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NSNO Forums => The Everton Forum => Topic started by: mikey_blue on July 22, 2019, 03:18:47 AM

Title: DCL
Post by: mikey_blue on July 22, 2019, 03:18:47 AM
Couldnít see a thread on him.

Reports that heís wearing number 9 this year.

Donít think Iíve wanted a player to succeed at Everton as much as I do him. Just comes across as a really good lad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on July 22, 2019, 03:20:32 AM
Hope the weight of Sandro's legacy doesn't put too much pressure on him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Simon Paul on July 22, 2019, 03:29:54 AM
decent video of him running a lot on Twitter

doesn't show if either of his two shots on it went in though

https://twitter.com/CalvertLewin14/status/1153031235423408130
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Brownie on July 22, 2019, 03:30:44 AM
Could be a good psychological move to give him the 9
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on July 22, 2019, 03:37:50 AM
I adore him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on July 22, 2019, 03:39:55 AM
In before the "every Premier League club has a better striker" shout.  :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on July 22, 2019, 03:43:28 AM
decent video of him running a lot on Twitter

doesn't show if either of his two shots on it went in though

https://twitter.com/CalvertLewin14/status/1153031235423408130

Narrator: They didn't.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on July 22, 2019, 03:44:36 AM
Go on son.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Trublue on July 22, 2019, 03:44:43 AM
He came on leaps and bounds, in the last few months of the season. 8 goals wasn't too bad when he was not a starter for a long period. I expect him to score 10-15 this season. Hopefully the latter.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shropshire Blue on July 22, 2019, 03:49:20 AM
I adore him
....... but looking at your taste in men, certainly at Euston , that doesn't give me confidence! !!!!!!
 😲😲😲😲
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on July 22, 2019, 03:50:03 AM
....... but looking at your taste in men, certainly at Euston , that doesn't give me confidence! !!!!!!
 😲😲😲😲

Eh?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on July 22, 2019, 03:50:08 AM
If he's our main striker after this window we'll achieve nothing next season.

I say that as a big fan of his as well.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shropshire Blue on July 22, 2019, 03:51:15 AM
Eh?
Homelessness thread.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 22, 2019, 03:52:35 AM
Shite.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on July 22, 2019, 03:53:41 AM
Homelessness thread.

Bit strange ...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Simon Paul on July 22, 2019, 03:55:28 AM
He came on leaps and bounds, in the last few months of the season. 8 goals wasn't too bad when he was not a starter for a long period. I expect him to score 10-15 this season. Hopefully the latter.

https://www.premierleague.com/players/9576/Dominic-Calvert-Lewin/stats?co=1&se=210

started 19 like, and came on in 16 others.  scored 6 in the Premier League.

was only subbed off 6 times

only games he missed were first and last games, and Cardiff at home in November

296 minutes per goal in the league

he needs a senior striker to help him develop still
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shropshire Blue on July 22, 2019, 03:56:13 AM
Joke.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on July 22, 2019, 04:06:33 AM
I like him a lot but agree he absolutely cannot be our main striker next season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on July 22, 2019, 04:07:13 AM
Played a big part in our post Christmas improvement.
Maybe we should take in what he brings to the team performance and not get too hung up on his goal tally.
If he continues in the same role I'd be confident he'd get ten from open play. If he's playing every week I'd like to see him on penalties to pad out his tally.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on July 22, 2019, 04:09:57 AM
He's a big strong fast sexy bastard.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on July 22, 2019, 04:14:32 AM
Cant score. Everything else sound
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on July 22, 2019, 04:28:10 AM
Itís no real surprise he got that shirt, there wasnít anyone else who could have had it. Heís the only striker we want to keep.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ally2 on July 22, 2019, 04:54:54 AM
He's still getting better. Who knows how much better he will get. He has a really good skill set though no question. Needs to score more goals though, and we do need another striker to share the work next season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on July 22, 2019, 06:04:43 AM
Hope he has a proper explosive season where it all clicks.

But obviously we do need a senior striker capable of playing in the prem.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on July 22, 2019, 06:29:40 AM
I think DCL is a great asset for our squad. He's probably the best athlete we have in the team but he's not a top footballer. I don't think he has the footballing intelligence or the strikers instinct to ever become a top striker. And I don't know if these are things you can develop in a player.
He's definitely useful to have in the team and he's a handful for the defenders with his speed and strength. Maybe if he can improve his heading (he's great at getting his head to the ball first, just not as good at directing it or getting any real power behind it) he could get himself those 10-15 goals that we need from our striker.
I'm perfectly happy for him to wear the number 9 and really hope he can get those double figures this season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Old England Toffee on July 22, 2019, 10:27:24 AM
(he's great at getting his head to the ball first, just not as good at directing it or getting any real power behind it)

Its always quite interesting to get a different perspective, as we (english and evertonians) can be very blinkered in positive and negative ways. I watched the u21 games with south american commentary and they were loving DCL. A couple of times he didnt direct a header on goal and instead of having a go for missing a chance (as lots of british commentators do) they were raving about how good his leap was, how he got so much higher than the defense and hung in the air. I reckon he will improve the timing of his jumps, angle of runs etc, and if we continue to have quality in wide areas I think he can be a really good weapon for us. GO ON LAD.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: penguinofdoom1878 on July 22, 2019, 01:43:31 PM
Cant score. Everything else sound

the Duncan Ferguson effect
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on July 22, 2019, 03:05:45 PM
Looks boss in the video keeping himself ready .....I have every faith he will be double figures this year .

https://twitter.com/CalvertLewin14/status/1153031235423408130?s=09


Big season lad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on July 22, 2019, 03:53:47 PM
Fair play to the lad, he's working hard to make himself into a better athlete and that'll get you a long way. He also knows he needs to score more and get into goalscoring positions more often, as he admitted in his interviews at the back end of last season, so he's doing everything right. He just needs genuine quality to challenge him now to push himself even further.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cods on July 22, 2019, 04:14:17 PM
Hope DCL can improve with more goals this year. Heís not going to get us what we need over the course of the season by himself though. We need a goalscorer in as priority.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on July 22, 2019, 07:57:26 PM
Hope DCL can improve with more goals this year. He's not going to get us what we need over the course of the season by himself though. We need a goalscorer in as priority.
It's easy to blame his record, which I regularly do, but others need to chip in more. I love Bernard, but his record isn't good enough in front of goal and we rely to heavily on Ricky and Sig.
What worries me more though about DCL are the goals he scores as I think from his tally during the season they only contributed to about 4 points. He rarely scored the winning goal, they usually come when we're comfortable. A good striker is someone who gets you that goal to take 3 points when it's a tight game and that's what pushes you up the table, he doesn't do this

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on July 22, 2019, 08:28:22 PM
It's easy to blame his record, which I regularly do, but others need to chip in more. I love Bernard, but his record isn't good enough in front of goal and we rely to heavily on Ricky and Sig.
What worries me more though about DCL are the goals he scores as I think from his tally during the season they only contributed to about 4 points. He rarely scored the winning goal, they usually come when we're comfortable. A good striker is someone who gets you that goal to take 3 points when it's a tight game and that's what pushes you up the table, he doesn't do this

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You could say that about Lukaku, and people did and still do at Man U, and he is vastly more experienced and cost £90m. DCL is just a kid learning his trade.

I do agree about your Bernard point though. We need to distribute the goals more evenly.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on July 22, 2019, 08:52:18 PM
You could say that about Lukaku, and people did and still do at Man U, and he is vastly more experienced and cost £90m. DCL is just a kid learning his trade.

I do agree about your Bernard point though. We need to distribute the goals more evenly.
Possibly about the big goals and big teams, but his goals contributed in us getting an extra 18 points in his final season under the same parameters and that's what we're missing

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: D15TIN on July 22, 2019, 11:25:27 PM
Only so long you can call DCL a kid, he's nearly 23 isn't he?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Thornton_19 on July 22, 2019, 11:37:35 PM
Only so long you can call DCL a kid, he's nearly 23 isn't he?
23 in March.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on July 22, 2019, 11:41:04 PM
What were you like at 23? I was fucking drunk idiot.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on July 22, 2019, 11:55:58 PM
What were you like at 23? I was fucking drunk idiot.
And? So were probably 99.9% of the people on here, but I wouldn't have if I was a professional like DCL earning hundreds of thousands a month, id also have a massive drug habit to go along with being a drunken idiot!!

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on July 23, 2019, 12:07:51 AM
Hope the weight of Sandro's legacy doesn't put too much pressure on him.

Shall I put duct tape over the name and wear my shirt again??
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Polledreng on July 23, 2019, 12:11:19 AM
What were you like at 23? I was fucking drunk idiot.
sometimes it sounds as you still are  ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on July 23, 2019, 12:11:20 AM
I keep seeing "senior" striker.  Please, no old grocks.  I'd be super happy with an "upside" striker that can share the load, and be an alternative to DCL (in tht they both play lots, the time is split like 60/40).

Think that would work very well.  We need energy from the position in Marco's system, not someone who sits back and just finishes the odd goal.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on July 23, 2019, 12:39:17 AM
It's not Calvert Lewin who is the issue it's having Tosun and Niasse here
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on July 23, 2019, 12:41:56 AM
It's no Calvert Lewin who is the issue it's having Tosun and Niasse here

Agreed.  To me, DCL has showed the "floor" of what we expect from a striker in this offense.  It works with DCL in the lineup, much better than it did any other way.

Now, it's fair to say it didn't work IDEALLY because he's a sub-par finisher.  But we only want to bring in someone to provide a "ceiling" option, that might take us to another level.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 12:47:10 AM
Agreed.  To me, DCL has showed the "floor" of what we expect from a striker in this offense.  It works with DCL in the lineup, much better than it did any other way.

Now, it's fair to say it didn't work IDEALLY because he's a sub-par finisher.  But we only want to bring in someone to provide a "ceiling" option, that might take us to another level.

The minimum of what we expect is 6 league goals?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on July 23, 2019, 12:52:03 AM
The team in general wasn't exactly flying for the majority of last season to be fair to DCL.
If you look at Greame Sharp's record for us he more than doubled his goals per season when he was playing in a winning team.
DCL could be similar as he contributes all along the front line.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on July 23, 2019, 12:58:22 AM
Jesus. Here come the 1 in 33 shouts.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on July 23, 2019, 01:03:17 AM
I think one thing to note re DCL is that heís been picked by all the managers that heís been available to.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Old England Toffee on July 23, 2019, 01:10:08 AM
I think one thing to note re DCL is that heís been picked by all the managers that heís been available to.
Yeah but we havent been blessed in the managerial dept since he started his everton career so not sure if thats a plus or a negative :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Nicco on July 23, 2019, 01:10:12 AM
I think one thing to note re DCL is that he's been picked by all the managers that he's been available to.
Unlike Ademola that everyone rates.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on July 23, 2019, 01:16:34 AM
sometimes it sounds as you still are  ;)

Edit : removed, took that one badly for some reason.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: NickNack on July 23, 2019, 02:04:34 AM
I think the DCL who finished last season was a much better player than the one who started it, so fingers crossed he continues that improvement and becomes a more consistent goalscorer
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: D15TIN on July 23, 2019, 02:32:27 AM
I think one thing to note re DCL is that he’s been picked by all the managers that he’s been available to.
him or Niasse, oooo tough decision
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on July 23, 2019, 02:56:22 AM
him or Niasse, oooo tough decision
This is true, but at the same time he has also been picked plenty of times to play in other positions. Left wing, right wing, positions that he is not really suited to, but it seems that all his managers wanted him in the team somewhere because they liked his particular skill set.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on July 23, 2019, 03:05:19 AM
him or Niasse, oooo tough decision

You mean him niasse Tosun and Richarlson .....and despite Richarlson's goals DCL still give Marco enough fuel to push Rich out on the wing .
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 03:26:06 AM
You mean him niasse Tosun and Richarlson .....and despite Richarlson's goals DCL still give Marco enough fuel to push Rich out on the wing .

Richarlison is a winger. He forced silva into playing Pickford in goal too
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on July 23, 2019, 03:32:45 AM
 :thumbsup:
Richarlison is a winger. He forced silva into playing Pickford in goal too
Who Marco chose to play up front ...fuck sake watch a game not just motd lad .
 ...fuck me I miss the
@realist cos of you ..miserable twat :thumbsup:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 03:44:47 AM
:thumbsup:Who Marco chose to play up front ...fuck sake watch a game not just motd lad .
 ...fuck me I miss the
@realist cos of you ..miserable twat :thumbsup:

But itís the exact opposite of what you claim. Our strikers are so poor he tried a winger upfront. Not DCL is so good he forced Richarlison onto the wing. Itís literally proves the opposite of what you claim
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on July 23, 2019, 04:09:40 AM
As I have mentioned multiple times, perhaps if Everton received proper TV coverage and better punditry - it would be more clear.  NBCSN's panel here raved about what a difference he made the last few months of the season.  He did all the "donkey work" - and the former players like Robbie Earle noted it.  Hold-up play, running the channels, engaging (and tiring out) defenders and midfielders with his speed and all-out workrate.

Everybody knows we need more goals/better finishing, but for fuck's sake, he does everything else superbly.  This surely DOES allow Richarlison and Siggy to have more room to creatively work, and made us a much stronger XI with DCL than without.

Remember that awful period when Rooney came back?  How he was a liability in all other facets, but was still a good finisher?  I know you noticed that.

DCL is basically the exact opposite of that.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mouse on July 23, 2019, 04:51:27 AM
I think the DCL who finished last season was a much better player than the one who started it, so fingers crossed he continues that improvement and becomes a more consistent goalscorer
I think this sums him up. At the start of the season I couldn't see a long-term future for him with us. He improved in every way as the season went on. IF, and it is a big if, he can continue on the same track and confidence in front of goal then he will succeed with us.

Regardless of that, we do need more goals and another option. At the moment we have goals in only one of our first-choice front three. That is not top 6.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on July 23, 2019, 04:53:59 AM
I think this sums him up. At the start of the season I couldn't see a long-term future for him with us. He improved in every way as the season went on. IF, and it is a big if, he can continue on the same track and confidence in front of goal then he will succeed with us.

Regardless of that, we do need more goals and another option. At the moment we have goals in only one of our first-choice front three. That is not top 6.

I keep a candle of hope out for Moise Kean.  Would complete the puzzle nicely (especially if paired with an upgrade to Walcott)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mouse on July 23, 2019, 04:57:17 AM
I'd love Kean, looks like what we need but also fits the image of a club moving forward and investing in top young talent.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on July 23, 2019, 05:36:06 AM
But itís the exact opposite of what you claim. Our strikers are so poor he tried a winger upfront. Not DCL is so good he forced Richarlison onto the wing. Itís literally proves the opposite of what you claim

But again your missing the main point (cos it suits you) ....Richarlson was started up front ahead of both Tosun and Niasse from early in the season ....yet even after scoring a few from there ,he was moved into the wing for DCL to play up front ...no? Do Marco must see the benefit (like the rest of us)...anywhoo ..I honestly don't know why I bother its you 'alone' on nsno who is blind to everything any player(especially DcL ) does aside hit the net ..  maybe we should fuck Pickford off to ...i mean fuck he can score for England but not us, best we fuck him off too he offers little goal threat   shakeyheadman
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: boothill on July 23, 2019, 05:46:41 AM
Hes gona get a sack full this coming season. I can feel it in my old bones so i can

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 10:58:35 AM
But again your missing the main point (cos it suits you) ....Richarlson was started up front ahead of both Tosun and Niasse from early in the season ....yet even after scoring a few from there ,he was moved into the wing for DCL to play up front ...no? Do Marco must see the benefit (like the rest of us)...anywhoo ..I honestly don't know why I bother its you 'alone' on nsno who is blind to everything any player(especially DcL ) does aside hit the net ..  maybe we should fuck Pickford off to ...i mean fuck he can score for England but not us, best we fuck him off too he offers little goal threat   shakeyheadman

Donít think youíre being particularly honest here. The 2 main factors in Richarlison not playing upfront are him being quite poor there and him being a very good winger.
Richarlison was tried as a striker because we were struggling for a decent 1. He absolutely was pushed out of position because of DCL form only not in the positive way youíre trying to spin it

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on July 23, 2019, 11:53:22 AM
Why is he doing training videos on his own. Why not just join the squad?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on July 23, 2019, 12:13:42 PM
Why is he doing training videos on his own. Why not just join the squad?

Cos he was still on holiday. He is back with the squad now.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on July 23, 2019, 01:33:47 PM
Need some fucking transfer news and quick.

The neverending DCL debate is boring the tits off me.

Fully expecting him to have a decent season in line with his progression and still have people slating him because he hasn't blown every other PL striker out of the water.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Polledreng on July 23, 2019, 02:22:17 PM
Edit : removed, took that one badly for some reason.
you certainly didn't have to..
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on July 23, 2019, 02:30:12 PM
you certainly didn't have to..

I was in a shite mood yesterday for a some reason, sorry my mate
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 02:40:20 PM
Need some fucking transfer news and quick.

The neverending DCL debate is boring the tits off me.

Fully expecting him to have a decent season in line with his progression and still have people slating him because he hasn't blown every other PL striker out of the water.

Fully expect him to score about 7 league goals, be totally ineffective half the time and have people pretend his a great (23 year old) prospect

When he starts doing as well as the strikers at wolves, West Ham and Leicester Iílll stop saying heís not good enough for Everton
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on July 23, 2019, 02:44:40 PM
Well this thread went as expected.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on July 23, 2019, 02:55:22 PM
Fully expect him to score about 7 league goals, be totally ineffective half the time and have people pretend his a great (23 year old) prospect

When he starts doing as well as the strikers at wolves, West Ham and Leicester Iílll stop saying heís not good enough for Everton

Bet you're a laugh at parties
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on July 23, 2019, 02:59:16 PM
Well this thread went as expected.

Are you joking? Fresh insight with each and every post.

Makes me proud to part of such an open minded and supportive fan base.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: DanDan on July 23, 2019, 03:50:35 PM
So if he is going to be the main striker for us this season. How many goals are we expecting from him? 13 to keep his 1 in 3 ratio up?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Morta75 on July 23, 2019, 04:02:58 PM
He needs to step up this season, and I think he will. 10 + goals from him this coming season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on July 23, 2019, 05:00:13 PM
Are you joking? Fresh insight with each and every post.

Makes me proud to part of such an open minded and supportive fan base.

It's basically just KNT, answering anyone who says anything positive about DCL, anywhere in the world, at any given time.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 05:18:14 PM
It's basically just KNT, answering anyone who says anything positive about DCL, anywhere in the world, at any given time.

I donít think itís anything positive. Itís more anyone claiming heís good enough to lead the line for a decent premier league team (or more outlandishly heís worth a minimum of 40m and spurs and arsenal would sign him or best still the best young player in the world)

His potential is up for debate. Not sure his current record is. Itís just plain poor.

The outlandish claims donít come from me. They come from people who claim ďif you donít rate DCL you just donít understand footballĒ and other such nonsense

Anyone want to have a bet he doesnít score 12 in the league next season?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on July 23, 2019, 05:23:42 PM
I donít think itís anything positive. Itís more anyone claiming heís good enough to lead the line for a decent premier league team (or more outlandishly heís worth a minimum of 40m and spurs and arsenal would sign him or best still the best young player in the world)

His potential is up for debate. Not sure his current record is. Itís just plain poor.

The outlandish claims donít come from me. They come from people who claim ďif you donít rate DCL you just donít understand footballĒ and other such nonsense

Anyone want to have a bet he doesnít score 12 in the league next season?

You have to answer it don't you? Anything containing the letters 'DCL' in that order, regardless of context, you simply have to respond to.

Dude, we all know the argument, we all know your position on it, we could all now argue both sides of the argument completely, because we've all been exposed to the endlessness of it. It's cool. We'll see how he develops and performs over time.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Robioto on July 23, 2019, 06:52:35 PM
This whole DCL thing just goes round and round in circles on here, feel like I'm reading posts that I've read over and over again for the past 2 years.

He will be here next season, he's getting the number 9 shirt, Brands and Sliva like him, lets see how he gets on.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on July 23, 2019, 07:29:53 PM
Fully expect him to score about 7 league goals, be totally ineffective half the time and have people pretend his a great (23 year old) prospect

When he starts doing as well as the strikers at wolves, West Ham and Leicester Iílll stop saying heís not good enough for Everton

Yeah we can argue all day about whether or not we expect it to rain tomorrow, but the only time we'll know is tomorrow. So why waste today?

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on July 23, 2019, 07:50:32 PM
So if he is going to be the main striker for us this season. How many goals are we expecting from him? 13 to keep his 1 in 3 ratio up?

Well in order to please some people heíll have to do as well as Leicester, Wolves and West Ham strikers.

Vardy - 18 goals
Jiminez - 13 goals
Arnautovic - 10 goals

On that basis he just has to score the 5th most goals in the league for KN10 to accept he might be decent
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 07:59:01 PM
Well in order to please some people heíll have to do as well as Leicester, Wolves and West Ham strikers.

Vardy - 18 goals
Jiminez - 13 goals
Arnautovic - 10 goals

On that basis he just has to score the 5th most goals in the league for KN10 to accept he might be decent

I think we should expect a striker that gets 13-15 and we need 1 that scores around vardyís 18 if weíve real ambition to get amongst the top 5 or 6. Do you disagree. Also West Ham have improved on their strikers since the season ended
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on July 23, 2019, 08:02:13 PM
80% of the strikers in the league wonít get 12 goals.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: MmmblueBernard on July 23, 2019, 08:05:11 PM
Cant believe that we're accepting that 12 is good enough. Its not. Your main man needs to be getting at last 20 or your finishing absolutely no-where near the top in the league.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 08:07:02 PM
80% of the strikers in the league wonít get 12 goals.

How many will get 6? How many of that 80% play for teams with ambitions to be in the top 6?
You genuinely think 12 is an unreasonable number to expect from our striker?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on July 23, 2019, 08:15:11 PM
How many will get 6? How many of that 80% play for teams with ambitions to be in the top 6?
You genuinely think 12 is an unreasonable number to expect from our striker?

Just thought it was a relevant point to throw out there.

Iím not going any further.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 08:21:10 PM
Just thought it was a relevant point to throw out there.

Iím not going any further.


Thereís surely 9 clubs whoíd expect their striker to get 12 and the majority of them to beat that number by a decent margin.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on July 23, 2019, 08:44:42 PM
Cant believe that we're accepting that 12 is good enough. Its not. Your main man needs to be getting at last 20 or your finishing absolutely no-where near the top in the league.

Going back 5 years:

Last year 4 players scored 20 or more goals.

17/18: 4 players
16/17: 5 players
15/16: 3 players
14/15: 3 players

Unless youíre having a freak season (like Lukakuís best one) or are around the top of the table thereís no way our strikers will be getting those numbers.

