us being half OK away from home was Martinez was it? Think that was a team with more pace and goals on the break and wouldnít be surprised if that was the answer...

Back 5

Beni Rooney Gana (more tackles and work?)

Walcott DCL Bolasie (more pace but less guile, plenty of work from DCL and will keep the ball well?)

Donít think we can play the same way away from home and we need to find some kind of formula...

I was actually thinking of this, when we used to have an effective plan....

We had Osman, Barry and McCarthy sat back as the midfield three close to Stones and Distin. Then when we break, we would have Coleman and Baines bomb on, with Lukaku, Naismith/Barkley and Mirallas up top, who would break at pace.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: TheTone on February 13, 2018, 02:48:35 PM
I think the mentality has to change first , almost beaten before we roll into any away ground these days

Not sure it's totally down to tactics and team formation

We don't have enough leaders on the field (or off it)



Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: nsno on February 13, 2018, 03:03:47 PM
4-5-1 with one very defensive midfielder and pacey hard working wide men. Sit back and soak up the pressure and catch teams on the break. We can't do this at present as the defence is crap and the midfielders have poor discipline.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: The Blue 3/4 of Liverpool on February 13, 2018, 03:08:48 PM
Aye, what NSNO says. It doesn't matter how many defenders you play, if their cohesion and understanding is shoite (like when we played Arsenal). Often you can do much better with just 2 centre backs and one defensive mid (which is my preference) and you defend from the front. The idea being that fast pacey full backs and wingers (Coleman and Walcott, for e.g.) will make the opposition defenders and wingers think "fook, Im not going too far forward, as I wont be able to get back if they break". Whereas if we have shit, slow defenders, EVERYONE in their team will attack us, knowing we are shit on the break. I would much rather have a go at a team, than sit back with a million shit defenders.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: brap2 on February 13, 2018, 03:18:02 PM
Our best team

Pickford
Coleman CB CB LB
Rooney Gana Davies
Walcott ST Sigurdsson

Have we acatually played anything like that away from home this season?

Donít think so and would like to see it, but do teams generally play the same way away from home as they do at home? Especially teams like ours that are so fragile and prone to giving up big chances.

Leicester and Palace two recent wins and Leicester hit the bar about 4 times and Benteke missed aba 3 chances for palace, and thatís at home!
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Alanvideo on February 13, 2018, 03:21:29 PM
Our away fans should get free transport to reward their loyalty.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: sam of the south on February 13, 2018, 03:33:03 PM
Itís clearly a problem for us and has been a while. Last time iI remember us being half OK away from home was Martinez was it? Think that was a team with more pace and goals on the break and wouldnít be surprised if that was the answer...

Back 5

Beni Rooney Gana (more tackles and work?)

Walcott DCL Bolasie (more pace but less guile, plenty of work from DCL and will keep the ball well?)

Donít think we can play the same way away from home and we need to find some kind of formula...

Yeah, 12 players on the pitch should do it ;)

In all seriousness, a lot will come down to mentality and confidence.

We don't have a strong team spirit at the moment (due to many factors) and obviously confidence is fragile too, so winning away will always be a tall order for a side like that.

However, you are totally on the right lines with two ball winners and a ball player in the midfield, and three speedsters up front.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: brap2 on February 13, 2018, 03:34:45 PM
Yeah, 12 players on the pitch should do it ;)

In all seriousness, a lot will come down to mentality and confidence.

We don't have a strong team spirit at the moment (due to many factors) and obviously confidence is fragile too, so winning away will always be a tall order for a side like that.

However, you are totally on the right lines with two ball winners and a ball player in the midfield, and three speedsters up front.

I havenít used 12 players, 5 at the back refers to Pickford and whatever 4 gimps we are able to put out in front of him.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Macca77 on February 13, 2018, 04:17:40 PM
Would be nice if we set up to actually try win an away game, guaranteed he will go all defensive again at Watford
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: blargins on February 13, 2018, 04:35:12 PM
Why canít we play the same way away as we do at home?
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Lxxx on February 13, 2018, 04:42:31 PM
Why can’t we play the same way away as we do at home?

I agree. Maybe the way you approach the game is a little more conservative but you want your best players in the best system playing most games home and away. Davies could be given more licence to get in the box at home but slot in into a compact three in the middle away from home. Sig might be given the opportunity to wander at home but try to stay out wide and help out Martina away.

They need to get an understanding with each other and we've tried every permutation away from home in the past 12 months with no success. Let's just try and focus on ourselves a little more and then maybe we might be able to start picking up points as we'll be playing to our strengths, instead of constantly chopping and changing our system and personnel to try and combat the likes of West Brom and Bournemouth..... and failing.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: van der Meyde on February 13, 2018, 04:48:04 PM
If we've got any ambitions of finishing 7th - though I suspect our manager/DoF will view that as a poisoned chalice - then the only way we're going to do that is if we set up to try and win the games.

On that note then, it's probably a good idea to play the midfield that's actually won us games this year.