United finished 6th last season with the top scorer being Pogba on 13 goals, if weíre as defensively solid as we were in the tail-end of last season then we donít need to be scoring shedloads of goals.

For me, DCL contributed to those clean sheets with defending from the front. If he can do that, continue to bring others in and get 10+ goals then Iíll call that a good season for him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on July 23, 2019, 08:59:01 PM
I am going to say this and then close this thread and never ever ever enter it ever again.

If it wasn't for Calvert-Lewin last year, Marco Silva would have got sacked.

Goodbye.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on July 23, 2019, 09:17:11 PM
If I ever get around to shooting my dumb self in the head, I have no doubt it will be with a DCL thread open.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Omar on July 23, 2019, 09:27:31 PM
I'd be quite happy with DCL on 13 this upcoming season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee Tuesdays on July 23, 2019, 09:33:09 PM
25 between Richarlison and DCL with the midfield stepping up their contribution would be a realistic goal to me
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary1878 on July 23, 2019, 10:29:22 PM
Going back 5 years:

Last year 4 players scored 20 or more goals.

17/18: 4 players
16/17: 5 players
15/16: 3 players
14/15: 3 players

Unless youíre having a freak season (like Lukakuís best one) or are around the top of the table thereís no way our strikers will be getting those numbers.

United finished 6th last season with the top scorer being Pogba on 13 goals, if weíre as defensively solid as we were in the tail-end of last season then we donít need to be scoring shedloads of goals.

For me, DCL contributed to those clean sheets with defending from the front. If he can do that, continue to bring others in and get 10+ goals then Iíll call that a good season for him.

I think DCLs target has to be 10 goals minimum, otherwise he is not serious about being a starting Premier League striker for Everton.

Some of DCLs all-round play is some of the best in the league, and his physical attributes like height, power, pace etc are great. But he must start finishing chances next season and being ruthless. Next season is the one where he has to push on and get goals, and not just the odd one, but doubles to win us games with great finishing. Otherwise, no matter how good he is at the other stuff, he won't make it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 23, 2019, 11:10:46 PM
I donít think itís anything positive. Itís more anyone claiming heís good enough to lead the line for a decent premier league team (or more outlandishly heís worth a minimum of 40m and spurs and arsenal would sign him or best still the best young player in the world)

His potential is up for debate. Not sure his current record is. Itís just plain poor.

The outlandish claims donít come from me. They come from people who claim ďif you donít rate DCL you just donít understand footballĒ and other such nonsense

Anyone want to have a bet he doesnít score 12 in the league next season?


its must have been eating away at you not posting about DLC for 3/4 days

tell me how many goals will Firmino get 12 ? as that is his avg over 4 years   137 48

so going by your maths he is total crap

just stop it your making yourself look like a bigger tool than you are

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 23, 2019, 11:36:31 PM

its must have been eating away at you not posting about DLC for 3/4 days

tell me how many goals will Firmino get 12 ? as that is his avg over 4 years   137 48

so going by your maths he is total crap

just stop it your making yourself look like a bigger tool than you are



Heís light years ahead of DCL at pretty much every aspect of the game.
It really isnít just about goals. Heís not great at anything. Heís decent at a few things in spells but he goes missing much more than he plays well.
Look each to their own. Most on here seem to rate him and barely anyone else does. Maybe your right or maybe your just biased. Time will tell.
No real need for the name calling because we donít rate the same player though. All very petty and youíll not get many invites to dinner parties with such an attitude xx
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: D15TIN on July 23, 2019, 11:36:59 PM

its must have been eating away at you not posting about DLC for 3/4 days

tell me how many goals will Firmino get 12 ? as that is his avg over 4 years   137 48

so going by your maths he is total crap

just stop it your making yourself look like a bigger tool than you are


tbh I don't think anything he said was wrong there, his goalscoring record is poor, we can try and make a case for him all we want, but we arnt challenging the top 6 with a first choice striker only capable of getting 5-10 goals
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on July 23, 2019, 11:50:56 PM
He really does divide opinion, what I find amusing is the amount of angst there is based on speculation. Some think there's going to be a great rise, others don't, but the fact is none of us are right or wrong as we don't know? I think next season will determine where his career goes as he'll be nearly 24 then and I think the 'learning his trade tag' won't be as relevant, he'll really need to be delivering at a much higher level than he is now.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Tofifee on July 24, 2019, 12:18:21 AM
25 between Richarlison and DCL with the midfield stepping up their contribution would be a realistic goal to me

Wow.......................... :bonk:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 24, 2019, 12:44:53 AM
tbh I don't think anything he said was wrong there, his goalscoring record is poor, we can try and make a case for him all we want, but we arnt challenging the top 6 with a first choice striker only capable of getting 5-10 goals

Distin its all about this guy posting the same crap every few days about a 21 year old player , well will look over what he is doing for the team without getting 20 goals a season (and that will not happen for even the best in the would at most clubs )

everyone can see we need a striker in and it will be the other 2 that he will replaced why is KN10,s always going on about DLC getting replaced


DLC,s goals per min are not that bad and good for a 21 year old but he will over look age and go more on games played (2/3 mins on as a sub lol)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on July 24, 2019, 12:48:07 AM
DCL not DLC

carry on.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on July 24, 2019, 12:48:52 AM
We don't know he's capable of scoring more than 6 goals until he plays 90 minutes every week. That's a risk and Im not too keen but if it happens I think he'll easily hit double figures and would back him for more
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: D15TIN on July 24, 2019, 12:58:47 AM
he's 22, not 21 - I like his attitude and in certain games he's worth starting (against the top 6), but in games where we'll have a lot more of the ball and expected to win I think we'll struggle with him as the 9
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 24, 2019, 12:59:32 AM
Heís light years ahead of DCL at pretty much every aspect of the game.
It really isnít just about goals. Heís not great at anything. Heís decent at a few things in spells but he goes missing much more than he plays well.
Look each to their own. Most on here seem to rate him and barely anyone else does. Maybe your right or maybe your just biased. Time will tell.
No real need for the name calling because we donít rate the same player though. All very petty and youíll not get many invites to dinner parties with such an attitude xx

light years hmm game per goal DCL 2.74  BF 2.42 light years (oh you must mean the age gap got it )

lol time will tell , you see the irony in that

dinner party lol why would I want to sit down and eat with someone that will just keep saying the same crap over and over again till everyone and anyone will say ok your right

were is your war cry to get the other 2 that are doing fuck all but taking a wage home out the door why are you only set on the 21 year old
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 24, 2019, 12:59:45 AM
Distin its all about this guy posting the same crap every few days about a 21 year old player , well will look over what he is doing for the team without getting 20 goals a season (and that will not happen for even the best in the would at most clubs )

everyone can see we need a striker in and it will be the other 2 that he will replaced why is KN10,s always going on about DLC getting replaced


DLC,s goals per min are not that bad and good for a 21 year old but he will over look age and go more on games played (2/3 mins on as a sub lol)

Stop crying about it. People are allowed to rate players you donít and not rate players you like. Itís hardly outlandish to question a striker who got 6 league goals last season.  Itís really not worth being upset about. Youíre acting as if Iím bullying your son when the reality is Iím just saying Iím not keen on a certain player. Saying it on a football forum thatís made for such discussions
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: MmmblueBernard on July 24, 2019, 01:02:06 AM
Going back 5 years:

Last year 4 players scored 20 or more goals.

17/18: 4 players
16/17: 5 players
15/16: 3 players
14/15: 3 players

Unless youíre having a freak season (like Lukakuís best one) or are around the top of the table thereís no way our strikers will be getting those numbers.

United finished 6th last season with the top scorer being Pogba on 13 goals, if weíre as defensively solid as we were in the tail-end of last season then we donít need to be scoring shedloads of goals.

For me, DCL contributed to those clean sheets with defending from the front. If he can do that, continue to bring others in and get 10+ goals then Iíll call that a good season for him.

I donít disagree, but it ainít gonna wing you the league, or get in the champions league or even Europe league. We should be aspiring to a lit more than a 12 goal a season main striker. NSNO and all that.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 24, 2019, 01:02:29 AM
light years hmm game per goal DCL 2.74  BF 2.42 light years (oh you must mean the age gap got it )

lol time will tell , you see the irony in that

dinner party lol why would I want to sit down and eat with someone that will just keep saying the same crap over and over again till everyone and anyone will say ok your right

were is your war cry to get the other 2 that are doing fuck all but taking a wage home out the door why are you only set on the 21 year old

Iím not actually hosting a dinner party. Just pointing out you wouldnít get invited to many if you call people names for disagreeing about such a tame subject.
You donít think firminho is an infinitely better footballer than DCL?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 24, 2019, 01:02:58 AM
Stop crying about it. People are allowed to rate players you donít and not rate players you like. Itís hardly outlandish to question a striker who got 6 league goals last season.  Itís really not worth being upset about. Youíre acting as if Iím bullying your son when the reality is Iím just saying Iím not keen on a certain player. Saying it on a football forum thatís made for such discussions

so rate him and move on stop posting it ever other day WE GET IT
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 24, 2019, 01:04:46 AM
you cant us stat when it suits you and then say its not all about stat when it comes back on you
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 24, 2019, 01:06:25 AM
DCL not DLC

carry on.

that one gets me every time
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 24, 2019, 01:08:01 AM
so rate him and move on stop posting it ever other day WE GET IT

Itís hard not to comment when people are saying heís superb at everything scoring and heís worth 40m to would move to top 6 sides.

As for the other 2. Tosan and niasse I assume. Neither are any good but then no one is suggesting they are. Thereís not a debate to be had
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 24, 2019, 01:10:04 AM
you cant us stat when it suits you and then say its not all about stat when it comes back on you

The stat says he scores twice as many goals while also being infinitely better at almost everything else too.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on July 24, 2019, 01:10:32 AM
look sorry if this is your only outlet but I have no more time for you goodbye
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on July 24, 2019, 01:12:10 AM
Sassy.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on July 24, 2019, 01:27:19 AM
Itís hard not to comment when people are saying heís superb at everything scoring and heís worth 40m to would move to top 6 sides.

As for the other 2. Tosan and niasse I assume. Neither are any good but then no one is suggesting they are. Thereís not a debate to be had

Oh turn it in you fucking tiresome biff.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on July 24, 2019, 01:27:50 AM
Oh turn it in you fucking tiresome biff.

Biff is a massively underrated insult
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on July 24, 2019, 01:36:15 AM
Heís light years ahead of DCL at pretty much every aspect of the game.
It really isnít just about goals. Heís not great at anything. Heís decent at a few things in spells but he goes missing much more than he plays well.
Look each to their own. Most on here seem to rate him and barely anyone else does. Maybe your right or maybe your just biased. Time will tell.
No real need for the name calling because we donít rate the same player though. All very petty and youíll not get many invites to dinner parties with such an attitude xx

Yeah I think the solid platform in games vs dross is a better question mark actually.

That really is a skill that develops over time (see older strikers doing good jobs for their team like Deeney etc.).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on July 24, 2019, 01:43:58 AM
Oh turn it in you fucking tiresome biff.

Sorry but it was a pretty ridiculous claim. Hard not to enjoy its comedy value.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on July 24, 2019, 02:17:15 AM
Is right mate. Youíve had me off there.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on July 24, 2019, 12:55:17 PM
I know I should leave it, but..........

Newcastle have just signed someone for 40mil who scored seven goals last season, that being his highest tally in a single season.

So, yeah, DCL goes for 40mil.

Itís a hypothetical situation anyway that really doesnít need any debate. Just a point I was making to illustrate his standing in the game.

 
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on July 24, 2019, 01:31:50 PM
DCL would get more than 10 goals if he was first choice all season this season, I have no doubt about it. I also think that we would get 20 to 30 mil for him at least. I also thought he was brilliant towards the end of last season when he had a run of games. Come at me
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: arteta4spain on July 24, 2019, 02:21:38 PM
That training video makes me think heíll be better this season. Donít know, Iíve just got a feeling, but at the same time we still need to bring someone in.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on July 24, 2019, 02:22:47 PM
I don't disagree, but it ain't gonna wing you the league, or get in the champions league or even Europe league. We should be aspiring to a lit more than a 12 goal a season main striker. NSNO and all that.

Not sure if you read all of my comment but United finished 6th last season and Lukaku was their top scoring forward on 12 goals. Firmino at the shite plays an arguably similar role in occupying defenders for the better players around him and he scored 12 goals in a side that got 97 points.

Provided that the forward is offering more to the team and you have goal scorers around him  (like Richarlison and Sig) then 12 goals is fine.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on July 24, 2019, 03:19:34 PM
Heís been training like an absolute beast over the summer. Was really good to see him taking his development seriously and I think heís going to be an absolute nightmare for some defenders next year.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on July 24, 2019, 03:42:52 PM
Is someone having a dinner party.........
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: arteta4spain on July 24, 2019, 04:52:56 PM
He's been training like an absolute beast over the summer. Was really good to see him taking his development seriously and I think he's going to be an absolute nightmare for some defenders next year.
That training video looks like heís put on a bit of beef. Hopefully heíll be barging defenders left right and centre all season and getting into better positions
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on July 24, 2019, 05:09:26 PM
Thereís literally nothing else to say on this topic.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 06, 2019, 06:41:31 AM
Looks like my boy is getting the number 9.

For me what he needs to do this year is start being super aggressive with his physical abilities. Bully cbs not just to keep the ball or force an error, but lash them and get a shot off or come flying in for a big header.

Start being selfish and put your foot through the fucker.

He's got everything he needs to succeed, but he doesn't currently carry enough threat. Big year coming for Dom if he can add that, I'm saying 10 prem goals, 14 total.

Calvert-Lewin Season is upon us.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on August 06, 2019, 07:30:55 AM
Looks like my boy is getting the number 9.

For me what he needs to do this year is start being super aggressive with his physical abilities. Bully cbs not just to keep the ball or force an error, but lash them and get a shot off or come flying in for a big header.

Start being selfish and put your foot through the fucker.

He's got everything he needs to succeed, but he doesn't currently carry enough threat. Big year coming for Dom if he can add that, I'm saying 10 prem goals, 14 total.

Calvert-Lewin Season is upon us.

Iím all aboard with a non-refundable ticket.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 06, 2019, 11:39:47 AM
Iím on board too - love him and really hoping he can push on.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 06, 2019, 12:33:32 PM
Good luck to him, needs to step up a long, long way to prove that he deserves it and hopefully he's got the game to do it!?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on August 06, 2019, 01:20:22 PM
If him and kean can get 20 goals between the 2 kg them that would be fantastic. I'm on board too, DCL to kick on
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 06, 2019, 01:25:21 PM
Train arriving in the championship next August.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluebridge on August 06, 2019, 01:31:34 PM
If him and kean can get 20 goals between the 2 kg them that would be fantastic. I'm on board too, DCL to kick on
Thatís a lightweight attack!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Fynci on August 06, 2019, 01:44:44 PM
Train arriving in the championship next August.

Haha NSNO at its finest. A stream of optimism followed by a negative post.
Title: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on August 06, 2019, 01:48:52 PM
Train arriving in the championship next August.

https://tenor.com/302C.gif
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on August 06, 2019, 01:55:16 PM
It's interesting to me how one area he is performing really well in is his selfless work for the team and my main criticism of him is that he could be more selfish in front of goal.

It could be quite confusing trying to strike the right balance but I think a major part of this will be his decision-making as he matures.

If he gets that right we can hopefully still keep up all the great holding play and teamwork - as well as seeing an improved goal return for him.

I really want this to be his season when it starts to really come together for him. He has all the necessary parts, imo, but some self-assembly is still required...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Goaljira on August 06, 2019, 02:40:39 PM
It's interesting to me how one area he is performing really well in is his selfless work for the team and my main criticism of him is that he could be more selfish in front of goal.

It could be quite confusing trying to strike the right balance but I think a major part of this will be his decision-making as he matures.

If he gets that right we can hopefully still keep up all the great holding play and teamwork - as well as seeing an improved goal return for him.

I really want this to be his season when it starts to really come together for him. He has all the necessary parts, imo, but some self-assembly is still required...

The lack of selfishness is a symptom across the team.  Too often we try and play an extra pass instead of just taking a pot shot at goal, so we become predictable and easier to defend against.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TSGun on August 06, 2019, 03:25:39 PM
DCL is 650 in roman numerals.

Pointless I know.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Fynci on August 06, 2019, 04:04:40 PM
DCL is 650 in roman numerals.

Pointless I know.

<KoemansNumberTens>Which coincidentally is how many career appearances he will make at Fleetwood</KoemansNumberTens>
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: di_guyo on August 06, 2019, 04:23:59 PM
His off the ball movement is one of the things holding him back for me. He's often not where he needs to be, especially against the lower teams. Very useful player against top sides when you need someone a bit deeper, holding the ball up and linking with others....but when you need someone to create something from nothing, convert a rebound in the 6 yard box etc. he's nowhere near. Not good enough to be our main striker but he's got promise. I'm not sure he's ever going to be able to provide what we need from him, though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on August 06, 2019, 04:31:52 PM
His off the ball movement is one of the things holding him back for me. He's often not where he needs to be, especially against the lower teams. Very useful player against top sides when you need someone a bit deeper, holding the ball up and linking with others....but when you need someone to create something from nothing, convert a rebound in the 6 yard box etc. he's nowhere near. Not good enough to be our main striker but he's got promise. I'm not sure he's ever going to be able to provide what we need from him, though.

In the limited bit I saw in pre-season it seemed like his movement was better.

He didnít score but he got in the right positions to do so, which is a step forward IMO
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: MmmblueBernard on August 06, 2019, 04:36:26 PM
DCL is 650 in roman numerals.

Pointless I know.

Is that also then average time between goals?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 06, 2019, 04:39:45 PM
His off the ball movement is one of the things holding him back for me. He's often not where he needs to be, especially against the lower teams. Very useful player against top sides when you need someone a bit deeper, holding the ball up and linking with others....but when you need someone to create something from nothing, convert a rebound in the 6 yard box etc. he's nowhere near. Not good enough to be our main striker but he's got promise. I'm not sure he's ever going to be able to provide what we need from him, though.

that very much contradicts itself. How can you be very good against the top 6 yet he cant create something from nothing? Thats exactly when you need a striker to do that, create something from nothing when hes working from scraps. Based on last season he isnt good enough full stop, but like others have said there is potential, but I think this season is make or break for him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on August 06, 2019, 04:43:07 PM
In the limited bit I saw in pre-season it seemed like his movement was better.

He didn’t score but he got in the right positions to do so, which is a step forward IMO

Silva was also giving him a good talking to at one of the pre season games, motioning about movement. Not sure whether he was telling him do something or commending him on it. Either way it's clearly on the radar.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: di_guyo on August 06, 2019, 04:48:09 PM
that very much contradicts itself. How can you be very good against the top 6 yet he cant create something from nothing? Thats exactly when you need a striker to do that, create something from nothing when hes working from scraps. Based on last season he isnt good enough full stop, but like others have said there is potential, but I think this season is make or break for him

Don't think it's contradictory, the two aren't polar opposites. He's good against top teams because he drops deep and provides more support to midfield, good workrate, and holds it up well....an enabler of others. His best performances were towards the end of the season, where he wasn't scoring. You need more than that against the lesser teams where we're controlling the ball and facing a flat back 10...more guile, intelligence, good runs in behind etc. Think we're broadly on the same page though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on August 06, 2019, 04:58:09 PM
Don't think it's contradictory, the two aren't polar opposites. He's good against top teams because he drops deep and provides more support to midfield, good workrate, and holds it up well....an enabler of others. His best performances were towards the end of the season, where he wasn't scoring. You need more than that against the lesser teams where we're controlling the ball and facing a flat back 10...more guile, intelligence, good runs in behind etc. Think we're broadly on the same page though.
A flat back 10 🤣🤣🤣 your killing me


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee_4_Life on August 06, 2019, 06:19:21 PM
Looks like my boy is getting the number 9.

For me what he needs to do this year is start being super aggressive with his physical abilities. Bully cbs not just to keep the ball or force an error, but lash them and get a shot off or come flying in for a big header.

Start being selfish and put your foot through the fucker.

He's got everything he needs to succeed, but he doesn't currently carry enough threat. Big year coming for Dom if he can add that, I'm saying 10 prem goals, 14 total.

Calvert-Lewin Season is upon us.

Interesting to see this posted AFTER the Kean signing.

How much play time do we expect DCL to get this year? Less than Kean? Even split?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on August 06, 2019, 06:22:34 PM
Interesting to see this posted AFTER the Kean signing.

How much play time do we expect DCL to get this year? Less than Kean? Even split?
70/30 in favour of Kean


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on August 06, 2019, 06:41:00 PM
70/30 in favour of Kean


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100/100 playing together like Sharp and Inchy!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 06, 2019, 07:01:12 PM
<KoemansNumberTens>Which coincidentally is how many career appearances he will make at Fleetwood</KoemansNumberTens>

1 goal every 6.50 games? No way he plays that many times for a side as good as Fleetwood
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on August 07, 2019, 12:13:39 AM
1 goal every 6.50 games? No way he plays that many times for a side as good as Fleetwood

and your at it again with your maths to suit you , do you really think all other member on here can't count or know how to workout goals per 90  :wanker:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on August 07, 2019, 12:32:55 AM
I think they will maybe overlap just a bit, but 70/30 as noted above seems about right to me.  I doubt you will see either go the full 90' that often.  We will want both players going full bore for the minutes they are on the pitch.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 07, 2019, 01:31:24 AM
and your at it again with your maths to suit you , do you really think all other member on here can't count or know how to workout goals per 90  :wanker:


Youíre a sensitive soul arenít you mark xx
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: howard1334 on August 07, 2019, 01:36:29 AM
It's interesting to me how one area he is performing really well in is his selfless work for the team and my main criticism of him is that he could be more selfish in front of goal.

It could be quite confusing trying to strike the right balance but I think a major part of this will be his decision-making as he matures.

If he gets that right we can hopefully still keep up all the great holding play and teamwork - as well as seeing an improved goal return for him.

I really want this to be his season when it starts to really come together for him. He has all the necessary parts, imo, but some self-assembly is still required...
I think the main criticism is that he is a poor finisher in front of goal.  He does not need to be more selfish, just better.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on August 20, 2019, 06:25:25 PM
Doing a q and a on sky sports twitter today

Good grief, whats he letting himelf in for

And no @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) you are vile shite is not a question
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 20, 2019, 06:36:51 PM
Doing a q and a on sky sports twitter today

Good grief, whats he letting himelf in for

And no @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) you are vile shite is not a question

Id be surprised if its that negative, I think he is pretty poor as far as strikers go, but I wouldnt ever go as far as to insult or abuse him. He works his socks off and gives everything when hes on the pitch and you cant knock him for that. I suspect he realises his record in-front of goal isnt great and its an area he needs to improve on massively, which if he does manage to do it then we have a proper player on our hands
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on August 20, 2019, 07:00:46 PM
Id be surprised if its that negative, I think he is pretty poor as far as strikers go, but I wouldnt ever go as far as to insult or abuse him.
This is Twitter though
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on August 20, 2019, 07:09:03 PM
If heís in the team his job is to bring our goal scorers into the game and help them get opportunities. Heís decent like that but I canít see him ever being anything more than a 1 in 4 striker. His record before us was poor and he doesnít have that knack of finishing.

Heís a decent player to have kind of like a poor mans Emile Heskey. But for us to move up to the next level we need better. I hope Kean is that man.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Duncs_a_legend on August 20, 2019, 07:17:58 PM
Theres always been a bit of OTT reactions for DCL both ways tbh. @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) has always been well too harsh but others are also forgiving a lot of his flaws.

Whatever we think, he must be doing what's expected of him, otherwise we'd be playing someone else in his position. He should be working on his finishing and that needs to improve, but it's not like he's not contributing anything, he's doing OK at the minute, nothing more and nothing less.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 20, 2019, 11:20:35 PM
Theres always been a bit of OTT reactions for DCL both ways tbh. @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) has always been well too harsh but others are also forgiving a lot of his flaws.

Whatever we think, he must be doing what's expected of him, otherwise we'd be playing someone else in his position. He should be working on his finishing and that needs to improve, but it's not like he's not contributing anything, he's doing OK at the minute, nothing more and nothing less.

Obviously everyone will disagree but I really donít think Iím especially harsh.
I just donít think heís a topflight player. Heís got his qualities in terms of work rate and being a distraction but itís pretty damming when ex players are saying he makes the wrong runs.

I know it really doesnít matter and itís just opinions but I find it incredibly frustrating when people are saying heís worth 40m or we should get a striker as cover rather than to replace him or that if you donít rate him you donít understand football. I just see something completely different hence I witter on about it endlessly
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 20, 2019, 11:24:28 PM
I will give you one billion pounds if you can find someone saying in earnest he's worth 40m pounds

I do think your view of the position is very narrow. He is being asked to do something different in different areas of the pitch than most strikers, most of that is on the midfield being unable to pass forwards, but yes, clearly he is not as strong a goal threat as he is a link up player, so it is quite obvious the threat he's missing. Would still like to see him play ahead of a midfield that actually creates a chance or two here or there.

However, one thing I'd say in your defence is, look at the media view and treatment of Tammy Abraham. A player in similar circumstances albeit with much better players around him. 3 games in and no goal so he's on the bench now, and there's talk about his chance being gone.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 20, 2019, 11:42:46 PM
I will give you one billion pounds if you can find someone saying in earnest he's worth 40m pounds

I do think your view of the position is very narrow. He is being asked to do something different in different areas of the pitch than most strikers, most of that is on the midfield being unable to pass forwards, but yes, clearly he is not as strong a goal threat as he is a link up player, so it is quite obvious the threat he's missing. Would still like to see him play ahead of a midfield that actually creates a chance or two here or there.

However, one thing I'd say in your defence is, look at the media view and treatment of Tammy Abraham. A player in similar circumstances albeit with much better players around him. 3 games in and no goal so he's on the bench now, and there's talk about his chance being gone.
I think he's only being asked to do different things to most other strikers for one reason, he can't do what most strikers can, score goals. It's good management in a sense as they're getting a tune out of him and it helps the team. Alan Smith mentioned it about another player yesterday, can't remember who, but he basically said if you wear the number 9 you will be judged on goals and DCL gets nowhere near enough. I don't rate Abraham, but I think he's definitely ahead of DCL in terms of quality, but that's how big teams act, you can't just carry passengers that aren't doing what they're essentially there to do in the hope they might come good

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 20, 2019, 11:55:03 PM
I will give you one billion pounds if you can find someone saying in earnest he's worth 40m pounds

I do think your view of the position is very narrow. He is being asked to do something different in different areas of the pitch than most strikers, most of that is on the midfield being unable to pass forwards, but yes, clearly he is not as strong a goal threat as he is a link up player, so it is quite obvious the threat he's missing. Would still like to see him play ahead of a midfield that actually creates a chance or two here or there.

However, one thing I'd say in your defence is, look at the media view and treatment of Tammy Abraham. A player in similar circumstances albeit with much better players around him. 3 games in and no goal so he's on the bench now, and there's talk about his chance being gone.

Heís referring to me.

In response to the constant ďchampionship standardĒ drivel, I countered by saying if DCL was to leave I believe it would be to a team better than us for around the £40m mark.

I probably fell into the trap of countering one extreme with another and know better not to get sucked into these discussions anymore.

Obviously this is something thatís been repeated on the forum about ten times since I said it, but Iíd like to think people kinda knew what point I was trying to make?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 20, 2019, 11:56:44 PM
I think he's only being asked to do different things to most other strikers for one reason, he can't do what most strikers can, score goals. It's good management in a sense as they're getting a tune out of him and it helps the team. Alan Smith mentioned it about another player yesterday, can't remember who, but he basically said if you wear the number 9 you will be judged on goals and DCL gets nowhere near enough. I don't rate Abraham, but I think he's definitely ahead of DCL in terms of quality, but that's how big teams act, you can't just carry passengers that aren't doing what they're essentially there to do in the how they might come good

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No mate, he's being asked to do it because the team needs it.

Outside of a quick break up the flanks, we don't have a way of getting up the pitch in possession without asking him to rag his arse around selflessly.

However, we don't the have a way of making good chances once we are up there.

Our good chances come from quick breaks up the flanks. Our wide men are taking more chances or cutting it back to ghosti than our strikers, and that's because of the side and football we're having to play.

When we fix the midfield we might see something different, but until then expect a parade of strikers who can either pull their tripe out selflessly without a sniff of a chance, or fellas who can finish but don't get anywhere near the ball on a quick break so fail anyway (Tosun is a v good finisher, but unless he going to push Sigurdsson out the way on the edge of the box at the end of a break then he won't get a chance).

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 20, 2019, 11:57:56 PM
Heís referring to me.

In response to the constant ďchampionship standardĒ drivel, I countered by saying if DCL was to leave I believe it would be to a team better than us for around the £40m mark.

I probably fell into the trap of countering one extreme with another and know better not to get sucked into these discussions anymore.

Obviously this is something thatís been repeated on the forum about ten times since I said it, but Iíd like to think people kinda knew what point I was trying to make?

Well thank you ram now I am in one billion pounds of debt with the grumpiest man on the planet
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 21, 2019, 12:24:33 AM
Well thank you ram now I am in one billion pounds of debt with the grumpiest man on the planet

One billion pounds? Absolute BANG average, should be a trillion.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on August 21, 2019, 12:44:20 AM
At least it's in the DCL thread.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 21, 2019, 01:00:24 AM
No mate, he's being asked to do it because the team needs it.

Outside of a quick break up the flanks, we don't have a way of getting up the pitch in possession without asking him to rag his arse around selflessly.

However, we don't the have a way of making good chances once we are up there.

Our good chances come from quick breaks up the flanks. Our wide men are taking more chances or cutting it back to ghosti than our strikers, and that's because of the side and football we're having to play.

When we fix the midfield we might see something different, but until then expect a parade of strikers who can either pull their tripe out selflessly without a sniff of a chance, or fellas who can finish but don't get anywhere near the ball on a quick break so fail anyway (Tosun is a v good finisher, but unless he going to push Sigurdsson out the way on the edge of the box at the end of a break then he won't get a chance).



I wouldnít say this was some sort of thankless task compared to most other forwards in the league though. Certainly outside of the top 6.

Obviously hindered a bit by Sig not touching the ball much but equally his best games have been where the physical or running and jumping, side of things has been able to stand out.

Flick round the corner to Richarlison was good at the weekend, thatís where heís strong with the ball. but itís the heavy physical stuff that results in solid hold up play and moves the team right up the pitch more consistently thatís still lacking. understandably as itís something most strikers pick up with age unless theyíre really, really good.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on August 21, 2019, 01:02:09 AM
I feel I repeat my same thoughts on DCL periodically, I like him but he has a lot more to prove. Until then he is bound to have detractors.

The really super simple basic litmus test that he doesn't yet pass (for me) is are opposition fans and defenders nervous when he plays or comes on as a substitute when we're chasing a game? Again, for me, not yet. He can be a thorn in the side but he's not that regular threat/menace a side with our aspirations should be relying on. That doesn't necessarily even mean scoring goals, I'm sure everyone can think of players who come on and change the dynamic of a front line so that pressure builds and the team as a unit finds a way through. He needs to find that niche though to be that threat, he doesn't have blistering pace so if he's not scoring a ton he needs to hold it up and knock defenders off their stride and play in others with more regularity.

Can he get there, sure. I suspect though if he doesn't get there in the 2-3 seasons he'll likely be headed elsewhere.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 21, 2019, 01:15:04 AM
I wouldnít say this was some sort of thankless task compared to most other forwards in the league though. Certainly outside of the top 6.

Obviously hindered a bit by Sig not touching the ball much but equally his best games have been where the physical or running and jumping, side of things has been able to stand out.

Flick round the corner to Richarlison was good at the weekend, thatís where heís strong with the ball. but itís the heavy physical stuff that results in solid hold up play and moves the team right up the pitch more consistently thatís still lacking. understandably as itís something most strikers pick up with age unless theyíre really, really good.

Not by any means suggesting he's the finished package, even in regards to his hold up / link up.

I just mean - there's a reason a player who probably admittedly isn't ready to play 2000 minutes up front for a team that would like to go for Europa places is playing over Tosun or Niasse or a new proper front man signing we must have decided not to make (or maybe even Kean altho obv he is bedding him in).

The team needs what he is doing, even if it isnt immediately apparent.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 21, 2019, 01:30:03 AM
Not by any means suggesting he's the finished package, even in regards to his hold up / link up.

I just mean - there's a reason a player who probably admittedly isn't ready to play 2000 minutes up front for a team that would like to go for Europa places is playing over Tosun or Niasse or a new proper front man signing we must have decided not to make (or maybe even Kean altho obv he is bedding him in).

The team needs what he is doing, even if it isnt immediately apparent.

Right yes.

I think runs/ positioning is where he needs to make improvements for now just to get involved a bit more.

Jump is very good so knowing angles etc to increase the times he wins the ball would make a difference re providing a platform.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ally2 on August 21, 2019, 01:32:38 AM
I was thinking that an interesting comparison might be Marcus Bent.  Remember him?  He was great at everything but couldn't score enough goals.  He absolutely worked his arse off in the season we fiished 4th (god its depressing calling it that).  DCL may have a higher ceiling though because of his age.  Bent also couldn't stay at a club for more than two seasons without falling out with someone or wanting a fresh signing on fee.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 21, 2019, 01:47:13 AM
Right yes.

I think runs/ positioning is where he needs to make improvements for now just to get involved a bit more.

Jump is very good so knowing angles etc to increase the times he wins the ball would make a difference re providing a platform.



For someone so good with aerial balls, he's never in the mix off corners or crosses.

Good finisher with his head but yes as you say, needs to use his abilities and get in the mix more, especially considering how much we rely on crosses. Doesn't make sense at the minute so think the problem must be with him really.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on August 21, 2019, 01:52:45 AM
I recall him having a cheeky finish in his locker. And he also has a decent hit on him, I think Newcastle he showed what he could do when he puts his laces through it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 21, 2019, 02:10:30 AM
For someone so good with aerial balls, he's never in the mix off corners or crosses.

Good finisher with his head but yes as you say, needs to use his abilities and get in the mix more, especially considering how much we rely on crosses. Doesn't make sense at the minute so think the problem must be with him really.

Think he and Sig compound each otherís problems when weíre not playing well (but equally complement when they do).

Sig better when having things presented to him. But DCL would benefit from someone who was looking for the ball all the time if he wasnít winning it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on August 21, 2019, 05:05:51 AM
Think he and Sig compound each other's problems when we're not playing well (but equally complement when they do).

Sig better when having things presented to him. But DCL would benefit from someone who was looking for the ball all the time if he wasn't winning it.

Iíd like to see what he would be like with a functioning midfield who can progress through the middle of the pitch but sadly I donít think heíll ever get that chance.

I think this season weíll start to transition away from Sigurdsson and into a link player as the No10, whilst at the same time moving from DCL to Kean. When Kean does well people will point to it as evidence that DCL wasnít up to scratch, but there will be other factors too it IMO
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 21, 2019, 06:26:37 PM
I will give you one billion pounds if you can find someone saying in earnest he's worth 40m pounds

I do think your view of the position is very narrow. He is being asked to do something different in different areas of the pitch than most strikers, most of that is on the midfield being unable to pass forwards, but yes, clearly he is not as strong a goal threat as he is a link up player, so it is quite obvious the threat he's missing. Would still like to see him play ahead of a midfield that actually creates a chance or two here or there.

However, one thing I'd say in your defence is, look at the media view and treatment of Tammy Abraham. A player in similar circumstances albeit with much better players around him. 3 games in and no goal so he's on the bench now, and there's talk about his chance being gone.

Was said on here only about a week ago by a regular and popular poster. 40m and arsenal and spurs would want him at the price

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 21, 2019, 06:29:24 PM
Well thank you ram now I am in one billion pounds of debt with the grumpiest man on the planet

Keep it. Iíd only spend it on 25 DCLs and be disappointed
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 21, 2019, 06:31:12 PM
Was said on here only about a week ago by a regular and popular poster. 40m and arsenal and spurs would want him at the price



Said it once mate, and tbh I'm not that convinced by the argument myself, so lets put a stop to banging on about it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on August 21, 2019, 07:45:35 PM
Said it once mate, and tbh I'm not that convinced by the argument myself, so lets put a stop to banging on about it.

Good luck with that.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on August 21, 2019, 07:46:05 PM
Said it once mate, and tbh I'm not that convinced by the argument myself, so lets put a stop to banging on about it.

"popular"
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 21, 2019, 07:58:49 PM
Said it once mate, and tbh I'm not that convinced by the argument myself, so lets put a stop to banging on about it.

You did defend your point of view too. I still get regular mentions about lukakus kick ups so I canít promise I wonít mention this now and again
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 21, 2019, 08:00:02 PM
"popular"

Got eeeeeeem
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 21, 2019, 09:36:20 PM
Big Mick1995 has done me there.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 23, 2019, 02:54:15 AM
Top lad

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/calvert-lewin-dominic-everton-kean-16795013.amp
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 23, 2019, 03:08:20 AM
Top lad

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/calvert-lewin-dominic-everton-kean-16795013.amp

He definitely doesnít ďjust have to keep doing what heís been doingĒ
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on August 23, 2019, 03:14:23 AM
He definitely doesn't "just have to keep doing what he's been doingĒ

Bloody hell, what a surprise that youíre first to comment on it!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 23, 2019, 03:21:18 AM
Bloody hell, what a surprise that youíre first to comment on it!

Well heís talking nonsense. He needs vast improvements rather than to just keep doing what heís been doing. Itís a complete lack of awareness it he thinks itís good enough
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 23, 2019, 03:33:04 AM
Well heís talking nonsense. He needs vast improvements rather than to just keep doing what heís been doing. Itís a complete lack of awareness it he thinks itís good enough

Mate, have you not learned to decipher player media speak yet? It's just that. It's not indicative of anything. He's a striker and a bright lad. He knows he needs to offer more goals and assists, and more shots on goal generally.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: NickNack on August 23, 2019, 03:47:58 AM
The ďkeep doing what Iíve been doingĒ quote was referring to leading the line as a lone striker, which since the end of last season he has done well. He admits further down the page that he needs to score more goals - heís clearly aware of that.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 23, 2019, 03:49:16 AM
Youíre wasting your time lads.

Heís beyond rationale that fella.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TSGun on August 23, 2019, 04:06:40 AM
Haha in the words of the great Phill Jupitus "...this is why people are killed with hammers"
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 23, 2019, 08:42:41 PM
Youíre wasting your time lads.

Heís beyond rationale that fella.

My opinion on him is a hell of a lot more rational than yours. Granted youíre desperately trying to roll your arsenal or spurs for 40m claim back now 😉
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 23, 2019, 08:45:35 PM
Mate, have you not learned to decipher player media speak yet? It's just that. It's not indicative of anything. He's a striker and a bright lad. He knows he needs to offer more goals and assists, and more shots on goal generally.

Thatís normally what they say when itís going well and they are being modest. Not when itís going shit
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 23, 2019, 08:47:08 PM
Anyways this time next year weíll only be able to mention it in the general forum when he scores 1 of his 6 goals for sheff Wednesday
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary1878 on August 23, 2019, 09:42:39 PM
DCL is well aware he needs goals and fast, and he knows he is under pressure to deliver. When he says "keep doing what I'm doing", I think he means work hard and keep improving, and doesn't necessarily refer to his recent/past performances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on August 23, 2019, 10:34:10 PM
This is from the games since xmas,, he played 90 mins unless stated

man c v ev    3 shots     1 goal
ev v spurs     1 shot
burnley v ev  1 shot                 played 67mins
brighton v ev 0 shot
ev v liecester 1 shot
ev v lincon     1 shot                played 46mins
ev v bourn    1 shot    1 goal     played  3 mins
south h v ev   1 shot                played 33mins
millwal v ev   2 shots               played 65mins
huddersf v ev  0 shots             played 4mins
ev v wolves     2 shots             played 7mins
ev v man c      0 shots
watford v ev  2 shots                played 16mins
cardif v ev  2 shots    1 goal     
ev v liverpool  2 shots              played 74mins
new c v ev    2 shots   1 goal
ev v chelsea  3  shots
west h v ev   6 shots              played 88mins
ev v arsenal  2 shots
fulham v ev  3 shots
ev v man u   1 shot
palace v ev   5 shots         played 73mins
ev v burnley  4 shots
this season
palace v ev   1 shot       played 69mins
ev v watford  0 shots     played 72mins

so as you can see he isnt exactly getting chances gifted on a plate bar 3 games where he had 6 shots,, 5 shots and 4 and then in 3 games he had 3 shots in each
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Tinga on August 23, 2019, 11:35:53 PM
So. Is he good enough for where we want to be?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 23, 2019, 11:47:35 PM
So. Is he good enough for where we want to be?

To start, no.

To be in our squad, yes.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on August 24, 2019, 12:58:24 AM
To start, no.

To be in our squad, yes.

And Moise Kean was brought in to START.  And he will, at Marco's chosen time.  Dom is useful, and will remain useful.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 24, 2019, 01:25:59 AM
This is from the games since xmas,, he played 90 mins unless stated

man c v ev    3 shots     1 goal
ev v spurs     1 shot
burnley v ev  1 shot                 played 67mins
brighton v ev 0 shot
ev v liecester 1 shot
ev v lincon     1 shot                played 46mins
ev v bourn    1 shot    1 goal     played  3 mins
south h v ev   1 shot                played 33mins
millwal v ev   2 shots               played 65mins
huddersf v ev  0 shots             played 4mins
ev v wolves     2 shots             played 7mins
ev v man c      0 shots
watford v ev  2 shots                played 16mins
cardif v ev  2 shots    1 goal     
ev v liverpool  2 shots              played 74mins
new c v ev    2 shots   1 goal
ev v chelsea  3  shots
west h v ev   6 shots              played 88mins
ev v arsenal  2 shots
fulham v ev  3 shots
ev v man u   1 shot
palace v ev   5 shots         played 73mins
ev v burnley  4 shots
this season
palace v ev   1 shot       played 69mins
ev v watford  0 shots     played 72mins

so as you can see he isnt exactly getting chances gifted on a plate bar 3 games where he had 6 shots,, 5 shots and 4 and then in 3 games he had 3 shots in each

Is 3 shots not quite a lot? Only ask cos I saw something like 5to1 on 1 of the arsenal strikers getting 3 shots on target last weekend
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ilikebrunettesisback on August 24, 2019, 02:51:26 AM
Hate hate hate hate hate him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bally on August 24, 2019, 02:53:55 AM
Hate hate hate hate hate him
Who the fuck let you back in

OR did the rock you were living under shift and you decided to crawl out for a bit.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 24, 2019, 02:54:46 AM
To start, no.

To be in our squad, yes.

Id agree, but he wouldnt get in to many match day squads. hes good at wearing the opposition down, if you wanted someone off the bench to come on and score id rather go with Tosun or Niasse. Hes genuinely really, really poor. If there is a striker that starts for his team more often than not thats worst than him Im yet to see it
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Duncs_a_legend on August 24, 2019, 03:52:13 AM
No excuses really, he was very poor tonight, as was the rest of the team. He should be scoring his chance.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 24, 2019, 03:56:15 AM
Hes dog shit. He wouldn't start games for any of the other 19 sides
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bally on August 24, 2019, 03:56:59 AM
Hes dog shit. He wouldn't start games for any of the other 19 sides
Do you not like DCL

Fuck me you have hid that well...

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on August 24, 2019, 03:58:06 AM
Completely given up on him, no strikers instinct at all.

We donít look like scoring with him on the pitch.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 24, 2019, 03:58:59 AM
Do you not like DCL

Fuck me you have hid that well...

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Sure he's a lovely lad but he's crap at football.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 24, 2019, 04:02:15 AM
Completely given up on him, no strikers instinct at all.

We donít look like scoring with him on the pitch.

And people on here were turning their nose up at the remote possibility of getting Lukaku back but are consistently willing to give DCL the benefit of the doubt. Id give my misses right arm to get someone like Rom back into our team!!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Duncs_a_legend on August 24, 2019, 04:04:07 AM
It's hard to give him too much shit as the whole team was shite, we deserved absolutely nothing from that game, but his job is to score goals and he had a good chance to do that tonight.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on August 24, 2019, 04:04:58 AM
They guy isn't helped by lack of creativity. Hed bag in better teams. Doesn't help himself though as he doesn't seem to have striker instinct. Kean must come in now
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 24, 2019, 04:07:09 AM
They guy isn't helped by lack of creativity. Hed bag in better teams. Doesn't help himself though as he doesn't seem to have striker instinct. Kean must come in now

His movements shite
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 24, 2019, 04:08:04 AM
It's hardly a study in cohesion until it gets to DCL.

Still, Evertonions love a scapegoat.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on August 24, 2019, 04:09:08 AM
And people on here were turning their nose up at the remote possibility of getting Lukaku back but are consistently willing to give DCL the benefit of the doubt. Id give my misses right arm to get someone like Rom back into our team!!

and that would be a waste of a good arm no player is going to score with no one setting them up but lets all jump on the kid playing up top 22 year old cant wait to see what happens when the same 3 are behind the 19 year old
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on August 24, 2019, 04:13:52 AM
His movements shite

I'd say he doesn't get into right positions enough. But we domt get the ball I to him anyway.

Iwobi looks like he can pick a through ball out. But I'd be giving kean a chance next week
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 24, 2019, 04:14:17 AM
I think he was boss tonight, but he has to score that chance.