We've done fuck all without Rooney and Davies in the side this season and while we might lose some solidity playing them away, winning one and losing one picks up more points than drawing two.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: dekko on February 13, 2018, 04:51:53 PM
I wouldnít mind a back three but not one of slow, static hoofers with Martina as a left wing back - that was horrendous.

I remember Holgate played so well against City at Goodison last season as the right sided centre half and it looked like his best position. I would like to see;

              Pickford
       Holgate Keane  Mori
Coleman  Gana  Davies  Baines
    Walcott  Tosun  Sigurdsson



Have we ever ever ever ever played well with 3 at the back?
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: gizzblue on February 13, 2018, 04:55:39 PM
I'm actually he hoping BFS  learned a lesson about not fucking with the shape and team after a win .

Here's hoping we don't revert to shithouse tactics .
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Ross on February 13, 2018, 05:00:41 PM
Donít see why it needs to be any different itís not like weíre expansive at home anyway under Allardyce.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: sam of the south on February 13, 2018, 05:12:30 PM
I havenít used 12 players, 5 at the back refers to Pickford and whatever 4 gimps we are able to put out in front of him.

Oh I see, mate.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Fynci on February 13, 2018, 05:21:53 PM
If we've got any ambitions of finishing 7th - though I suspect our manager/DoF will view that as a poisoned chalice - then the only way we're going to do that is if we set up to try and win the games.

On that note then, it's probably a good idea to play the midfield that's actually won us games this year.

We've done fuck all without Rooney and Davies in the side this season and while we might lose some solidity playing them away, winning one and losing one picks up more points than drawing two.

Have we any ambition to finish 7th? I suspect Sam would consider 10th place a job well done.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: bogie on February 13, 2018, 05:27:18 PM
Itís clearly a problem for us and has been a while. Last time iI remember us being half OK away from home was Martinez was it? Think that was a team with more pace and goals on the break and wouldnít be surprised if that was the answer...

Back 5

Beni Rooney Gana (more tackles and work?)

Walcott DCL Bolasie (more pace but less guile, plenty of work from DCL and will keep the ball well?)

Donít think we can play the same way away from home and we need to find some kind of formula...

you no after getting banned I said I would not get into it with shit calls but in the name of god man Bolasie do you watch are games at all
if we can get any money for him in the summer take it and run
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 13, 2018, 05:33:26 PM
you no after getting banned I said I would not get into it with shit calls but in the name of god man Bolasie do you watch are games at all
if we can get any money for him in the summer take it and run

"I'm not sure Bolasie is consistent enough to play him away from home where we'll be on the back foot for most of the game. Letting him run at tired defences at home is about as much as i would allow for him. He's one of the first players we should be looking at selling in the summer"

You see how it's possible to get an opinion across without denigrating somebody?
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: mikey_blue on February 13, 2018, 05:33:54 PM
                   Pickford
Coleman Holgate Keane Martina
                    Gana
              Davies Rooney
Walcott        Niasse            Sig
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on February 13, 2018, 05:38:09 PM
Our best team

Pickford
Coleman CB CB LB
Rooney Gana Davies
Walcott ST Sigurdsson

Have we acatually played anything like that away from home this season?
No, because we havenít had Coleman or a LB most of the time.

Obviously we have to be more assertive and attacking but even when we were solid under Koeman, last year, we still had an awful away record.

Thereís a fundamental issue with the mental toughness of the squad and Iím not sure how we address it tbh.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: bogie on February 13, 2018, 05:40:28 PM
"I'm not sure Bolasie is consistent enough to play him away from home where we'll be on the back foot for most of the game. Letting him run at tired defences at home is about as much as i would allow for him. He's one of the first players we should be looking at selling in the summer"

You see how it's possible to get an opinion across without denigrating somebody?

I am not getting into all that BUT I do hope it went both ways

I don't even think we should risk playing him in the last 10 mins of home games for the team and he might get a leg break then we are stuck with him

give davy klaassen his spot on the bench him coming on for Tom Davis for the last 15/20 would make more sense
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: dazfrancis on February 13, 2018, 07:08:52 PM
                   Pickford
Coleman Holgate Keane Martina
                    Gana
              Davies Rooney
Walcott        Niasse            Sig


Have we actually tried to play our best 11 away from home?

If I was going to switch it up for away I may think about only having one of Rooney or Sig playing in Central midfield and having Vlasic or DCL play on the wing.

I definitely wouldn't play 5 at the back and that means we defend deeper. We should be trying to block our opponents playing through midfield
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Juanito on February 13, 2018, 07:31:04 PM
Have we ever ever ever ever played well with 3 at the back?

Like I said, City at Goodison last season 4-0.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Dr. Sponge on February 13, 2018, 07:35:53 PM
Some consistency in personnel would help.

I think our best team is obvious at the moment, barring the centre halves who all seem a varying degree of below par.