No future at this level if heís not netting that, but I think it will come in time.

Would like kean to start games from now on though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Old England Toffee on August 24, 2019, 04:37:17 AM

Still, Evertonions love a scapegoat.

So so true sadly. Itís so predictable as well we get rid of one scapegoat and you can see whoís gonna be the next. Itís often someone who whilst may not be amazing is the last player who should be getting shit, osman springs to mind
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 24, 2019, 04:45:05 AM
Lads... If the ball never goes near him what the fuck dya want him to do.

Sides shite, tactics shite, who's surprised the striker is looking poor.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on August 24, 2019, 04:48:03 AM
This!

https://twitter.com/vinerbrian/status/1165014531426402304
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ilikebrunettesisback on August 24, 2019, 04:50:47 AM
Who the fuck let you back in

OR did the rock you were living under shift and you decided to crawl out for a bit.

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Sorry mush. X
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 24, 2019, 04:51:31 AM
This!

https://twitter.com/vinerbrian/status/1165014531426402304
And when the alternative is a 19 year old and been in the country two weeks........
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ilikebrunettesisback on August 24, 2019, 04:52:54 AM
They guy isn't helped by lack of creativity. Hed bag in better teams. Doesn't help himself though as he doesn't seem to have striker instinct. Kean must come in now

Lack of creativity? Like the absolute sitter he missed. Inject him with influenza and be done with it
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Simon Paul on August 24, 2019, 04:53:35 AM
he's not a "main number 9" is he?

there's nothing wrong in not being that.  it's about levels and expectations.

he's a decent impact sub, he's a good support striker - to hold the ball up and provide support for a main striker.

but he's not going to pull any trees up on his own up top.  it's a bit unfair that the club haven't brought in that "main striker" ever since Lukaku went.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on August 24, 2019, 04:55:05 AM
He's not good enough, can't keep going over the same thing every week
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ilikebrunettesisback on August 24, 2019, 04:59:42 AM
Lads... If the ball never goes near him what the fuck dya want him to do.

Sides shite, tactics shite, who's surprised the striker is looking poor.

He's fucking shit. End of.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Stumpy on August 24, 2019, 05:11:55 AM
He's not good enough, can't keep going over the same thing every week

I honestly can't get my head around what anybody see's in him.He simply isn't up to the job.He is not a premier league player.As macca said we can't keep starting with him.I am amazed we didn't sign another striker as well as kean because if anything happens to him we are back where we have been for the last 2 seasons,three strikers simply not good enough.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on August 24, 2019, 05:41:56 AM
Honestly, I donít think you could tell if he is good or not in this side.

You could stick Lukaku back up top and he wouldnít do much better
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on August 24, 2019, 05:44:15 AM
I honestly can't get my head around what anybody see's in him.He simply isn't up to the job.He is not a premier league player.As macca said we can't keep starting with him.I am amazed we didn't sign another striker as well as kean because if anything happens to him we are back where we have been for the last 2 seasons,three strikers simply not good enough.

Didnt mean to like that,, he had 1 shot the only shot on target in the whole game
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on August 24, 2019, 05:47:30 AM
Do you not like DCL

Fuck me you have hid that well...

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This has made my fucking weekend fell off my fucking chair pissing myself brew on the deck smashed the wifes cup the lot ....thanks Bally  lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 24, 2019, 06:35:16 AM
In a good side a striker gets 2 or 3 chances like that. Low, hard, on target... They won't be able to keep getting men on the line to clear it.

He runs about for 90 minutes getting balls launched up in the air at him and is expected to Bury his one chance.

It was a good chance, would have liked him to finish it of course, but it isn't a nice task playing in this side and he did fine with his effort, they just made a good block.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 24, 2019, 01:46:55 PM
In a good side a striker gets 2 or 3 chances like that. Low, hard, on target... They won't be able to keep getting men on the line to clear it.

He runs about for 90 minutes getting balls launched up in the air at him and is expected to Bury his one chance.

It was a good chance, would have liked him to finish it of course, but it isn't a nice task playing in this side and he did fine with his effort, they just made a good block.

He runs yes.

But his hold up play isnít actually that good.

Look again that the difference the other team's striker makes.

Backing in all the time, making it difficult for the CBs

DCL is effective if heís running into channels etc but thatís not always possible.

Last night barely held it up from long balls, his touch wasnít great and missed the sitter.

As said, a lot of these things come with age etc but pinning most things on the system is wide of the mark imo
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: penguinofdoom1878 on August 24, 2019, 02:27:28 PM
Take him out of the firing line for a bit, the pressure is building and building on him and he's still only 22. He's averaging 0.7 shots per game at the moment, 1 goal every 8 games in the league as well, that's not good enough for a Premier League striker. His passing is also at 61.4% for a hold up player as claimed he completes 9 out of 15 a game.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: everton15 on August 24, 2019, 03:07:52 PM
I honestly can't get my head around what anybody see's in him.He simply isn't up to the job.He is not a premier league player.As macca said we can't keep starting with him.I am amazed we didn't sign another striker as well as kean because if anything happens to him we are back where we have been for the last 2 seasons,three strikers simply not good enough.
agreed  - don't like saying it but DCL championship player at best - get moise kean on from the start and can always bring dcl on from the bench if needed like a super sub -
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on August 24, 2019, 03:09:53 PM
Honestly, I donít think you could tell if he is good or not in this side.

You could stick Lukaku back up top and he wouldnít do much better

Donít be silly.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on August 24, 2019, 03:14:48 PM
Noticed a lot of balls played up to him and he just flicked them on aimlessly and it broke down.

Now I know Sig was probably stood 15 yards away watching but if thatís the case itís not good enough to just get your head on it and then watch it fly nowhere near a team-mate.

He needs to be cuter. Try and chest it down, back in to the defender so itís at the very least a contested challenge, or take up a better position in the first place so you arenít so isolated.

Itís not picking at him, heís just not a very good target man.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on August 24, 2019, 04:25:22 PM
And when the alternative is a 19 year old and been in the country two weeks........
Its depressing because as good as a transfer window we've had we've still left ourselves light in the area we all knew we needed to sort out the most.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 24, 2019, 04:39:09 PM
He runs yes.

But his hold up play isnít actually that good.

Look again that the difference the other team's striker makes.

Backing in all the time, making it difficult for the CBs

DCL is effective if heís running into channels etc but thatís not always possible.

Last night barely held it up from long balls, his touch wasnít great and missed the sitter.

As said, a lot of these things come with age etc but pinning most things on the system is wide of the mark imo

Well either way it is the system like.

Okay, Wesley gave a bit of a clinic there (first ten I thought we had him figured but he grew into the game massively) and just Rondon'd us. DCL was miles off that, but we have seen him have games where he has been capable of good hold up. City for example.

I said the other day he isn't ready to be playing so much, certainly not in such a thankless role.

But the system is entirely reliant on him having a very good game, when it works it works when it doesn't he's blamed.

Or, recruitment if we'd like to put the spotlight on mister Brands instead.

How much spent and we have a midfield of ghosts and two unproven lads as our strikers?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on August 24, 2019, 04:43:02 PM
Well either way it is the system like.

Okay, Wesley gave a bit of a clinic there (first ten I thought we had him figured but he grew into the game massively) and just Rondon'd us. DCL was miles off that, but we have seen him have games where he has been capable of good hold up. City for example.

I said the other day he isn't ready to be playing so much, certainly not in such a thankless role.

But the system is entirely reliant on him having a very good game, when it works it works when it doesn't he's blamed.

Or, recruitment if we'd like to put the spotlight on mister Brands instead.

How much spent and we have a midfield of ghosts and two unproven lads as our strikers?

I don't like what you're saying but I think there's more truth in that than I'm happy with 😔
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on August 24, 2019, 04:51:55 PM
Not picking on him or even going down the route of if heís good enough; thatís all been covered a million times. What I will say though, is that he isnít playing like someone whoís just been given the sacred no.9 shirt or like a player thatís got one of Europeís hottest young strikers on his tail. Thereís been no elevation to his game, thus far.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on August 24, 2019, 05:18:23 PM
Well either way it is the system like.

Okay, Wesley gave a bit of a clinic there (first ten I thought we had him figured but he grew into the game massively) and just Rondon'd us. DCL was miles off that, but we have seen him have games where he has been capable of good hold up. City for example.

I said the other day he isn't ready to be playing so much, certainly not in such a thankless role.

But the system is entirely reliant on him having a very good game, when it works it works when it doesn't he's blamed.

Or, recruitment if we'd like to put the spotlight on mister Brands instead.

How much spent and we have a midfield of ghosts and two unproven lads as our strikers?

The system is only to blame if what is being asked of him is unreasonable.

I suspect weíll find out soon enough when he is dropped how much is the system vs DCL.

I do agree that we have asked a lot of strikers in recent years, Lukaku had many games when he appeared very isolated. The difference is he would take that one chance to perhaps mask those shortcomings.

Overall, I read the above and itís an argument for him not being a regular starter. Which I think a lot of people of been suggesting. The fact that the clearest example of doing the role we need requires going back to the beginning of the Koeman should be a pretty massive red flag.

He is either not quite ready, or not good enough to be our go to regular starting striker. Itís one of the two. I donít think the answer to that is easy for either side of this argument to claim categorically and without reasonable doubt.

Personally, I still think he is far better suited to playing from the bench for the time being. There are far more games you can point to and say be impacted that way. Itís perhaps even possible that that role could be what he is best suited to regardless of age. Some strikers are just more effective from the bench.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 24, 2019, 06:10:36 PM
Yeah I think in the summer when I was saying we don't need a striker I was wrong tbh.

But at the same time I'm not sure what will happen when we drop him and start launching the ball up to Kean and he gets one half chance per game when lucky.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Tofifee on August 24, 2019, 06:14:07 PM
we don't need a striker, we have one, a brilliant Italian one, on his arse. on the bench!!
We just need to drop DCL
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 24, 2019, 06:40:12 PM
Yeah I think in the summer when I was saying we don't need a striker I was wrong tbh.

But at the same time I'm not sure what will happen when we drop him and start launching the ball up to Kean and he gets one half chance per game when lucky.

He gets more chances than DCL because heís a better striker.

I wouldnít have faith in DCL scoring that Wesley chance, never mind the one that was put on a plate for him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 24, 2019, 06:47:53 PM
He gets more chances than DCL because he’s a better striker.

I wouldn’t have faith in DCL scoring that Wesley chance, never mind the one that was put on a plate for him.

I broadly agree that he will be more dangerous when we have the ball in the final third. Xg wise DCL scores about as much as he should do for what we create. Doesn't take I to account volume tho as you rightly say.

For me the issue is still the side creates fuck all and dropping a good finisher into it doesn't make more chances it just drags the striker down to the sides level.

Hooe Wobes helps sorts that and tbh I think he will help.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 24, 2019, 06:48:55 PM
Yeah I think in the summer when I was saying we don't need a striker I was wrong tbh.

But at the same time I'm not sure what will happen when we drop him and start launching the ball up to Kean and he gets one half chance per game when lucky.

I dont think we will launch the ball up to him as hes a much more adapt footballer that can add to the build up play, DCL literally has one use, running. Its bang the ball to him down the line and let him try to tire the opposition out, thats it
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 24, 2019, 06:54:29 PM
I dont think we will launch the ball up to him as hes a much more adapt footballer that can add to the build up play, DCL literally has one use, running. Its bang the ball to him down the line and let him try to tire the opposition out, thats it

Wait so how does the ball get to him?

Is he going to pass it to himself?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 24, 2019, 07:00:07 PM
Wait so how does the ball get to him?

Is he going to pass it to himself?

Obviously not, I think Kean will unite the play between front and midfield and the chances will come because he is a natural goalscorer and from what ive seen so far hes lightyears ahead of DCL as a footballer and the players know that. They dont want to put the ball in the box as DCL wont be there, Kean will, hence more chance will be created.

With DCL its like going in to the shop and buying a Euromillions ticket, walking outside and chucking it straight in the bin as you know theres really fuck all chance you'll win. With Kean I think they'll hold onto that ticket in the belief they will get some return, it might not happen, but they'll give it a go regardless.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on August 24, 2019, 07:39:15 PM
Obviously not, I think Kean will unite the play between front and midfield and the chances will come because he is a natural goalscorer and from what ive seen so far hes lightyears ahead of DCL as a footballer and the players know that. They dont want to put the ball in the box as DCL wont be there, Kean will, hence more chance will be created.

With DCL its like going in to the shop and buying a Euromillions ticket, walking outside and chucking it straight in the bin as you know theres really fuck all chance you'll win. With Kean I think they'll hold onto that ticket in the belief they will get some return, it might not happen, but they'll give it a go regardless.

kean playing between the front and midfield,, did that happen then when he came on last night??, no, our only way of progressing into the box is from either wings by crossing,, 24 crosses last night,, in the last 20 mins 6-8 times we had the ball right in front of their defence with either sniders or gomez in possession and every time its pushed out to the wings,,each one of those times we couldve passed the ball through the middle and we didnt we do exactly the same thing every game,, the players dont even look for the ball because they know its not coming because we dont play that way,,one point last night when iwobi had the ball and picks a through ball for the player to run on to and the player didnt even bother because we dont play like that instead was probably looking for it to his feet so he could cross it in,,the simple reason why we cant break teams down is we are incapable of playing through the middle
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Tinga on August 24, 2019, 08:55:29 PM
(https://preview.redd.it/4f1fer3dl9i31.jpg?width=576&auto=webp&s=1058d5803e62630bb4eda36af7dcddd5ab8615cc)

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 24, 2019, 10:17:51 PM
fucking awful that is.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 24, 2019, 10:24:22 PM
Obviously not, I think Kean will unite the play between front and midfield and the chances will come because he is a natural goalscorer and from what ive seen so far hes lightyears ahead of DCL as a footballer and the players know that. They dont want to put the ball in the box as DCL wont be there, Kean will, hence more chance will be created.

With DCL its like going in to the shop and buying a Euromillions ticket, walking outside and chucking it straight in the bin as you know theres really fuck all chance you'll win. With Kean I think they'll hold onto that ticket in the belief they will get some return, it might not happen, but they'll give it a go regardless.


On what do you base your view that he's a natural goalscorer?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on August 24, 2019, 11:11:22 PM
Iím hoping Iwobi takes Sigs place and Kean for DCL.

In the cameo last night Iwobiís head was up, he was on the ball and looking to play forward all the time.

Kean was similarly looking to be direct.

I think those two could make a great 9 and 10. Letís see it next game.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Tinga on August 24, 2019, 11:30:41 PM
Iím hoping Iwobi takes Sigs place and Kean for DCL.

In the cameo last night Iwobiís head was up, he was on the ball and looking to play forward all the time.

Kean was similarly looking to be direct.

I think those two could make a great 9 and 10. Letís see it next game.

If DCL and Sig start I might start to get a bit worried.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 25, 2019, 12:02:02 AM
On what do you base your view that he's a natural goalscorer?
The fact he's one of the most highly sought after young strikers in the world and cost us 26 million when he's only played about 10 games

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 12:29:23 AM
The fact he's one of the most highly sought after young strikers in the world and cost us 26 million when he's only played about 10 games

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But natural finisher is rather specific. Any evidence?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 25, 2019, 12:44:27 AM
But natural finisher is rather specific. Any evidence?
Ffs, okay I'll rephrase it, I'll be amazed if he's not better in front of goal that DCL. Granted its not hard, but hopefully that works for you?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 12:48:08 AM
Ffs, okay I'll rephrase it, I'll be amazed if he's not better in front of goal that DCL. Granted its not hard, but hopefully that works for you?

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You are convinced by the hype. That's fine, we all hope you're right.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 25, 2019, 01:01:31 AM
You are convinced by the hype. That's fine, we all hope you're right.
Not at all, I don't know if he'll make it or not, but from the small snippets I've seen of him id happily put all my money on him finishing better than DCL, and that's also down to the fact I've seen enough of DCL to realise he couldn't score in a brothel. Ive said it a bit but I really think we needed to get a senior striker who is a little more proven but that never happened.
Maybe natural goalscorer is a bit much, but it wouldn't sound that complimentary if I said he'll be better than someone that's wank!

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 01:11:10 AM
Xg about the same.

I imagine juve have a few better creators than ourselves an all tbh.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 01:31:00 AM
Not at all, I don't know if he'll make it or not, but from the small snippets I've seen of him id happily put all my money on him finishing better than DCL, and that's also down to the fact I've seen enough of DCL to realise he couldn't score in a brothel. Ive said it a bit but I really think we needed to get a senior striker who is a little more proven but that never happened.
Maybe natural goalscorer is a bit much, but it wouldn't sound that complimentary if I said he'll be better than someone that's wank!

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Being a better finisher than DCL does not amount to natural finisher.
You understand that?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 25, 2019, 02:09:05 AM
Xg about the same.

I imagine juve have a few better creators than ourselves an all tbh.

Admittedly based on a very small sample but first impressions make me think he just has better footballing instincts.

Iíve a suspicion that we donít pass it forward as much because we canít rely on any of the normal front 4 to receive the ball to either show, or control it.

Think DCL shows up highly in the % of how we get up the pitch as a ball up the middle is an easy pass.

If the ball is sticking with Iwobi, say, then the % of times we need to lob it up the middle drops. Iím taking the last 30 mins to be more indicative of what we actually want to do - and they involved barely any DCL long ball targets.

If we were just hoofing it long all the time we wouldnít bother with short goal kicks etc.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on August 25, 2019, 02:32:45 AM
Admittedly based on a very small sample but first impressions make me think he just has better footballing instincts.

Iíve a suspicion that we donít pass it forward as much because we canít rely on any of the normal front 4 to receive the ball to either show, or control it.

Think DCL shows up highly in the % of how we get up the pitch as a ball up the middle is an easy pass.

If the ball is sticking with Iwobi, say, then the % of times we need to lob it up the middle drops. Iím taking the last 30 mins to be more indicative of what we actually want to do - and they involved barely any DCL long ball targets.

If we were just hoofing it long all the time we wouldnít bother with short goal kicks etc.



Thought in our previous game Keanís turn and shot on the edge of the box after the ball deflected into his path was to me promising. It is almost that instinct to be aware and go for goal at any half decent opportunity that DCL is above all missing. I can barely think of many times he even tried to shoot in our first few games.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 02:39:53 AM
Admittedly based on a very small sample but first impressions make me think he just has better footballing instincts.

I’ve a suspicion that we don’t pass it forward as much because we can’t rely on any of the normal front 4 to receive the ball to either show, or control it.

Think DCL shows up highly in the % of how we get up the pitch as a ball up the middle is an easy pass.

If the ball is sticking with Iwobi, say, then the % of times we need to lob it up the middle drops. I’m taking the last 30 mins to be more indicative of what we actually want to do - and they involved barely any DCL long ball targets.

If we were just hoofing it long all the time we wouldn’t bother with short goal kicks etc.



The xg comment was just weighing into a discussion on 'natural finisher' and judging finishing ability to be honest. I'd be absolutely blown away if he's not more dangerous than DCL.

Edit : didn't get a single shot off apparently.

I think Iwobi will improve it as well. Infact I'm counting on it.

Don't know if you can take anything from the last 20 minutes of that match to be honest. They were dropping deep to keep the win, we had two strikers on the pitch for much of it etc.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on August 25, 2019, 04:33:21 AM
I like DCL, he works hard and that, that's about it though, he might score a shit load in the Championship, right now he's a premier league striker who doesn't score goals, he's not good enough to score goals and yet fans keep depending him, it's ridiculous
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Omar on August 25, 2019, 04:42:25 AM
DCL, there's the bench, lad.

~Marco
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on August 25, 2019, 05:22:02 AM
Surely it would be better then playing him in a 4-4-2 with either tosun or kean,, i know some will say siggs technically plays along side him anyway but he hasnt been as effective as a proper striker probably would be,, i just think its crazy expecting either   dcl , kean or tosun playing the lone ranger role to excell if there not gÚod enough or new the the league especially if there not scoring enough
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: SANA_DR0 on August 25, 2019, 01:11:17 PM
Glad we played 2 up top, wish we do that more now, Drop Siggy back into CM, fuck Schneiderlin off. (or play Gbamin instead of Siggy)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on August 25, 2019, 01:54:58 PM
I broadly agree that he will be more dangerous when we have the ball in the final third. Xg wise DCL scores about as much as he should do for what we create. Doesn't take I to account volume tho as you rightly say.

For me the issue is still the side creates fuck all and dropping a good finisher into it doesn't make more chances it just drags the striker down to the sides level.

Hooe Wobes helps sorts that and tbh I think he will help.

I donít get this that the side creates nothing bit. We had 4 clear cut chances in the least 20 min alone. We created tons but finishing and final balls let us down. That happens sometimes.

But in games like this you need your striker to be putting his one chance away. And DCL does not do that. We have played 3 really poor teams thus far and he hasnít had 1 decent game yet, he hasnít looked like scoring once. I almost wouldnít mind if he he missed three chances a game because I can at least hope he can improve his finishing etc. But he doesnít even get a sniff at goal.

He doesnít win header in the box, doesnít find a pocket of space for even a half chance.

He just isnít good enough unfortunately/
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 02:03:10 PM
Glad we played 2 up top, wish we do that more now, Drop Siggy back into CM, fuck Schneiderlin off. (or play Gbamin instead of Siggy)

You want us to play a midfield 2 of Gomes and sigurdsson? God help us
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 02:39:23 PM
He just isnít good enough unfortunately

Starting to come around to this way of thinking myself.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on August 25, 2019, 03:11:43 PM
Starting to come around to this way of thinking myself.
It would be interesting to get a poll going just to see what percentage of NSNO posters actually think heís not going to make it


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 03:24:48 PM
It'll be hard to argue that DCL is going to be the answer to our striking problems.
However another recruitment oversight in the summer means he's going to have to play a decent chunk of this season, either from the start or from the bench. So for now the doubters will just have to swallow that and get behind him, for the next three months at least.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 03:27:21 PM
It'll be hard to argue that DCL is going to be the answer to our striking problems.
However another recruitment oversight in the summer means he's going to have to play a decent chunk of this season, either from the start or from the bench. So for now the doubters will just have to swallow that and get behind him, for the next three months at least.

What's the recruitment oversight? We signed a striker. He's just not been ready to start yet, but it's obvious he'll be the main striker once he gets up and running.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 03:32:07 PM
What's the recruitment oversight? We signed a striker. He's just not been ready to start yet, but it's obvious he'll be the main striker once he gets up and running.

We needed 2. If we had money for zaha we should have signed haller (though we got iwobi so maybe we didnít have enough)

We shouldnít have bothered signing Gomes. Should have sold sigurdsson if there was any interest. We donít make any brave decisions
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 03:34:26 PM
What's the recruitment oversight? We signed a striker. He's just not been ready to start yet, but it's obvious he'll be the main striker once he gets up and running.

Our two central strikers are 19 and 22. It's risky to assume Kean will be up to playing a minimum of 25 games.
We should have signed an experienced striker to help with the workload. The way it is DCL or Kean will have to stay fit as they will always be on the beach at least.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 03:38:05 PM
We needed 2. If we had money for zaha we should have signed haller (though we got iwobi so maybe we didnít have enough)

We shouldnít have bothered signing Gomes. Should have sold sigurdsson if there was any interest. We donít make any brave decisions

No-one was gonna bid for Sigurdsson for the kind of money it would've taken. Gomes for £22m was a good deal imo. I think he was poor on Friday, and it's now fashionable to pile in on him, but he's a good player for that price. That was a good deal.

Maybe we could've got an additional, older striker at a push as cover. I can accept that. Not sure we could've signed Haller and Kean though. Signing Kean was a coup, and he was never going to be coming here just to be an option.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on August 25, 2019, 03:43:03 PM
Decent experienced strikers don't settle at being bench options and Kean wouldn't have signed for us without assurances of being first choice. I would rather take a risk on the next big thing than play it safe again.

Gomes is great value for money one bad game doesn't change that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 03:44:25 PM
Decent experienced strikers don't settle at being bench options and Kean wouldn't have signed for us without assurances of being first choice. I would rather take a risk on the next big thing than play it safe again.

Gomes is great value for money one bad game doesn't change that

That's the tail wagging the dog. Modern players are very aware of the squad system.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 03:47:25 PM
Our two central strikers are 19 and 22. It's risky to assume Kean will be up to playing a minimum of 25 games.
We should have signed an experienced striker to help with the workload. The way it is DCL or Kean will have to stay fit as they will always be on the beach at least.


Maybe. I agree with Silas that it's a nice idea, but who is this mythical experienced striker who's going to be good enough to lead the line for us, but who also is happily relegated to 2nd/3rd choice once Kean gets going. Genuinely, any suggestions?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 03:54:43 PM
Maybe. I agree with Silas that it's a nice idea, but who is this mythical experienced striker who's going to be good enough to lead the line for us, but who also is happily relegated to 2nd/3rd choice once Kean gets going. Genuinely, any suggestions?
I'd never heard of Kean before the summer, so I trust whoever found him to find an experienced striker.
If you think we'd be worse off with an experienced striker in the squad or just think it's too much hassle to look for one it's a strange stance to take.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 04:01:30 PM
I'd never heard of Kean before the summer, so I trust whoever found him to find an experienced striker.
If you think we'd be worse off with an experienced striker in the squad or just think it's too much hassle to look for one it's a strange stance to take.

No, you've either misunderstood, or you've deliberately pretended you've misunderstood. Whichever it is, I'll have another go at making the point.

To sign this experienced striker, he needs to be good enough to lead the line in the Prem, he needs to be better than DCL, but then he also need to be willing to accept that he's 2nd/3rd choice once Moise Kean gets going. There might be players with that profile, I don't know. But it seems like quite a hard sell. People in their late 20s/early 30s don't tend to join clubs where they know they're probably not going to play when the team is at it's strongest.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 04:07:11 PM
No, you've either misunderstood, or you've deliberately pretended you've misunderstood. Whichever it is, I'll have another go at making the point.

To sign this experienced striker, he needs to be good enough to lead the line in the Prem, he needs to be better than DCL, but then he also need to be willing to accept that he's 2nd/3rd choice once Moise Kean gets going. There might be players with that profile, I don't know. But it seems like quite a hard sell. People in their late 20s/early 30s don't tend to join clubs where they know they're probably not going to play when the team is at it's strongest.



Well we managed to do it with Delph this summer. We have 3 goalkeepers over the age of 25. Spurs sign back-up for Kane. Giroud is still at Chelsea, Origi just signed a new contract at Liverpool.
We tell potential players that they will have to fight for their place. It works elsewhere.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 04:14:17 PM
Well we managed to do it with Delph this summer. We have 3 goalkeepers over the age of 25. Spurs sign back-up for Kane. Giroud is still at Chelsea, Origi just signed a new contract at Liverpool.
We tell potential players that they will have to fight for their place. It works elsewhere.

Mate, Delph was obviously told he wouldnít play much at City, and weíve increased his already enormous wage.

And most of the other scenarios youíve mentioned are all players going to Champions League clubís, who are not only more prestigious, but who also play far more games than us, so playing time is not only more likely, but the playing time on offer is in higher profile games, and in games where you are likely to end up on the winning side.

The goalkeeper thing isnít that relevant, as weíve got an ageing Stekelenburg, and a 30 year-old keeper from a relegated club in Lossl.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 04:19:57 PM
Mate, Delph was obviously told he wouldnít play much at City, and weíve increased his already enormous wage.

And most of the other scenarios youíve mentioned are all players going to Champions League clubís, who are not only more prestigious, but who also play far more games than us, so playing time is not only more likely, but the playing time on offer is in higher profile games, and in games where you are likely to end up on the winning side.

The goalkeeper thing isnít that relevant, as weíve got an ageing Stekelenburg, and a 30 year-old keeper from a relegated club in Lossl.

Yes and Delph would have had options but chose to come here.
Leicester have back up to Vardy. We are more than capable of attracting players.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 04:30:05 PM
I donít get this that the side creates nothing bit. We had 4 clear cut chances in the least 20 min alone. We created tons but finishing and final balls let us down. That happens sometimes.

But in games like this you need your striker to be putting his one chance away. And DCL does not do that. We have played 3 really poor teams thus far and he hasnít had 1 decent game yet, he hasnít looked like scoring once. I almost wouldnít mind if he he missed three chances a game because I can at least hope he can improve his finishing etc. But he doesnít even get a sniff at goal.

He doesnít win header in the box, doesnít find a pocket of space for even a half chance.

He just isnít good enough unfortunately/

Yes finishing and final ball will happen, but to say we don't have a problem creating chances is a bit blind imo.

I can understand the DCL criticism tbh and if you offered me a proper proper striker yes great stuff.

The 4 clear cut chances thing... I dunno, I don't want to get into a big thing about it but yeah we probably should have got one from our combination of chances. But I do mean one...creating enough to give yourself the likelihood of scoring one goal is not enough. Infact it's fuck all.

The player everyone reckons is going to come in and play up top didn't get a single shot off in the half an hour he played. We didn't make a single chance for him despite being camped in their half..

We've got a problem creatinf chances through personnel and through the system.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 04:31:51 PM
XG had us winning the game like.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 04:34:59 PM
XG had us winning the game like.



You'd typically call it a draw if it's as close as that. 1.whatever vs 1.whatever

Like saying yeah there was enough for either side to maybe get a goal but meh.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 04:37:37 PM
Well we managed to do it with Delph this summer. We have 3 goalkeepers over the age of 25. Spurs sign back-up for Kane. Giroud is still at Chelsea, Origi just signed a new contract at Liverpool.
We tell potential players that they will have to fight for their place. It works elsewhere.

Who's Spurs' backup for Kane? I must've missed that one.

Giroud's one of two main strikers for Chelsea, so he will get loads of games/sub appearances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 04:39:02 PM
A three of kean, Richarlison and DCL is a good strikeforce.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 04:44:16 PM
Yes and Delph would have had options but chose to come here.
Leicester have back up to Vardy. We are more than capable of attracting players.

I bet Delph didnít have any other options that included a wage rise and staying in the NW.

Plus, Leicester bought their back-up when there were strong links to Vardy moving on, whereas weíd just secured one of the most highly rated young strikers in Europe.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 04:49:29 PM
Yes finishing and final ball will happen, but to say we don't have a problem creating chances is a bit blind imo.

I can understand the DCL criticism tbh and if you offered me a proper proper striker yes great stuff.

The 4 clear cut chances thing... I dunno, I don't want to get into a big thing about it but yeah we probably should have got one from our combination of chances. But I do mean one...creating enough to give yourself the likelihood of scoring one goal is not enough. Infact it's fuck all.

The player everyone reckons is going to come in and play up top didn't get a single shot off in the half an hour he played. We didn't make a single chance for him despite being camped in their half..

We've got a problem creatinf chances through personnel and through the system.

Richarlison couldíve easily had a pen, DCL and Walcott shouldíve scored, and Iwobi hit the inside of the post.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 04:49:41 PM
I bet Delph didnít have any other options that included a wage rise and staying in the NW.

Plus, Leicester bought their back-up when there were strong links to Vardy moving on, whereas weíd just secured one of the most highly rated young strikers in Europe.

So we took the decision to increase our midfield options on Delphi's love for the northwest?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 04:50:19 PM
A three of kean, Richarlison and DCL is a good strikeforce.



I think DCL looks like a misfit there
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 04:53:38 PM
Richarlison couldíve easily had a pen, DCL and Walcott shouldíve scored, and Iwobi hit the inside of the post.

We created enough to typically get a goal.

That's not enough.

In fact looking at xg for and against in our 3 matches so far, we *should* (by xg) have drew all 3.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 04:53:46 PM
So we took the decision to increase our midfield options on Delphi's love for the northwest?


Him not having to move his family, or change his kidsí school wouldíve been a factor, along with the likelihood of more game time, and increasing his wage, yes.

Everton wanted an experienced midfielder and motivator, and they got that.

You know theses things anyway, but I donít mind playing along.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 04:57:15 PM
We created enough to typically get a goal.

That's not enough.

In fact looking at xg for and against in our 3 matches so far, we *should* (by xg) have drew all 3.

You know I agree that we donít create enough, and I also have the same views to you as to why this is the case.

But Iím mystified that xg doesnít think we missed a couple of sitters, plus had a couple of moments of misfortune.

Although, Iím not fully up on how xg really works.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 05:03:06 PM
No-one was gonna bid for Sigurdsson for the kind of money it would've taken. Gomes for £22m was a good deal imo. I think he was poor on Friday, and it's now fashionable to pile in on him, but he's a good player for that price. That was a good deal.

Maybe we could've got an additional, older striker at a push as cover. I can accept that. Not sure we could've signed Haller and Kean though. Signing Kean was a coup, and he was never going to be coming here just to be an option.

What would you have been happy with. Iíd have gotten rid for 20m. Weíd get that surely
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 05:06:45 PM
You know I agree that we donít create enough, and I also have the same views to you as to why this is the case.

But Iím mystified that xg doesnít think we missed a couple of sitters, plus had a couple of moments of misfortune.

Although, Iím not fully up on how xg really works.

Well one of the big gaps for me is - if you put someone through on goal and they totally fluff it and air shot, miss the ball and it bobbles harmlessly out of play...

You don't get a value for that as it only counts shots as chances.

Generally the rule is fans overrate chances and the likelihood of scoring them. I've no idea what either of DCL's or Walcotts chances were, but there's virtually no such thing as a 100% banker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 05:11:16 PM
Who's Spurs' backup for Kane? I must've missed that one.

Giroud's one of two main strikers for Chelsea, so he will get loads of games/sub appearances.

Son is the back up for Kane. Heís a great player
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 05:15:47 PM
Son is the back up for Kane. Heís a great player

Heís not backup to Kane.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on August 25, 2019, 05:31:25 PM
The fact is Calvert Lewin is a capable back up but right now he's being expected to be a lead striker and he had that role since last season really. Kean coming in will change that and I think he'll have a good season as a rotation option
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 05:33:37 PM
Son is the back up for Kane. Heís a great player

How is he the back up to Kane?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 05:34:18 PM
How is he the back up to Kane?

Well he's like the alternative they played up top.

Not really following this convo tho, what's the point in it?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on August 25, 2019, 05:36:09 PM
Even if Kean hits the ground running he is 19 and going to need a rest at some stage of the season.
If he struggles to cope and has to come out of the side we are left with the same attack as the last two seasons.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 25, 2019, 05:45:47 PM
The fact is Calvert Lewin is a capable back up but right now he's being expected to be a lead striker and he had that role since last season really. Kean coming in will change that and I think he'll have a good season as a rotation option

I dont really see the value in him being on the bench unless we're winning comfortably. If we were 1 down with 15 minutes to go and we were desperate for a goal id have Tosun and Niasse above him, the only way I see him playing in the team is if we're winning well and we just want to give him a run out, but then going back to the first point Id actually rather give Tosun or Niasse a game to give them confidence. I dont necessarily think this is Silvas thinking, but its mine and this is based on Kean establishing himself as first choice, which isnt guaranteed yet!! :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 05:47:36 PM
Niasse should never play for us again, ffs.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 05:53:43 PM
Heís not backup to Kane.

Is he not?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 05:59:19 PM
The fact is Calvert Lewin is a capable back up but right now he's being expected to be a lead striker and he had that role since last season really. Kean coming in will change that and I think he'll have a good season as a rotation option

Capable how? Heís done nothing to prove he should start any games and would have to if kean got injured. Heís certainly not the sub if you were chasing a goal. Heís not capable backup.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on August 25, 2019, 06:03:23 PM
Whatís xg?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Alanvideo on August 25, 2019, 06:24:44 PM
I dont really see the value in him being on the bench unless we're winning comfortably. If we were 1 down with 15 minutes to go and we were desperate for a goal id have Tosun and Niasse above him, the only way I see him playing in the team is if we're winning well and we just want to give him a run out, but then going back to the first point Id actually rather give Tosun or Niasse a game to give them confidence. I dont necessarily think this is Silvas thinking, but its mine and this is based on Kean establishing himself as first choice, which isnt guaranteed yet!! :)
.....................I'd go along with that apart from the Niasse shout !
Yes ,if DCL can't score in 90 mins ,what's the chances of him scoring as a sub ? Tosun is more likely to nick a goal. Like you ,I'm banking on Kean coming good .
By the way , @blargins (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=54) ,xg is shorthand for crossing .
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on August 25, 2019, 06:31:35 PM
Capable how? Heís done nothing to prove he should start any games and would have to if kean got injured. Heís certainly not the sub if you were chasing a goal. Heís not capable backup.

Your opinion on this is irrelevant as you can't see any positives from him whatsoever which makes you totally blinkered.

He's quick, can play out wide as well as up front and keeps hold of the ball well. He's a fairly decent passer of the ball as well. He isnt enough of a goal threat to start but it's not like he's incapable of a goal and he has the potential to improve despite your opinion on that. As bench strikers go that's a decent option.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 06:39:58 PM
Your opinion on this is irrelevant as you can't see any positives from him whatsoever which makes you totally blinkered.

He's quick, can play out wide as well as up front and keeps hold of the ball well. He's a fairly decent passer of the ball as well. He isnt enough of a goal threat to start but it's not like he's incapable of a goal and he has the potential to improve despite your opinion on that. As bench strikers go that's a decent option.

In what circumstances would you want him coming off the bench? What happens when our starting striker gets injured and he has to play?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 06:41:45 PM
Your opinion on this is irrelevant as you can't see any positives from him whatsoever which makes you totally blinkered.

He's quick, can play out wide as well as up front and keeps hold of the ball well. He's a fairly decent passer of the ball as well. He isnt enough of a goal threat to start but it's not like he's incapable of a goal and he has the potential to improve despite your opinion on that. As bench strikers go that's a decent option.

Iím really not sure how you can describe someone as a capable back up if you donít want him starting games or coming off the bench when we are behind
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 06:43:11 PM
(https://media.giphy.com/media/pXHeBVPUTiMO4/giphy.gif)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 06:45:30 PM
(https://media.giphy.com/media/pXHeBVPUTiMO4/giphy.gif)

Youíre more than welcome to explain. A capable back up who we donít want starting any matches or to rely on to get a goal as sub. Itís an oxymoron
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 06:48:11 PM
Youíre more than welcome to explain. A capable back up who we donít want starting any matches or to rely on to get a goal as sub. Itís an oxymoron

I dont want to explain. Like the gif suggests, you are like a dog with a bone. Going on and on and on and on....its boring.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 06:53:32 PM
I dont want to explain. Like the gif suggests, you are like a dog with a bone. Going on and on and on and on....its boring.

Being proven right though arenít I. Iím not even arguing heís shite anymore. Just that a capable backup striker has to be capable of starting some games and getting goals off the bench. Iím amazed you disagree. Youíre not massively interesting yourself. Well not past your joe hart for 40m suggestion. That was a cracker
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on August 25, 2019, 06:54:43 PM
Iím really not sure how you can describe someone as a capable back up if you donít want him starting games or coming off the bench when we are behind

They wouldn't be a backup if you wanted them to start games.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 06:55:47 PM
They wouldn't be a backup if you wanted them to start games.

We hoping kean plays 50 games plus?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 06:57:04 PM
Being proven right though arenít I. Iím not even arguing heís shite anymore. Just that a capable backup striker has to be capable of starting some games and getting goals off the bench. Iím amazed you disagree. Youíre not massively interesting yourself. Well not past your joe hart for 40m suggestion. That was a cracker

Wow - love how you bring that up every time. Yeah i seriously thought about getting Hart, i also pushed for Pickford at every opportunity. Not that i have to prove anything to you :)

Im not disagreeing that DCL isnt good enough right now. I want to start with Kean, i think he is the better player. I just think you are incredibly boring and go on about things like mad. We all know your thoughts, you dont have to cram them down everyones throats at every opportunity.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 07:01:18 PM
Wow - love how you bring that up every time. Yeah i seriously thought about getting Hart, i also pushed for Pickford at every opportunity. Not that i have to prove anything to you :)

Im not disagreeing that DCL isnt good enough right now. I want to start with Kean, i think he is the better player. I just think you are incredibly boring and go on about things like mad. We all know your thoughts, you dont have to cram them down everyones throats at every opportunity.

It is the all time worst suggestion on here. Heís been literally worth nothing since.

Youíre allowed to share your thoughts on Morgan every match day thread. Much more blinkered about his performances and plenty of comments on his character too.

It seems DCL is a protected species on here. If it was Williams Naismith or Williams no one would have a problem whatever I said.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on August 25, 2019, 07:03:26 PM
We hoping kean plays 50 games plus?

You are deliberately being literal here and for that reason I'm out
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 07:04:14 PM
Wow - love how you bring that up every time. Yeah i seriously thought about getting Hart, i also pushed for Pickford at every opportunity. Not that i have to prove anything to you :)

Im not disagreeing that DCL isnt good enough right now. I want to start with Kean, i think he is the better player. I just think you are incredibly boring and go on about things like mad. We all know your thoughts, you dont have to cram them down everyones throats at every opportunity.

And yes I know I go on about it a lot. Honestly I just find it incredibly frustrating that heís so far short and then people make out his not a problem (though thatís changing)

Imagine if you came on here and most were saying Williams had been doing great. It gets to me and I know itís crazy

Weíd be a good team without him and sigurdsson/ loan him out and just let sigurdsson hide and not seek him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 07:04:46 PM
It is the all time worst suggestion on here. Heís been literally worth nothing since.

Youíre allowed to share your thoughts on Morgan every match day thread. Much more blinkered about his performances and plenty of comments on his character too.

It seems DCL is a protected species on here. If it was Williams Naismith or Williams no one would have a problem whatever I said.

Like i said, i dont argue with the suggestion of Hart... he used to be boss, he is awful since. Probably mentality been destroyed having something to do with that.

Anyway, again, dog with a bone. Stop going on about it!!! haha
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 07:04:56 PM
You are deliberately being literal here and for that reason I'm out

Iím not. We canít have a back up that we canít trust to play 10-15 games.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on August 25, 2019, 07:06:11 PM
And yes I know I go on about it a lot. Honestly I just find it incredibly frustrating that heís so far short and then people make out his not a problem (though thatís changing)

Imagine if you came on here and most were saying Williams had been doing great. It gets to me and I know itís crazy

Weíd be a good team without him and sigurdsson/ loan him out and just let sigurdsson hide and not seek him

He isnt good enough right now. But its like you cant see anything good about him? He has good qualities. Ok he needs to score, he is a striker...but he is young, he hasnt had any one to learn from. Lets hope Kean pushes him to be better.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 07:12:28 PM
He isnt good enough right now. But its like you cant see anything good about him? He has good qualities. Ok he needs to score, he is a striker...but he is young, he hasnt had any one to learn from. Lets hope Kean pushes him to be better.

I donít not see anything good about him. He works hard for the team. Heís decent in the air. I donít have any problem with him apart from him not being good enough. Get him out on loan and see if he comes back a better player. Currently he shouldnít be playing for Everton.

I might be completely wrong in a couple of years DCL might be great and sigurdsson might not be the problem at the moment. In my mind though these 2 are our problem and so the source of all my frustrations and pretty much all I talk about. I do realise Iím annoying folk. Iím not doing it on purpose
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on August 25, 2019, 07:14:31 PM
No ones up for playing 2 up front then? has anyone seen how many teams this weekend started with 2 or 3 players upfront palace,,leicester,,sheff u,,arsenal thats just the games i watched,,as for the ageing forward for back remember the last one we had we had the same problems then and we played him in midfield because we lost barkley,,who we still havent replaced in my eyes as i didnt see him as a no.10,,and i was saying the same thing then play rooney upfront with one of our not so good strikers
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 07:19:02 PM
This joker still going on then
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 25, 2019, 07:21:32 PM
This joker still going on then

When youíre right youíre right. Oddly youíre not still going on about 40m to spurs are arsenal.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on August 25, 2019, 07:26:09 PM
Son is the back up for Kane. Heís a great player

Nah mate, Son's a wide player in their best first 11 with Kane. He just got moved to Kane's replacement up front because he was so good at it. They tried people like Llorente and Janssen etc, but they had the same problem I'm talking about. To get a backup good enough to be first team, but one that would accept not playing for large parts of the season, when Kane's fit.

Striker tend to be uniquely difficult in this respect. As a midfielder, defender or wide player, there's multiple positions that you can get in the team, but with striker it's just one, and in Spurs' case, they're almost certainly never going to drop Harry Kane.

Like Delph was raised as an example. He could get in our team in one of three midfield positions or left back, so there will be games for him over the season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 07:33:19 PM
.40 understat has the chance as. So in their opinion, based on shot location and type, you'd expect it to fly in 40% of the time.

Understat don't have post-shot data so like location of defender and goalie, pressure on the shot taker or where he actually places it doesn't come into it, not sure how that would impact it but the fact there's a goalie and a two defenders hurtling across the line makes me think it maybe goes down.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 25, 2019, 07:36:00 PM
.....................I'd go along with that apart from the Niasse shout !
Yes ,if DCL can't score in 90 mins ,what's the chances of him scoring as a sub ? Tosun is more likely to nick a goal. Like you ,I'm banking on Kean coming good .
By the way , @blargins (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=54) ,xg is shorthand for crossing .