Pickford

Coleman Holgate Jag Martina

Rooney Gueye Davies

Walcott Niasse Sig


Although I still feel we're handicapped by Martina and Niasse.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Waltzer on February 13, 2018, 08:08:38 PM
If we are to progress I think its a massive overhaul:

                            Pickford

Coleman   XXXXX          XXXXX         XXXXX

Walcott     XXXXX          XXXXX         Lookman

                      Sigurdsson

                        XXXXXX
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: mikey_blue on February 13, 2018, 09:02:07 PM
Have we actually tried to play our best 11 away from home?

If I was going to switch it up for away I may think about only having one of Rooney or Sig playing in Central midfield and having Vlasic or DCL play on the wing.

I definitely wouldn't play 5 at the back and that means we defend deeper. We should be trying to block our opponents playing through midfield

We should be playing to win and to build some team chemistry. Switching to defensive approaches and getting nobbed 4-0 anyway doesn't make much sense to me.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: D15TIN on February 13, 2018, 09:14:43 PM
People putting a back 3 or 5 away from home? Why??? It has literally not worked once for us. Set up as we do at home, don't set up with the wrong mindset of defending, and get some much needed continuity and results. A back 4 is a must
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: howard1334 on February 13, 2018, 09:25:14 PM
Donít think so and would like to see it, but do teams generally play the same way away from home as they do at home? Especially teams like ours that are so fragile and prone to giving up big chances.

Leicester and Palace two recent wins and Leicester hit the bar about 4 times and Benteke missed aba 3 chances for palace, and thatís at home!

Maybe if we stopped approaching away games so differently, we might stop being so fragile and might actually win a few.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: brap2 on February 13, 2018, 09:26:48 PM
you no after getting banned I said I would not get into it with shit calls but in the name of god man Bolasie do you watch are games at all
if we can get any money for him in the summer take it and run

Yeah really good point m8 keep em coming
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Paddockoldie on February 14, 2018, 12:54:12 AM
Best form of defence is attack. At present our best form of attack is to defend and then concede and give up.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Heisenberg on February 14, 2018, 01:33:12 AM
Fair enough you have to be adjustable when it comes to playing different teams. But not home vs away. Proper defeatist attitude.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on February 14, 2018, 01:41:22 AM
I'd rather we be brave and go for it then bend over like we did against arsenal. Put out a high energy, hard working, aggressive midfield and forward line and get them on the back foot.

 We have more quality than most teams below us and swansea and Watford have proved recently how fragile some of the teams above us are when forced to defend
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Jimmywhack on February 14, 2018, 01:58:47 AM
Pickford
Coleman Holgate Jagielka Baines
Gueye
Walcott Rooney Davies Sigurdsson
Tosun
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Goaljira on February 14, 2018, 02:15:35 AM
Same as we do at home.  Fuck messing around.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: blue slug on February 14, 2018, 02:23:57 AM
Same as we do at home.  Fuck messing around.

Totally agree mate everything we try away from home doesnít work so just play like we do at home itís not like we go gung-ho at home anyway
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: brap2 on February 14, 2018, 03:34:21 AM
I agree with what a lot of you are saying tbh - not like weíve got a great deal to lose, our away record is terrible so why not try and dominate a game?

My issue is we donít even really dominate at home, extremely fragile even against shite teams so a team with their home fans etc....reckon we need something a bit more solid away from home until we have a better midfield in place.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Robioto on February 14, 2018, 04:15:54 AM
Anything but a back 5.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: GLewis on February 14, 2018, 04:31:53 AM
I agree with what a lot of you are saying tbh - not like weíve got a great deal to lose, our away record is terrible so why not try and dominate a game?

My issue is we donít even really dominate at home, extremely fragile even against shite teams so a team with their home fans etc....reckon we need something a bit more solid away from home until we have a better midfield in place.

I donít think that weíve been overly attacking anywhere (although vs Spurs we pushed Rooney very high up the pitch).

But I do think part of our issues away from Home is that we donít hold onto the ball enough and so invite too much pressure.

Give any side enough possession and they will create chances.

We need to make the other team worry about us for longer so Iíd just stick with what is working at home.

If all else fails at least it provides a bit more continuity.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Cuttyblue on February 14, 2018, 07:07:02 AM
Donít think so and would like to see it, but do teams generally play the same way away from home as they do at home? Especially teams like ours that are so fragile and prone to giving up big chances.

Leicester and Palace two recent wins and Leicester hit the bar about 4 times and Benteke missed aba 3 chances for palace, and thatís at home!

YES.  We were very lucky in both of those recent wins.

Wouldn't it be nice to see us control a game again?
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: howard1334 on February 14, 2018, 10:08:20 AM
I agree with what a lot of you are saying tbh - not like weíve got a great deal to lose, our away record is terrible so why not try and dominate a game?

My issue is we donít even really dominate at home, extremely fragile even against shite teams so a team with their home fans etc....reckon we need something a bit more solid away from home until we have a better midfield in place.

Not like our home fans are very supportive at the moment.
Title: Re: How should we set up away?
Post by: Lincs Toffee on February 14, 2018, 03:09:17 PM
Not like our home fans are very supportive at the moment.
Some of our away support has been better than the toxic atmosphere at home