I know what you're saying about Niasse and I dont think he should be part of our future, but here and now if I had to put money on either of them to score a goal coming on as sub it'd be Niasse, mind you it would only be 50p tops on either of them
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on August 25, 2019, 07:36:51 PM
Echo saying silvas ready to change formation for the lincon game due to delph being back https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/marco-silva-ready-use-new-16812114
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 08:09:22 PM
.40 understat has the chance as. So in their opinion, based on shot location and type, you'd expect it to fly in 40% of the time.

Understat don't have post-shot data so like location of defender and goalie, pressure on the shot taker or where he actually places it doesn't come into it, not sure how that would impact it but the fact there's a goalie and a two defenders hurtling across the line makes me think it maybe goes down.

You start chatting about wearing the number nine and wanting to be the main man up top for Everton, you have to be netting there

Donít need understat to tell me that.

Palace away last season, Fulham away last season, games where he had good chances at big moments and didnít put them away.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 08:13:22 PM
You start chatting about wearing the number nine and wanting to be the main man up top for Everton, you have to be netting there

Donít need understat to tell me that.

Palace away last season, Fulham away last season, games where he had good chances at big moments and didnít put them away.



60% of the time, based on every single shot in the Premier league history, that is saved, blocked or missed.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 08:15:20 PM
60% of the time, based on every single shot in the Premier league history, that is saved, blocked or missed.

And weíre looking to be in the top 40% of the league arenít we.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 08:18:22 PM
And we’re looking to be in the top 40% of the league aren’t we.

I'm not certain that's how it works.

In my opinion, he did alright with the chance. Hard low and on target. The fact we're only creating two chances for him in 3 games is the bigger issue. I'd have liked him to finish it, but for a better side he maybe finishes the next one.

It's probably a mix of him not being a naturally dangerous high volume shot taker and our total lack of creativity / strategy for making chances beyond pumping it into the box.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 08:22:50 PM
I'm not certain that's how it works.

In my opinion, he did alright with the chance. Hard low and on target. The fact we're only creating two chances for him in 3 games is the bigger issue. I'd have liked him to finish it, but for a better side he maybe finishes the next one.

It's probably a mix of him not being a naturally dangerous high volume shot taker and our total lack of creativity / strategy for making chances beyond pumping it into the box.

Is there anything you wonít attach a stat to?

He should score that if he wants to be the main man for us.

You can go on about the amount of changes we create for him all day, but heís had chances to score and not took them.

Even the last goal he scored the keeper should save it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 08:26:25 PM
Is there anything you wonít attach a stat to?

He should score that if he wants to be the main man for us.

You can go on about the amount of changes we create for him all day, but heís had chances to score and not took them.

Even the last goal he scored the keeper should save it.


Yeah sure so - the complaints about his hold up, got to say I have to agree. He worked hard but he didn't make it stick, compared to Wesley who dominated Keane.

This is literally the perfect discussion to use the xg stat.

He should score that, the fact he doesn't means he's shit - opposing view is, are you sure that's as easy as you think, or is it your bias?

What's your issue with using xg in literally the sort of discussion it was invented to solve?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: penguinofdoom1878 on August 25, 2019, 08:48:44 PM
If we're using stats, of his 88 games he averages 1.3 shots per game, 62.7% of his passes are successful and he's assisted 8 goals (6 of which came in the 2017/18 season).

At 22 he either needs a loan move, which is impossible until at least January or used from the bench.

Not a natural striker, can he have a position change?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 25, 2019, 09:17:28 PM
Echo saying silvas ready to change formation for the lincon game due to delph being back https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/marco-silva-ready-use-new-16812114

Hmm, he seems to be suggesting that Delph will be the left side of a midfield 3, so does that mean Iwobi will be contesting Bernard for the LW spot in this scenario? And does it also mean that Sigurdsson has to play deeper? Or could we have Iwobi slightly advanced of Schneiderlin and Delph, with Bernard still at LW?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 25, 2019, 09:24:34 PM
Yeah sure so - the complaints about his hold up, got to say I have to agree. He worked hard but he didn't make it stick, compared to Wesley who dominated Keane.

This is literally the perfect discussion to use the xg stat.

He should score that, the fact he doesn't means he's shit - opposing view is, are you sure that's as easy as you think, or is it your bias?

What's your issue with using xg in literally the sort of discussion it was invented to solve?

My bias in terms of what?

I donít need a stat to tell me if he should score that chance or not. Iím not trusting it in this discussion.

I look at the chance and the circumstances around it and know if he wants to be our main striker that has to hit the back of the net.

Do think youíre slightly blinkered when it comes DCL and his work infront of goal.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on August 25, 2019, 09:48:18 PM
I'm not certain that's how it works.

In my opinion, he did alright with the chance. Hard low and on target. The fact we're only creating two chances for him in 3 games is the bigger issue. I'd have liked him to finish it, but for a better side he maybe finishes the next one.

It's probably a mix of him not being a naturally dangerous high volume shot taker and our total lack of creativity / strategy for making chances beyond pumping it into the box.

You're bending over backwards here to defend him. You've kept on bringing up this argument that in a better side, he'd be a better player. However, if he scores only through by sheer weight of numbers that one of them is bound to go in then it's not exactly a glowing recommendation and frankly if he can only thrive in a team like Man City's then we may as well sell him now, because we're not going to be creating to that level every week.

He needs to find a way to be more effective in this team.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on August 25, 2019, 09:56:57 PM
60% of the time, based on every single shot in the Premier league history, that is saved, blocked or missed.

Of those 60% of shots taken from that range, who is taking the shot? If you're taking a shot like that it could well be from a ball coming in from a corner or the like where it might be a defender or midfielder taking the shot so bringing the average down and due to the amount of players that'd likely be in the box.

You'd expect a higher conversion rate from that range from a PL level striker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 25, 2019, 10:39:48 PM
My bias in terms of what?

I don’t need a stat to tell me if he should score that chance or not. I’m not trusting it in this discussion.

I look at the chance and the circumstances around it and know if he wants to be our main striker that has to hit the back of the net.

Do think you’re slightly blinkered when it comes DCL and his work infront of goal.



Sorry I don't mean your bias like you personally have any specific agenda, I just mean human bias that we are all guilty of all the time. We trust our eyes and and our gut and things like confirmation bias or whatever tricks us into thinking and believing things that just aren't 100% representative of reality.

I am definitely guilty of over defending Calvert-Lewin, I just think my objection to this chat boils down to :

We shouldn't castigate a young striker for missing (an admittedly good) chance, because the real issue is that a side that has top 6 aspirations should create much more and much better chances.

If he's missing sitters none stop get him the fuck out of there, but the issue, and the reason we lost that game and continue to fail to push on lies behind him. Castigate them, and most of all castigate Silva for the paucity of chances we are creating for him.

But that one shot, that he got on target and was well blocked, is not the reason for where we are.

However - it is becoming fairly clear that part of our lack of chances, and a bigger part than I'd like to admit, is down to Calvert-Lewin himself.

I hope Kean likes chasing balls into the channel anyway.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 26, 2019, 12:56:18 AM
Its not that chance, itís are you surprised if he misses or scores?

Iím thinking more of the latter, which is a problem for a striker.

Anyway I actually like DCL for his age/ development.

The flick round the corner for Richarlison last week is a good example of his skill set.

But he needs to marry it with more solid hold up play.

Heís solely relying on his leap at the moment which isnít conducive to solid platform if youíre not knocking the cb out of the way as theyíre still able to challenge youíre next touch.

Iíve said a number of times that this is generally something you pick up later in youíre career so I donít think there should be a panic to describe him as useless. I certainly donít want to get to the point where people actively dislike him.

But the first four games will see each of the opposition strikers offer more of a physical challenge to our CBs than we will to theirs.

So itís just that I donít think that weíre playing in a unique style that is asking too much of the striker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: van der Meyde on August 26, 2019, 03:10:26 PM
This just about covers it for me.

He's far from perfect. I have plenty of concerns about him. I think Kean is more likely to create chances for himself than DCL is.

But by god, our build up is so shit that I find it hard to criticise him too much.

https://differentgame.wordpress.com/2019/08/26/the-everton-diary-game-week-3-the-ballad-of-dominic-calvert-lewin/
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on August 26, 2019, 03:37:52 PM
This just about covers it for me.

He's far from perfect. I have plenty of concerns about him. I think Kean is more likely to create chances for himself than DCL is.

But by god, our build up is so shit that I find it hard to criticise him too much.

https://differentgame.wordpress.com/2019/08/26/the-everton-diary-game-week-3-the-ballad-of-dominic-calvert-lewin/

There's is something structurally wrong with our attacking play meaning we create hardly any decent chances, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt while we still create so few chances a game
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on August 26, 2019, 04:32:54 PM
The more I read from @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) the more I swear it's @Thomas (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=347) in disguise.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on August 26, 2019, 05:40:04 PM
The more I read from @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) the more I swear it's @Thomas (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=347) in disguise.

Is Thomas the Celtic fan? Hes not me (though I/Thomas would say that)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on August 26, 2019, 05:41:28 PM
I know it's been banged on about for what seems like an eternity but its not fair to write him off until he's had a chance to play with different players in a better system.

Of course there are areas of his game where he needs to improve but he's literally playing against a back four on his own for the majority of the time.

Bernard stays wide and doesn't trouble anyone, Richarlison hasn't got going yet and usually arrives late into dangerous areas and Sig is just non existent. I don't think Gomes has ever entered the opposition penalty box.

We're just so anaemic in the final third, it's embarrassing.

 





Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on August 26, 2019, 09:18:45 PM
You do realize that Bernard is the only one who has troubled anyone so far this season
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 26, 2019, 09:41:45 PM
I know it's been banged on about for what seems like an eternity but its not fair to write him off until he's had a chance to play with different players in a better system.

Of course there are areas of his game where he needs to improve but he's literally playing against a back four on his own for the majority of the time.

Bernard stays wide and doesn't trouble anyone, Richarlison hasn't got going yet and usually arrives late into dangerous areas and Sig is just non existent. I don't think Gomes has ever entered the opposition penalty box.

We're just so anaemic in the final third, it's embarrassing.
You don't think he's part (most) of the problem? Time will only tell, but I'm predicting we'll look a lot more dangerous than we do when we replace him.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Trowel on August 26, 2019, 11:30:57 PM
60% of the time, based on every single shot in the Premier league history, that is saved, blocked or missed.
Isn't this one of the inherent flaws of xG, that the quant dataset aspect is based purely on historical PL shots but can't factor in if it was a shot taken by a Sergio Aguero or by an Ade Akinbiyi. i.e. that 40% xG might be calculated from Akinbiyi scoring 0/5 and Aguero scoring 4/5 from exactly the same chance (I know there are other weighting factors).

xG is an interesting stat, but there's a kind of self-fulfilling bias to it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 27, 2019, 12:32:43 AM
Isn't this one of the inherent flaws of xG, that the quant dataset aspect is based purely on historical PL shots but can't factor in if it was a shot taken by a Sergio Aguero or by an Ade Akinbiyi. i.e. that 40% xG might be calculated from Akinbiyi scoring 0/5 and Aguero scoring 4/5 from exactly the same chance (I know there are other weighting factors).

xG is an interesting stat, but there's a kind of self-fulfilling bias to it.

Yep it measures typical chance quality, rather than shot quality. If Messi bends one from outside the area or brap2 bends one from outside the area they are not the same.

But just to reiterate, it's not that I don't think or would hope or wish that he had finished that, but that I think the bigger issue is that that's the only chance we make for our striker.

Strikers miss chances. They even miss bad fucking sitters, all the time. Salah missed a  .54 at the weekend apparently. He of course regularly scores from absolutely nothing like which DCL doesn't do, but yeah.

We shouldn't castigate the striker for missing the one chance he had, we should say why aren't we making more happen?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 27, 2019, 12:54:09 AM
Yep it measures typical chance quality, rather than shot quality. If Messi bends one from outside the area or brap2 bends one from outside the area they are not the same.

But just to reiterate, it's not that I don't think or would hope or wish that he had finished that, but that I think the bigger issue is that that's the only chance we make for our striker.

Strikers miss chances. They even miss bad fucking sitters, all the time. Salah missed a  .54 at the weekend apparently. He of course regularly scores from absolutely nothing like which DCL doesn't do, but yeah.

We shouldn't castigate the striker for missing the one chance he had, we should say why aren't we making more happen?


A lot of us are also saying he should find himself in better positions to get chances.

three things to take into account.

1. DCL is poor infront of goal.
2. We don't create enough chances.
3. DCL could do a lot more in terms of movement for people to find him.

Cant we all agree on the above three points?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 27, 2019, 01:21:38 AM
A lot of us are also saying he should find himself in better positions to get chances.

three things to take into account.

1. DCL is poor infront of goal.
2. We don't create enough chances.
3. DCL could do a lot more in terms of movement for people to find him.

Cant we all agree on the above three points?

Sure.

Depends how big you think each issue is for the future of the side I suppose, and what will most likely be changed by the manager.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 27, 2019, 01:25:19 AM
Sure.

Depends how big you think each issue is for the future of the side I suppose, and what will most likely be changed by the manager.

Obviously the deficiency within the team is a lot more important than the deficiency in one player. However, it cant always be used to excuse DCL's failings in front of goal.


He's had plenty of chances to put away over the last few months and not took them. That's on him, not the players behind him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 27, 2019, 01:39:00 AM
Obviously the deficiency within the team is a lot more important that the deficiency in one player. However, it cant always be used to excuse DCL's failings in front of goal.


He's had plenty of chances to put away over the last few months and not took them. That's on him, not the players behind him.

Plenty of chances is a stretch but yeah he's not done as well as I'd like sure.
 
Burnley, Southampton, Watford, all created more than us so far.

Everton not had a single shot inside the 6 yard box.

We've had less shots on target than anyone  in the league apparently, after playing Palace, Villa and Watford.

By the same token, while it's not always DCL, it's a fact that it is mostly the other shit.

Listen it is what it is, the narrative is clearly that DCL isn't good enough and dropping Kean in will make the world of difference. I am genuinely just trying to provide the context that panning him for missing one of the two chances our shite side has created for him is a bit like blaming the chef when he's given shit and asked for sausages.

I know you understand that, I'm more talking to those who believe removing DCL and dropping someone else in is a silver bullet.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 27, 2019, 11:33:19 PM
Expecting 'Noel Whelan knows fuck all' shouts in response to this, but here it is anyway :

For all the money they have spent, Everton donít have a proven goalscorer,Ē Whelan told Football Insider. ďCalvert-Lewin is a good player and Marco Silva seems to have great faith in him.

ďBut he is paid to score goals and he is not doing it at the moment. It sounds harsh but, judging him as a former striker, he doesnít look a natural scorer to me. From that point of view, he worries me.

ďHe is a good footballer, technically excellent and has pace and mobility. He has certainly been given plenty of opportunities as well.

ďCan he rise to the occasion and score regularly? If he doesnít, sooner rather than later he will lose his place in the starting XI.Ē



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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 27, 2019, 11:39:07 PM
Don't think anyone would doubt that we don't have a proven goalscorer like.

Here's an article about our attacking issues from Feb.

https://statsbomb.com/2019/02/can-marco-silva-fix-evertons-attacking-struggles/

Issues scoring goals are more often than not, in my opinion, a symptom of problems elsewhere.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 28, 2019, 12:19:31 AM
Don't think anyone would doubt that we don't have a proven goalscorer like.

Here's an article about our attacking issues from Feb.

https://statsbomb.com/2019/02/can-marco-silva-fix-evertons-attacking-struggles/

Issues scoring goals are more often than not, in my opinion, a symptom of problems elsewhere.
There's also that saying that you're only a strong as your weakest player and if your weakest player is the striker then it's an issue in scoring goals?
Without doubt though there needs to be more collective ownership of scoring and creating goals, but until that time we do have to be critical of players like DCL and Walcott for missing chances they're essentially on the pitch to finish

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 28, 2019, 12:27:09 AM
Weíll create more and score more with iwobi, kean and possibly Delph in the team.

If we donít then thatís when Iíll start having massive questions marks over the manager.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 28, 2019, 12:28:42 AM
There's also that saying that you're only a strong as your weakest player and if your weakest player is the striker then it's an issue in scoring goals?
Without doubt though there needs to be more collective ownership of scoring and creating goals, but until that time we do have to be critical of players like DCL and Walcott for missing chances they're essentially on the pitch to finish

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Did you read that article, though?

Itís showing how little we create.

Now, I donít think DCL will ever be a top level goalscorer, but what @brap2 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=666) is trying to say is that our biggest problems are the small amount of chances we make, and how little our number 10 gets involved.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 28, 2019, 12:31:48 AM
Weíll create more and score more with iwobi, kean and possibly Delph in the team.

If we donít then thatís when Iíll start having massive questions marks over the manager.



Do you reckon heíll be brave with Sigurdsson?

Iíve got this worry that even if he tries someone else in place of Sigurdsson, Silva will still instruct them to pretty much be a support striker and leave the creativity to the flanks.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 28, 2019, 12:47:00 AM
Weíll create more and score more with iwobi, kean and possibly Delph in the team.

If we donít then thatís when Iíll start having massive questions marks over the manager.



I reckon we deffo will, mostly based on how much I back Iwobi and Kean.

Can he keep us tight at the back at the same time? He does that and we're flying.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 28, 2019, 01:08:25 AM
Did you read that article, though?

Itís showing how little we create.

Now, I donít think DCL will ever be a top level goalscorer, but what @brap2 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=666) is trying to say is that our biggest problems are the small amount of chances we make, and how little our number 10 gets involved.

Yes, and I agree, we dont create enough, but what it emphasises more is that DCL isnt the striker that should be in the team as he isnt creating many chances himself and the few we do create he isnt scoring either. I do think Iwobi will help, but the midfield trio looked desperate for something against Villa and it just wasnt on offer. I like Sig and Bernard, but if others perform better then so be it, im about Everton, not the individuals
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on August 28, 2019, 02:59:53 AM
Do you reckon heíll be brave with Sigurdsson?

Iíve got this worry that even if he tries someone else in place of Sigurdsson, Silva will still instruct them to pretty much be a support striker and leave the creativity to the flanks.

I have the same concern.

 we turn into an oval when we have possession with a giant gap between our sitting midfielders and our no10 and centre forward.

We'll see what happens when sigurdsson isnt in the team, but i feel like he must be being instructed to play as high as he does.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on August 28, 2019, 05:15:30 PM
Don't have a sub for the athletic so can't post the full text but the headline says it all

https://theathletic.com/1165613/2019/08/28/sigurdsson-has-passed-the-ball-to-calvert-lewin-three-times-this-season-no-wonder-everton-struggle-to-score/
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Juanito on August 28, 2019, 07:24:09 PM
Sigurdsson should stop being seen as a No.10 because I cant see how he is being used as one.  He just waiting in and around the box to get on the end of things, while DCL's job seems to be to make space for him and occupy defenders.  I would like to see how we do with Bernard there, Iwobi on the left working with Digne and Kean up top. Hopefully we even see that tonight.  I think we could then judge DCL a little fairer as he would have a no.10 to create for him, not a No.10 to create room for.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 02:13:29 AM
Hi lads,

The hottest young striker in Europe has just managed his first shot on goal of any description in more than an hour of football for Everton football club.

Can anyone help me understand why?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 29, 2019, 02:26:48 AM
Hi lads,

The hottest young striker in Europe has just managed his first shot on goal of any description in more than an hour of football for Everton football club.

Can anyone help me understand why?

Hi, bud.

You canít be talking about Moise Kean because he had two shots at goal against Watford

Anything else I can help with fella?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 02:33:24 AM
Hi, bud.

You can’t be talking about Moise Kean because he had two shots at goal against Watford

Anything else I can help with fella?

That in the last hour was it my temporally challenged friend?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 29, 2019, 02:36:38 AM
That in the last hour was it my temporally challenged friend?

Think it was, if not it was close.

See that chance he hit the post with? What do you reckon DCL does with that?

So much more of a threat than DCL and with that we will have more shots on goal.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 02:38:12 AM
Think it was, if not it was close.

See that chance he hit the post with? What do you reckon DCL does with that?

So much more of a threat than DCL and with that we will have more shots on goal.

Naw.

Way more threatening than DCL, looks a player doesn't he.

Shame he plays for a side that won't create him chances.

Come on you know what I'm saying here.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on August 29, 2019, 02:41:46 AM
Naw.

Way more threatening than DCL, looks a player doesn't he.

Shame he plays for a side that won't create him chances.

Come on you know what I'm saying here.

Yeah and I disagree with it because you canít accept that DCL is shite infront of goal.

Having a better, more threatening striker up top will make for more chances at goal.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on August 29, 2019, 02:50:04 AM
Yeah and I disagree with it because you can't accept that DCL is shite infront of goal.

Having a better, more threatening striker up top will make for more chances at goal.
100% agree, this is the point I've been making all along. If you have a better outlet you're going to look towards that outlet, having a shit one, well why bother? Kean hasn't been great, but what he has done I'm 100% sure he's a better option than DCL

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 02:51:01 AM
Yeah and I disagree with it because you canít accept that DCL is shite infront of goal.

Having a better, more threatening striker up top will make for more chances at goal.

I do accept he's nowhere near as good as we want in front of goal of course.

But you've got your goal machine here and he's had two shots in an hour, one of which he made himself by legging it 60 yards with the ball and skinning someone!

You don't disagree you just hope I'm wrong, and don't like how I'm saying it (am being a knob tbf) but you don't reeeeally disagree.

I think it will improve with better players too (what system wouldn't), but that's not my issue.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on August 29, 2019, 04:19:51 AM
DCL came on in the 10 role tonight, and Sigurdsson went deeper. I liked it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on August 29, 2019, 04:20:18 AM
Brap having a shocker
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 04:21:06 AM
Brap having a shocker

How!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on August 29, 2019, 04:24:53 AM
Read the last two pages again
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 04:43:15 AM
Read the last two pages again

I think you should!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on August 29, 2019, 01:11:28 PM
Nah, Brapís point is right here, even if heís going about it in a bit of a knobish way.

Keanís main chance he made himself, and DCL wouldnít have done the same but we shouldnít be expecting our ST to make chances for himself.

The way we play makes it a bit of a thankless task for our ST, and I donít expect DCL to Kean will change that.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on August 29, 2019, 01:54:56 PM
Both sides to this are right. Having kean in there will naturally mean we get more chances as he will get into strikers positions more instinctively.

But we still wont create enough the way we are playing right now. Nowhere near it
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 29, 2019, 01:58:23 PM
Would add though that Kean looks more likely to create chances for others which should open the game up etc.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on August 29, 2019, 02:02:14 PM
Would add though that Kean looks more likely to create chances for others which should open the game up etc.

Yeah he looks good, must stress definitely not saying he's bad or didn't play well.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on August 29, 2019, 02:09:06 PM
Yeah he looks good, must stress definitely not saying he's bad or didn't play well.

Yes.

Think chances for then CF will improve with speed of overall play going up with greater control.

The positions out wide from where crosses will be delivered should improve ie there should be more low ones that are better chances.

Obviously being ahead in games should mean better opportunities with more gaps left by the defence too.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 16, 2019, 04:50:34 AM
Great finish.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 16, 2019, 03:38:57 PM
Getting panned on twitter again of course. Like that was his fault in any way   ::)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 16, 2019, 03:53:53 PM
Getting panned on twitter again of course. Like that was his fault in any way   ::)
I hate this thread, despite commenting, as all it comes down is what people perceive to be the level of a striker in the Premier league. Some people expect it to be top quality, with good skills, engine and the ability to score. Others think you just have to be young and run lots. I'm personally in the first camp where DCL rarely even makes match day squads. It's not his fault he's put in this position, it's the failing of the club to find an adequate replacement, although I'm going Kean is that.
He contributed pretty much nothing yesterday, but as you've alluded too others were also culpable, but he is miles off being the answer.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on September 16, 2019, 04:09:21 PM
He suffers from being at the business end of a spine of Keane/Mina, Schneiderlin and Sig.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 16, 2019, 04:37:26 PM
Held the ball up on the few occasions he was asked to do so, never stopped running, came deep looking for the ball and provided  link to midfield for runners. The real issue is that we create absolutely zero in terms of real clean cut chances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 16, 2019, 05:00:02 PM
Held the ball up on the few occasions he was asked to do so, never stopped running, came deep looking for the ball and provided  link to midfield for runners. The real issue is that we create absolutely zero in terms of real clean cut chances.
Can't argue with any of that, but isn't it noticeable we create a lot less when he does play?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 16, 2019, 05:02:26 PM
Can't argue with any of that, but isn't it noticeable we create a lot less when he does play?

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Id say no how many chances did we create for kean when he came on yesterday
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 16, 2019, 05:04:18 PM
Can't argue with any of that, but isn't it noticeable we create a lot less when he does play?

Do we?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 16, 2019, 05:11:06 PM
Do we?
I think so, but that's about all I have!

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 16, 2019, 05:28:03 PM
Moise Kean didn't get a shot away yesterday.

Palace, villa and Bournemouth he's been thrown on as a sub and we've not been able to make a single shot for him.

He's one of the most deadly young strikers in the world, and that's an hour of football combined there with no chances whatsoever.

The issue isn't DCL, it's practically everywhere else including the dugout.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Alanvideo on September 16, 2019, 06:14:27 PM
Moise Kean didn't get a shot away yesterday.

Palace, villa and Bournemouth he's been thrown on as a sub and we've not been able to make a single shot for him.

He's one of the most deadly young strikers in the world, and that's an hour of football combined there with no chances whatsoever.

The issue isn't DCL, it's practically everywhere else including the dugout.
.........................yes , as every tv commentator has said this season , good build up but lack of quality in and around the box.
Aguero would struggle to get a shot off in this team.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 16, 2019, 06:26:55 PM
Had a few opportunities to get a shot off yesterday and fluffed it.

I get we're no creating anything clear cut, but he's got to be doing better with the opportunities that present themselves.

Low whipped ball into the near post and it just hits him to go out for a goal kick. The one where he tries to take it round the keeper and got telegraphed, a few more examples I can list.

He scored though, and his general play outside the box was sound as always.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Crackling on September 16, 2019, 06:32:24 PM
Think we'll all have to get used to seeing DCL start a lot games this season.
On Kean's appearances so far, I think he's shown that he's nowhere near the level to be regularly starting and scoring yet*. I'll be surprised if he scores more than 5 league goals this season.

I'd think I'd prefer Richarlison up there for a fee games. See if that works.


*I know things only seem to work on absolutes, but no, I dont think he's shit. I just think he is a 19 year old striker that has a lot of potential, but still has an enormous amount to learn before he is an effective scorer in the premier league.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on September 16, 2019, 07:20:18 PM
all i want from my strikers is:

score goals....
be a target...
lay it off then spin off..into space or creating space for others....

I don't wanna see them coming deep to pick the ball up...
I don't wanna see them out on the wings picking the ball up
I don't wanna see them working the midfield channels.....

simples....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on September 16, 2019, 07:38:51 PM
When things arent going for him he looks awkward on the ball, really one footed and always has to take the extra touch. All of which are forgiven for a striker if hes a real goal threat.

He's a great weapon against certain teams, for his aerial ability and work rate, but he really limits us going forward.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on September 16, 2019, 07:48:37 PM
.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 17, 2019, 05:12:19 AM
Had a few opportunities to get a shot off yesterday and fluffed it.

I get we're no creating anything clear cut, but he's got to be doing better with the opportunities that present themselves.

Low whipped ball into the near post and it just hits him to go out for a goal kick. The one where he tries to take it round the keeper and got telegraphed, a few more examples I can list.

He scored though, and his general play outside the box was sound as always.



You can tell a players gone past the booboy point of no return when he's getting panned for something like that.

Turning a nothing ball down the channel into chaos in opposition box through tireless chasing down. Keeper gets a nick on it when he knocks it round him, a good stop but the idea was right and he totally made it for himself.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on September 17, 2019, 05:17:06 AM
He played well yesterday and scored. Needs to keep doing it. Fluffed some good other chances tho.

But a decent display none the less
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 17, 2019, 01:07:23 PM
You can tell a players gone past the booboy point of no return when he's getting panned for something like that.

Turning a nothing ball down the channel into chaos in opposition box through tireless chasing down. Keeper gets a nick on it when he knocks it round him, a good stop but the idea was right and he totally made it for himself.

I literally praised him in the post mate so swerve the boo boy shite

He couldíve got a shot off there. Youíre blinded, he can do no wrong with you.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 17, 2019, 01:32:57 PM
I literally praised him in the post mate so swerve the boo boy shite

He could’ve got a shot off there. You’re blinded, he can do no wrong with you.

There's no way he's getting a shot off there lad, watch it again honestly it's great work by him.

If there was another player within 100 yards of him maybe it would have been different like.

Nah he's the booboy big time. Can do no right. I suppose if we win the narrative is different of course but that's just footy isn't it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 17, 2019, 01:48:32 PM
There's no way he's getting a shot off there lad, watch it again honestly it's great work by him.

If there was another player within 100 yards of him maybe it would have been different like.

Nah he's the booboy big time. Can do no right. I suppose if we win the narrative is different of course but that's just footy isn't it.

Maybe Iím wrong but I think he couldíve done more with it. Certainly couldíve done better with some of the half chances that fell to him.

Anyway, youíre throwing the boo boy shouts at me so no real point in going any further with this.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on September 17, 2019, 02:15:39 PM
A loan to a Championship club would of done him the world of good
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 17, 2019, 03:44:15 PM
Maybe Iím wrong but I think he couldíve done more with it. Certainly couldíve done better with some of the half chances that fell to him.

Anyway, youíre throwing the boo boy shouts at me so no real point in going any further with this.

I can't say it wasn't at you because it was a directly reply to your criticism but it was more that it served as a good foil for me to moan about the treatment of DCL in general if that makes sense.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on September 17, 2019, 04:42:28 PM
I literally praised him in the post mate so swerve the boo boy shite

He couldíve got a shot off there. Youíre blinded, he can do no wrong with you.
Not sure a shot was on there. The angle was against him and he didn't have control of the ball, He's stretching when trying to flick it past the keeper. Unfortunately he was the only one that believed he could get anything out of that play so nobody was supporting him. If Richarlison had followed him, DCL could square it for a shot at an open goal.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 17, 2019, 05:20:52 PM
Not sure a shot was on there. The angle was against him and he didn't have control of the ball, He's stretching when trying to flick it past the keeper. Unfortunately he was the only one that believed he could get anything out of that play so nobody was supporting him. If Richarlison had followed him, DCL could square it for a shot at an open goal.

A shot may not have been on there, but it certainly was when it was cut back to him and he attempted to control it instead of hitting it first time, then fell over the ball a few times, got up and smashed it about 50 feet over the bar with his left
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on September 17, 2019, 09:39:14 PM
Iíve been a DCL supporter but it boggles my mind how anyone can say he played well on Sunday. I donít care about his general play, I care about his striker play, and itís virtually non-existent. He doesnít occupy CBs, he doesnít make intelligent runs.

Itís been so long since weíve had a proper striker, I think people have forgotten what should be expected of one.

He just doesnít have striker instincts. He can still improve as a player but he wonít improve our team or club.

Unless Kean starts scoring, Brands is looking like he dropped a massive bollock not bringing in a first team ready striker.




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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 17, 2019, 09:46:47 PM
I've been a DCL supporter but it boggles my mind how anyone can say he played well on Sunday. I don't care about his general play, I care about his striker play, and it's virtually non-existent. He doesn't occupy CBs, he doesn't make intelligent runs.

It's been so long since we've had a proper striker, I think people have forgotten what should be expected of one.

He just doesn't have striker instincts. He can still improve as a player but he won't improve our team or club.

Unless Kean starts scoring, Brands is looking like he dropped a massive bollock not bringing in a first team ready striker.




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Irrespective of Keans form we needed at least 1 more striker as we are woefully short. We literally have the worst strike force in the league at the moment and I don't think that's an exaggeration.
Kean hopefully will be world class, but still has loads to do and needs to be given time. Tosun and Niasse, although the former is much better imo both seem to have no future under Silva, which essentially leaves us with DCL, a striker who has never scored goals at any point in his career at any level. Its woeful

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on September 18, 2019, 08:44:10 AM
We've had some great strikers in recent-ish years, not many, but there should be a decent frame of reference for people with the likes of Rooney (in his prime), Saha (not even in his prime, but still what a player), and most recently Lukaku.

If we're serious about challenging we need strikers of that level.

You can say we don't create enough and expect that to be it, as really the reverse of that (sorta) is that good/great strikers help everyone up top, they apply pressure, they move defenders around and they get goals however they can. They give you a threat of scoring. We lack that threat from our strikers currently. Imagine any of those players I mentioned earlier up top for us now, it would be pretty transformative would it not?

The main argument for DCL is his age. That we're playing the long game and he'll develop. That is rational, and if that's the argument I get it albeit that also applies to Kean now. However, if he was playing like this, with his stats and he was 27 would people still think he'd be worthy of inclusion?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee Tuesdays on September 18, 2019, 09:49:46 AM
However, if he was playing like this, with his stats and he was 27 would people still think he'd be worthy of inclusion?

So someone like Tosun but with a slightly worse record?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 01:47:23 PM
There's no doubt in my mind we need an upgrade at centre forward but for whatever reason the lads don't seem to fancy it.

I still think for his age, he's a terrific striker with a high ceiling and he's a million miles away from being *the* issue with this side. People now getting blind to the work he does do which is sad but very predictable.

He isn't picking himself, he isn't telling Brands not to sign Haller or Zapata or whatever. He's just a 22 year old lad desperate to make it at Everton, who unfortunately has found himself the scapegoat for problems that have existed since almost forever!

Moan about your manager and your incredible DOF for leaving us with two kids and Cenk Tosun for a Premier league season if you must moan imo.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 18, 2019, 02:19:03 PM
There's no doubt in my mind we need an upgrade at centre forward but for whatever reason the lads don't seem to fancy it.

I still think for his age, he's a terrific striker with a high ceiling and he's a million miles away from being *the* issue with this side. People now getting blind to the work he does do which is sad but very predictable.

He isn't picking himself, he isn't telling Brands not to sign Haller or Zapata or whatever. He's just a 22 year old lad desperate to make it at Everton, who unfortunately has found himself the scapegoat for problems that have existed since almost forever!

Moan about your manager and your incredible DOF for leaving us with two kids and Cenk Tosun for a Premier league season if you must moan imo.

On the contrary I think some people are being blinded buy the work he does do and failing to see whats before their eyes, hes a striker that doesnt do what hes essentially paid to do, score goals. Hes the clubs number 9 yet he couldnt hit a cows ass with a banjo and its really poor. I fail to see how you can class someone as terrific who doesnt do the basics of their role, hes okay for his age, but nothing better. Abrahams is showing terrific form as hes scored more goals in 5 games than what DCL done in 40, theres the check point on what terrific looks like.

I do agree though this is the failing on the manager and DoF for not addressing as he shouldnt be put in this position, but fair play to him for giving it his best shot, but hes just not good enough.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 18, 2019, 02:21:56 PM
I think you can address that heís a problem whilst also thinking heís a good player with potential.

His lack of any kind of threat in the box hinders us. Heís not *the* problem, but he is a problem.

He shouldnít be starting games though, so you have to point fingers elsewhere.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 03:10:07 PM
On the contrary I think some people are being blinded buy the work he does do and failing to see whats before their eyes, hes a striker that doesnt do what hes essentially paid to do, score goals. Hes the clubs number 9 yet he couldnt hit a cows ass with a banjo and its really poor. I fail to see how you can class someone as terrific who doesnt do the basics of their role, hes okay for his age, but nothing better. Abrahams is showing terrific form as hes scored more goals in 5 games than what DCL done in 40, theres the check point on what terrific looks like.

I do agree though this is the failing on the manager and DoF for not addressing as he shouldnt be put in this position, but fair play to him for giving it his best shot, but hes just not good enough.

Abraham is and has been for years a top talent, Chelsea just pump them out. He's also playing for a top 4/6 club. Just to say as well, his xg is 2.7ish, he won't continue scoring at this rate, not by a long shot.

What you describe as the basics of the role. I would describe at the exceptional elements of the role. Scoring in the Premier league at a reliable rate is something only the top few % of players on the planet can do.

The basics he's got, he needs to add that knack of getting shots away regularly, and we need to help him by creating chances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 18, 2019, 04:40:19 PM
Abraham is and has been for years a top talent, Chelsea just pump them out. He's also playing for a top 4/6 club. Just to say as well, his xg is 2.7ish, he won't continue scoring at this rate, not by a long shot.

What you describe as the basics of the role. I would describe at the exceptional elements of the role. Scoring in the Premier league at a reliable rate is something only the top few % of players on the planet can do.

The basics he's got, he needs to add that knack of getting shots away regularly, and we need to help him by creating chances.
I don't think Abraham will continue either, i suppose its just a terminology thing as for me terrific is Abraham atm, there isn't anything terrific about what DCL has done

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 18, 2019, 04:59:08 PM
I donít care about his general play

Then you're watching football in the wrong century.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 18, 2019, 05:06:03 PM
Moan about your manager and your incredible DOF for leaving us with two kids and Cenk Tosun for a Premier league season if you must moan imo.

I think that's probably a bit unfair. I imagine to bring in the type of striker we need (i.e. better than we have) we probably needed to offload some more deadwood. Brands has done great offloading what he has, and I'm sure he wanted to get more off the books. How much are Niasse and Tosun hoovering up between them on a weekly basis.

From pitch to balance sheets we're clearing up a fuckton of mess that was left by Walsh, Koeman and Allardyce.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 18, 2019, 05:28:29 PM
I think that's probably a bit unfair. I imagine to bring in the type of striker we need (i.e. better than we have) we probably needed to offload some more deadwood. Brands has done great offloading what he has, and I'm sure he wanted to get more off the books. How much are Niasse and Tosun hoovering up between them on a weekly basis.

From pitch to balance sheets we're clearing up a fuckton of mess that was left by Walsh, Koeman and Allardyce.

But you have to look at priorities. For me the jury is out as to whether Iwobi is actually any better than Bernard, id argue spending that 30/35 million would have been better spent elsewhere. If we hadnt spent anything I get the point, but we did invest, I just think in questionable area, centre back and another striker were needed far more than another winger who isnt that much better than what we had, in my opinion.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 18, 2019, 05:32:27 PM
But you have to look at priorities. For me the jury is out as to whether Iwobi is actually any better than Bernard, id argue spending that 30/35 million would have been better spent elsewhere. If we hadnt spent anything I get the point, but we did invest, I just think in questionable area, centre back and another striker were needed far more than another winger who isnt that much better than what we had, in my opinion.

3 games... of course the jury is still out. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors, when players become available and the issues that are encountered. At the end of the day we weren't able to shift two absolute dead weights in the striking position.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 18, 2019, 05:33:46 PM
I don't think Abraham will continue either, i suppose its just a terminology thing as for me terrific is Abraham atm, there isn't anything terrific about what DCL has done

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Abrahams had 15 shots to dcl's  6  in 5 games,, the lads feeding off scraps with creative luck more than clean cut chances
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 18, 2019, 05:37:30 PM
Abrahams had 15 shots to dcl's  6  in 5 games,, the lads feeding off scraps with creative luck more than clean cut chances

What about the other 35 games, im pretty sure DCL would've had just as many chances during those as Abraham has had in 5?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 18, 2019, 05:48:50 PM
What about the other 35 games, im pretty sure DCL would've had just as many chances during those as Abraham has had in 5?

Looking at abrahams 2017 season to dcl 2018 season because abraham didnt play last season

abra   31 apperances  to dcl 35

goals   5                         dcl  6

shots   42                       dcl  52

on tar   15                      dcl   16

missed ch  4                    dcl 7

assist  1                          dcl 2   so all in all quite equal until this season
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 18, 2019, 05:51:36 PM
Looking at abrahams 2017 season to dcl 2018 season because abraham didnt play last season

abra   31 apperances  to dcl 35

goals   5                         dcl  6

shots   42                       dcl  52

on tar   15                      dcl   16

missed ch  4                    dcl 7

assist  1                          dcl 2   so all in all quite equal until this season

Good stats, its good to see that Abraham has developed, and gone from being bang average to a competent striker
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 18, 2019, 05:57:58 PM
I didnt add any other season for dcl because last season was the only one hes played as a striker,,,was abraham on loan last season
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 18, 2019, 06:08:43 PM
I didnt add any other season for dcl because last season was the only one hes played as a striker,,,was abraham on loan last season

He was at Villa.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on September 18, 2019, 06:31:20 PM
People saying we don't make enough chances for DCL (or other players) which is fair enough, can't see anyone disagreeing with that.

On the flip side would he have finished that second Callum Wilson goal? Nope!  That's the acid test for me... If he gets in those situations would he score?  So we're fucked either way with him up there.

I don't hate him, I think he's got qualities, but you can see he's not good enough and might never be.  He tries hard, you can't fault his commitment, but the sooner Kean is up to speed the better.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 18, 2019, 06:57:31 PM
People saying we don't make enough chances for DCL (or other players) which is fair enough, can't see anyone disagreeing with that.

On the flip side would he have finished that second Callum Wilson goal? Nope!  That's the acid test for me... If he gets in those situations would he score?  So we're fucked either way with him up there.

I don't hate him, I think he's got qualities, but you can see he's not good enough and might never be.  He tries hard, you can't fault his commitment, but the sooner Kean is up to speed the better.

Scored a similar(ish) goal against Cardiff last season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 07:01:15 PM
People saying we don't make enough chances for DCL (or other players) which is fair enough, can't see anyone disagreeing with that.

On the flip side would he have finished that second Callum Wilson goal? Nope!  That's the acid test for me... If he gets in those situations would he score?  So we're fucked either way with him up there.

I don't hate him, I think he's got qualities, but you can see he's not good enough and might never be.  He tries hard, you can't fault his commitment, but the sooner Kean is up to speed the better.

Out of curiosity, where is that opinion gathered from?

What about the almost identical goal he scored last year when Gana fed him through?

He finishes his chances at a *slightly slower* rate to his xg according to what I've seen, altho other models rate him higher. Non pen xg 14, goals 12. Makes sense considering most of his shots are headers.

His issue is that he doesn't make enough for himself and he doesn't get enough made for him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 18, 2019, 07:15:35 PM
Scored a similar(ish) goal against Cardiff last season.

Straight down the middle, keeper really shouldíve done better.

Had a similar chance against Fulham a few weeks later and fluffed it.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on September 18, 2019, 07:34:47 PM
Out of curiosity, where is that opinion gathered from?

What about the almost identical goal he scored last year when Gana fed him through?

He finishes his chances at a *slightly slower* rate to his xg according to what I've seen, altho other models rate him higher. Non pen xg 14, goals 12. Makes sense considering most of his shots are headers.

His issue is that he doesn't make enough for himself and he doesn't get enough made for him.

It's not almost identical though, it's similar maybe but Wilson's is a MUCH harder chance... it's from more of an angle, it's bouncing... the control he needed there is a level above Calvert-Lewin's finish, which as decent as it was the ball was rolling on the deck and he had almost the whole goal to aim at.

I did go back and re-watch it to make sure I hadn't made a massive error, and that game if you watch the goals you'll see Sig score 2.  The 2nd actually DCL had he been more instinctive and his movement better would have had a goal instead, but he's flat footed and doesn't move to the ball, it's lucky it came back to Sig who scored. 

Like I said I don't hate him, he's a decent player and a decent back up, but relying on him to be our frontman is fool hardy, he's just not good enough.  It's not his fault, and he has improved over the last 12 months, but we REALLY need Kean to start finding his feet or it's going to be a hell of a long and not very good season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 07:37:50 PM
It's not almost identical though, it's similar maybe but Wilson's is a MUCH harder chance... it's from more of an angle, it's bouncing... the control he needed there is a level above Calvert-Lewin's finish, which as decent as it was the ball was rolling on the deck and he had almost the whole goal to aim at.

I did go back and re-watch it to make sure I hadn't made a massive error, and that game if you watch the goals you'll see Sig score 2.  The 2nd actually DCL had he been more instinctive and his movement better would have had a goal instead, but he's flat footed and doesn't move to the ball, it's lucky it came back to Sig who scored. 

Like I said I don't hate him, he's a decent player and a decent back up, but relying on him to be our frontman is fool hardy, he's just not good enough.  It's not his fault, and he has improved over the last 12 months, but we REALLY need Kean to start finding his feet or it's going to be a hell of a long and not very good season.

So what's it based on sorry
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 18, 2019, 07:46:04 PM
Nearly everyone thinks he shouldnt be leading the line and isnt good enough so why then do we persist in playing him on his own,, wouldnt it be better playing 2 upfront in the games we can
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on September 18, 2019, 07:48:09 PM
So what's it based on sorry

I'm confused by the question - I'm guessing the answer is watching him play? He's not an instinctive striker, he doesn't move in to the right areas at the right time, he doesn't have that aspect of his game like say Aubameyang has.  YES he can hold it up well, he's also a good athlete but when you compare him to other players who have that instinct to get across the front man, or to peel off at the right time it's just not there.  We're not making chances so I'm not saying the problem is solely DCL, it's not, there are other issues that need to be addressed, but even if they are we're still not going to be able to really challenge the teams above us without a striker who can score goals regularly. 

Out of interest, as it seems you disagree with me, what's your rational that he is good enough or will get us 15-20 goals a season?  Or are you saying we don't need that and a striker with general good hold up play and 8 goals a season is enough as it brings others in to play?  Genuingly interested as I don't hate him, I just don't think he should be our first choice striker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 08:01:48 PM
I'm confused by the question - I'm guessing the answer is watching him play? He's not an instinctive striker, he doesn't move in to the right areas at the right time, he doesn't have that aspect of his game like say Aubameyang has.  YES he can hold it up well, he's also a good athlete but when you compare him to other players who have that instinct to get across the front man, or to peel off at the right time it's just not there.  We're not making chances so I'm not saying the problem is solely DCL, it's not, there are other issues that need to be addressed, but even if they are we're still not going to be able to really challenge the teams above us without a striker who can score goals regularly. 

Out of interest, as it seems you disagree with me, what's your rational that he is good enough or will get us 15-20 goals a season?  Or are you saying we don't need that and a striker with general good hold up play and 8 goals a season is enough as it brings others in to play?  Genuingly interested as I don't hate him, I just don't think he should be our first choice striker.


It's just people say he's a bad finisher but I don't really see that myself.

He's bad at making shots for himself and complaints about his movement behind the line or getting on the end of stuff I would agree but would I back him to finish a chance... Probably?

I expect him to finish *about* as much as expected from a prem level finisher. I just don't expect him to get that many chances. If he (and the team around him) can fix that then we've got a super asset.

The Kean thing... Absolutely deadly in my opinion, and we still can't get a chance on his plate.

Silvas football is just not conductive to high quality chances it seems to me. Drop aubamayang in there if you like but his only chances are balls fired into his chin then he'll probably struggle an all.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 18, 2019, 08:04:29 PM
It's just people say he's a bad finisher but I don't really see that myself.

He's bad at making shots for himself and complaints about his movement behind the line or getting on the end of stuff I would agree but would I back him to finish a chance... Probably?

I expect him to finish *about* as much as expected from a prem level finisher. I just don't expect him to get that many chances. If he (and the team around him) can fix that then we've got a super asset.

The Kean thing... Absolutely deadly in my opinion, and we still can't get a chance on his plate.

Silvas football is just not conductive to high quality chances it seems to me. Drop aubamayang in there if you like but his only chances are balls fired into his chin then he'll probably struggle an all.

Are you saying heís a good finisher? If so, what would you base that on?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 08:10:32 PM
Are you saying heís a good finisher? If so, what would you base that on?

I think he's about average prem level finisher, so yeah I think that's probably in the top 5% of finishers on the planet.

Hes done it over a few seasons in his early 20s as well, with most of his chances coming from his bonce, so potentially he could be a very, very good finisher actually.

But, he doesn't take enough shots. He doesn't get enough chances, he doesn't make a chance out of nothing, I've only seen him put his laces through it like twice, so in terms of watching him you don't really feel that confident unless he's towered above a defender.

Im certainly not seeing him flap sitters or hit the keeper none stop or anything, I see him just not getting shots off which is probably worse!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on September 18, 2019, 08:11:56 PM
It's just people say he's a bad finisher but I don't really see that myself.

He's bad at making shots for himself and complaints about his movement behind the line or getting on the end of stuff I would agree but would I back him to finish a chance... Probably?

I expect him to finish *about* as much as expected from a prem level finisher. I just don't expect him to get that many chances. If he (and the team around him) can fix that then we've got a super asset.

The Kean thing... Absolutely deadly in my opinion, and we still can't get a chance on his plate.

Silvas football is just not conductive to high quality chances it seems to me. Drop aubamayang in there if you like but his only chances are balls fired into his chin then he'll probably struggle an all.

Ah right ok, yeah I don't think he's a terrible finisher but I also don't think he's a top class finisher either.  I'd be more forgiving of him not being a top class finisher if he was getting in great positions and missing a few but scoring too, but to me he's deadly with his head, and sort of average with is feet when he gets a good chance.  That Wilson chance for me was a difficult one, I'm not convinced DCL has it in his locker to finish that one, and that could be the difference between 3 points and 1 or zero.

I do get what you're saying about Silva's football though, I hoped we'd kick on this season but I'm starting to feel pretty certain by the end of the year we'll be about where we were last season, which isn't good enough.  The whole thing is a bit of a shit show really though - Silva's football is pretty 'meh', we still have a load of players we need to ship out instead of playing... I want Silva to succeed and feel some of the issues aren't his doing, but equally on the other hand think he's not getting the most out of them, that someone more inspiring would possibly do. 

It's all adding up to another uninspiring year it seems.  Fingers crossed that once the new players are up to speed it all changes, but we really need them to have a BIG impact or it's going to be a missed opportunity to get in that top 6.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on September 18, 2019, 08:14:38 PM
I think he's about average prem level finisher, so yeah I think that's probably in the top 5% of finishers on the planet.

Hes done it over a few seasons in his early 20s as well, with most of his chances coming from his bonce, so potentially he could be a very, very good finisher actually.

But, he doesn't take enough shots. He doesn't get enough chances, he doesn't make a chance out of nothing, I've only seen him put his laces through it like twice, so in terms of watching him you don't really feel that confident unless he's towered above a defender.

Im certainly not seeing him flap sitters or hit the keeper none stop or anything, I see him just not getting shots off which is probably worse!

Yeah you can be the best finisher in the world, but if you aren't getting in the right positions to get the shot away it's a null point.  Classic example would me Aubameyang I think it was at the weekend, you watch him just pull between two defenders, gets in exactly THE right spot to receive the ball and get his shot away.  DCL wouldn't get in that position to have that chance.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 08:24:02 PM
Ah right ok, yeah I don't think he's a terrible finisher but I also don't think he's a top class finisher either.  I'd be more forgiving of him not being a top class finisher if he was getting in great positions and missing a few but scoring too, but to me he's deadly with his head, and sort of average with is feet when he gets a good chance.  That Wilson chance for me was a difficult one, I'm not convinced DCL has it in his locker to finish that one, and that could be the difference between 3 points and 1 or zero.

I do get what you're saying about Silva's football though, I hoped we'd kick on this season but I'm starting to feel pretty certain by the end of the year we'll be about where we were last season, which isn't good enough.  The whole thing is a bit of a shit show really though - Silva's football is pretty 'meh', we still have a load of players we need to ship out instead of playing... I want Silva to succeed and feel some of the issues aren't his doing, but equally on the other hand think he's not getting the most out of them, that someone more inspiring would possibly do. 

It's all adding up to another uninspiring year it seems.  Fingers crossed that once the new players are up to speed it all changes, but we really need them to have a BIG impact or it's going to be a missed opportunity to get in that top 6.

Yeah I didn't think we were good enough to make a real real fist of it, but we could have maybe had a run at it with enough momentum, but then we had bad injuries and now we just look stuck in Silvas rotate but don't change thing, already sorts cba with the year which is a shame.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on September 18, 2019, 08:25:47 PM
Then you're watching football in the wrong century.
Heís not Firmino.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on September 18, 2019, 08:29:45 PM
Is it just me or should we be comparing DCL to Wilson in about half a decade? Or Aubameyang, like, never?

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on September 18, 2019, 08:33:16 PM
Is it just me or should we be comparing DCL to Wilson in about half a decade? Or Aubameyang, like, never?



When I mention those two I'm not saying DCL should be as good as them, I'm saying the fact he isn't is a huge issue.  That's down to the board and recruitment etc, it's not DCL's fault he's not that level, but that level IS what we need if we are to make any sort of progress.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary Todd on September 18, 2019, 08:34:53 PM
Needs more experience before we can ever dream of depending on him a season in a lower league could have helped him, always puts 100% dedication in but a striker scores goals Dcl doesn't score many at present but hopefully more  experience will help with this issue

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on September 18, 2019, 08:36:43 PM
Heís not Firmino.


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Even if he were, that only works if you have players either side who can finish to the level of a top striker essentially.

I like Bernard don't get me wrong but you swop out Mane for Bernard and that whole setup kinda doesn't work as well as he's not a regular goalscorer. There has to be enough players on the field who can score regularly. So if the idea is DCL is the player who brings in others, we'd need big, likely almost world class numbers from both wings and/or our no 10. Or to be able for all our players to chip in more regularly with goals.

Right now, we're lacking goalscorers in the side. This is probably why Sigurdsson is so important to Silva as really it's him and Richarlison and after that the falloff is pretty steep. We just don't have the numbers in the side to carry a no.9 who doesn't also have a potent goal threat.

If we had Salah and Mane, then who cares, play DCL all day long.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on September 18, 2019, 08:54:17 PM
He missed a massive sitter this season.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ECtlbFpWsAEicYP?format=jpg&name=large)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 09:04:10 PM
One sitter? That settles it then.

Play Kean who... Is struggling to even get a shot off at the moment... That will sort it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 18, 2019, 09:07:13 PM
No ones having 2 upfront are they why is that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on September 18, 2019, 09:13:09 PM
Personally, it's probably not helpful to pull up single moments as a way to bash DCL. He should've taken that chance but it's football and even the best players miss these things sometimes. It's just a shame in that instance as that would've given him confidence being early in the season. To me at least, he's playing without confidence he'll score, that's why he doesn't want to put himself in these positions at times it feels like and he'll run around and do donkey work but sometimes that can be a way to disguise the fact that he's nervous to be the one to take the shot. If he was more confident in being up top, I think he'd stay in goal scoring areas more often than he does currently.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 18, 2019, 09:18:48 PM
One sitter? That settles it then.

Play Kean who... Is struggling to even get a shot off at the moment... That will sort it.

The derby as well. Countless other chances heís missed.

Thereís more examples of him fluffing chances than taking them well.

Certainly donít see any evidence that heís a good finisher.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 18, 2019, 09:21:03 PM
Missed 15 big chances in 83 apperances
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on September 18, 2019, 09:23:03 PM
One sitter? That settles it then.

Play Kean who... Is struggling to even get a shot off at the moment... That will sort it.

Come on Brap, its not just one.

You said he hasnt missed a sitter, i showed one he has.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 09:37:54 PM
Come on Brap, its not just one.

You said he hasnt missed a sitter, i showed one he has.


Well I mean im not seeing him flap sitters regularly, all strikers miss and all strikers miss bad bad sitters.

Find me a striker in the Premier league who hasn't missed a chance as bad or worse than that. A quick look at shot quality says Harry kane missed a bigger one at Newcastle, put it wide. Is he a bad finisher?

To be honest I still don't think we know enough about his finishing because he doesn't shoot enough.

Part of that is the team, part of that is him no doubt.

But I wouldn't say he's a bad finisher myself. At 22 if you're about around your xg = goal level then OK you're not Messi but you're not Benteke either.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on September 18, 2019, 09:38:22 PM
They all miss sitters. 2 of the best finishers Iíve seen live (Aguero and Yakubu) have both missed the target completely from 3yrds out.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 09:41:17 PM
Raheem sterling is one of the most deadly men in world football, but you could write a book on the absolute sitters he's missed.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on September 18, 2019, 09:46:53 PM
He also scores 25 goals a season.

Going away from the point now. Just all going round in circles.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: D15TIN on September 18, 2019, 09:50:08 PM
Raheem sterling is one of the most deadly men in world football, but you could write a book on the absolute sitters he's missed.
hang on mate, he's hitting 20+ a season from the wing haha
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 09:53:52 PM
He also scores 25 goals a season.

Going away from the point now. Just all going round in circles.

You are right.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on September 18, 2019, 09:54:20 PM
Donít the numbers have him as a slightly below average finisher? So we have ambitions to be an above average team and heís below average. On top of that his movement and positioning are poor so he gets less opportunities. Think when you combine the 3 attributes we are in trouble
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 18, 2019, 09:54:34 PM
hang on mate, he's hitting 20+ a season from the wing haha
this is exactly my point, but I may not have put it across v well since people are responding with - but he does score.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on September 18, 2019, 09:56:33 PM
you have to miss some to score some..

unfortunately in DCL's equation he doesn't score enough to even out his missed chances or even accept it as a goals to miss ratio..(or vice versa)

the big factor is you have to be in a position to miss.. to obviously increase your percentage chance of converting chances - misses - into goals......which because of his working of the channels he cant do...

he can finish....he's kinda proved that with the actual goals he has scored.....his goal in world cup final was a great finish....the difference being the high level he's playing at now against better defenders and goalkeepers means he's just not doing it at this level.....

is it a step too high.....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 19, 2019, 12:04:54 AM
Well I mean im not seeing him flap sitters regularly, all strikers miss and all strikers miss bad bad sitters.

Find me a striker in the Premier league who hasn't missed a chance as bad or worse than that. A quick look at shot quality says Harry kane missed a bigger one at Newcastle, put it wide. Is he a bad finisher?

To be honest I still don't think we know enough about his finishing because he doesn't shoot enough.

Part of that is the team, part of that is him no doubt.

But I wouldn't say he's a bad finisher myself. At 22 if you're about around your xg = goal level then OK you're not Messi but you're not Benteke either.
Hasn't Benteke scored more goals than DCL in the same time?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on September 19, 2019, 12:23:09 AM
Hasn't Benteke scored more goals than DCL in the same time?

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In his last 3 seasons including this, Benteke has scored 3 non pen goals from an xg of more than 13.

Thats what under performing looks like as a finisher.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on September 19, 2019, 12:26:12 AM
In his last 3 seasons including this, Benteke has scored 3 non pen goals from an xg of more than 13.

Thats what under performing looks like as a finisher.
Okay I didn't look into it much, just read Benteke scored 19 from his last 87 appearance, whereas DCL had 12 from 83.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on September 19, 2019, 01:15:20 AM
Straws seem to be at a premium.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on September 19, 2019, 05:25:05 AM
Okay I didn't look into it much, just read Benteke scored 19 from his last 87 appearance, whereas DCL had 12 from 83.

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You need to take into account that dcl has only really played 1 season as a centre forward and the rest all over the gaff
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on September 19, 2019, 02:17:14 PM
No ones having 2 upfront are they why is that

Because we already do play two up front, and it is one of the reasons we arenít creating any chances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on September 19, 2019, 02:20:48 PM
I think the polar opinions on DCL come from the fact that people are judging him on different criteria. The ones that like him are judging him as a promising talent and the ones that don't as our starting CF. The fact is that at the moment he is not good enough for a team with ambitions to break the top 6. I don't know why we decided to go with him and Kean as our only options up front this season (its obvious Silva doesn't want to use Tosun) I can't imagine Kean was bought as the solution for CF this season. He's a 19yo who's only played 2 months of top level football in a completely different league. Maybe its a question of finances. We already pay 200k/week on 3 strikers (Sandro, Tosun, Niasse) who are not likely to get a game for us, maybe Brands was told that he couldn't spend another 100k on a new striker.
He's not useless though as he's a great option for a backup. He's a great option against teams that press high as the defence know that they can knock it long to him  to relieve the pressure. He's a real nuisance for the defenders, when we would get the ball wide for a cross they would often put 2 defenders on him. I don't think we have any other player in our squad with the physicality required to score that goal against Bournemouth.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on September 19, 2019, 07:20:40 PM
I think the polar opinions on DCL come from the fact that people are judging him on different criteria. The ones that like him are judging him as a promising talent and the ones that don't as our starting CF. The fact is that at the moment he is not good enough for a team with ambitions to break the top 6. I don't know why we decided to go with him and Kean as our only options up front this season (its obvious Silva doesn't want to use Tosun) I can't imagine Kean was bought as the solution for CF this season. He's a 19yo who's only played 2 months of top level football in a completely different league. Maybe its a question of finances. We already pay 200k/week on 3 strikers (Sandro, Tosun, Niasse) who are not likely to get a game for us, maybe Brands was told that he couldn't spend another 100k on a new striker.
He's not useless though as he's a great option for a backup. He's a great option against teams that press high as the defence know that they can knock it long to him  to relieve the pressure. He's a real nuisance for the defenders, when we would get the ball wide for a cross they would often put 2 defenders on him. I don't think we have any other player in our squad with the physicality required to score that goal against Bournemouth.

A striker who doesnít carry any goal threat is great backup?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on September 19, 2019, 08:17:04 PM
A striker who doesnít carry any goal threat is great backup?
It is in Silva's system. His striker does not need to get all the goals. They need to do many other things which help bring other players into the attack and share the goals around the team. He did it very effectively at the end of last season when we went on a good run in which DCL didn't score. He did it effectively also at Watford where his strikers were Gray and Okaka. Neither of them are prolific but they are strong physical players who can batter defenders in order to open spaces for others. He also did it at Olympiakos where he had Brown Ideye as a striker. Obviously it would be a bonus if we had a striker who was a goal threat but there's more than one way to skin a cat.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on September 19, 2019, 08:44:42 PM
It is in Silva's system. His striker does not need to get all the goals. They need to do many other things which help bring other players into the attack and share the goals around the team. He did it very effectively at the end of last season when we went on a good run in which DCL didn't score. He did it effectively also at Watford where his strikers were Gray and Okaka. Neither of them are prolific but they are strong physical players who can batter defenders in order to open spaces for others. He also did it at Olympiakos where he had Brown Ideye as a striker. Obviously it would be a bonus if we had a striker who was a goal threat but there's more than one way to skin a cat.

mate your wasting a post kn10 has a personal issue with DCL  lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on September 19, 2019, 08:56:59 PM

mate your wasting a post kn10 has a personal issue with DCL  lolol

My only issue is heís not very good. Describing him as great is just plain laughable. Heís useful as a sub assuming we are already winning. Anything else and he shouldnít be on the pitch
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 19, 2019, 09:06:57 PM
He missed a massive sitter this season.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ECtlbFpWsAEicYP?format=jpg&name=large)

I hate still images like this because they provide no context of the actual situation. In this image it looks like the world's easiest chance. Where as in reality the ball is moving at speed, the defenders are moving at speed etc. Never judge a chance on a still image.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on September 19, 2019, 09:35:54 PM
I hate still images like this because they provide no context of the actual situation. In this image it looks like the world's easiest chance. Where as in reality the ball is moving at speed, the defenders are moving at speed etc. Never judge a chance on a still image.

I remember the chance in real time, he has to score it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on September 19, 2019, 09:38:04 PM
I remember the chance in real time, he has to score it.

I've seen better strikers miss easier sitters.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on September 19, 2019, 09:40:18 PM
I think it's time to stop pointing fingers or making excuses....

Everton FC shoulda bought a recognised striker the minute we knew Lukaku was leaving...Ö

with high ambitions we've been without a recognised striker now for you could argue 3 seasons.....

get it sorted everton and stop relying on young kids to be more than they are....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: arteta4spain on September 19, 2019, 11:20:36 PM
I think it's time to stop pointing fingers or making excuses....

Everton FC shoulda bought a recognised striker the minute we knew Lukaku was leaving......

with high ambitions we've been without a recognised striker now for you could argue 3 seasons.....

get it sorted everton and stop relying on young kids to be more than they are....
I hear ya. If we were skint and had to balance the books etc youíd kind of understand. I think weíre in a catch 22 though. We have the money and the ambition but we canít lure players with champions league football. Itís like we have to get there to get the players to get us there if that makes sense.
In a way it sounds like the really good players donít want to really graft to get us up the league.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on September 25, 2019, 11:57:33 PM
The actually decent tactics writer from the echo highlighted this stat about DCL

Quote
Calvert-Lewinís first goal of the game was given an xG value of just 0.11, effectively highlighting that the effort had around an 11% chance of leading to a goal.

Although his second strike of the game was significantly easier with an xG value of 0.66, the England U21 striker still finished that game with a combined xG of just 0.86, yet he managed to score twice

When you combine his goal and xG total's from the Bournemouth game too, it highlights he has three goals from a combined xG total of just 1.63.

A consistent overperformance  for a striker in terms of xG usually points to a very accurate finisher in front of goal. Although itís still too early to determine if Calvert-Lewin will eventually fall under this category, evidence shows he is at least heading in the right direction.

A run of goals from DCL would be really beneficial to him and take a lot of the pressure of Kean to hit the ground running


EDIT: Also from the very brief highlights that I saw it looked like Iwobi as picking the ball up a lot in the channel in between the striker and the wingers, either behind or making a run in front of, leaving DCL as the central player. We need to try give this combo as much of a chance as possible IMO
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on October 02, 2019, 08:02:17 PM
Well played DCL ...awaits the usual supects shout the usual .
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Juanito on October 02, 2019, 08:19:12 PM
I remember the chance in real time, he has to score it.

it looks like his body shape is not primed to shoot when he gets into those positions. Like is just not natural. The chance against Villa, the chance at the end against City.  The miss in the derby at Goodison a few years back when we had Fat Sam was a prime example, its like he just freezes in the box. He is improving though but should be improving under a natural striker/finisher.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on October 02, 2019, 08:47:28 PM
He got it low and hard and on target and one of the 3(??) cbs or goalie on the line managed to get across and block it.

Shit happens, worry more about Moise Kean in this side tbh.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on October 02, 2019, 09:18:41 PM
Well played DCL ...awaits the usual supects shout the usual .

Fair play to him, im not a fan but he put a shift in and probably if we had to give an award to anyone based on the horrific string of results then it should go to him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on October 02, 2019, 09:29:56 PM
I think we've pinned a lot of our hopes on him improving and giving us a better option than he is currently offering us.

There's still time of course but he isn't showing the instinct that Abraham offers for example, which is a genuine desire to get on the scoresheet, regardless of ability.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on October 02, 2019, 09:44:32 PM
Obviously a lot more factors to take into consideration but Abraham has had twice as many shots as DCL, with DCL averaging a slightly higher shots on target percentage

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/everton/top-scorers
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/teams/chelsea/top-scorers
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on October 02, 2019, 09:56:13 PM
xg stats...blah blah blah....

again...his hard/good work is all done outside the box...... for me he needs to stop working the channels and wings too much and basically expect the chances to be laid on a plate for him...inside the box...after all isn't that why we bought an abundance of wingers and good crossers of the ball....
obviously as a CF he will create his own chances also..but we shud be giving our centre forward whoever that maybe as many laid on chances as we can....

if he keeps missing them..then and only then... should he be brought into question...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on October 02, 2019, 10:06:18 PM
Scored 4 in his last 3 hasn't he?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on October 02, 2019, 10:17:44 PM
Scored 4 in his last 3 hasn't he?

Yur bt remember the 1s he missed in tha past.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on October 02, 2019, 11:22:41 PM
Well played DCL ...awaits the usual supects shout the usual .

Almost certainly our best player in that period. Not sure we had anyone good enough to come second though. Itís a bit like a goal of the month under allardyce
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on October 03, 2019, 12:53:03 AM
Almost like some people don't want to be proved wrong in this thread...

I like that DCL is suddenly starting to get more chances and although he maybe should have had more goals, his confidence must have improved in recent weeks and that can only be a good thing for us.

Absolutely loved that he robbed Coleman's goal as well, that's the sort of instinct he needs to show.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on October 03, 2019, 01:00:21 AM
DCL, for his age and experience, is doing quite well.  He works hard, fits the team, and how Marco wants to play.  Of course he's not fucking PERFECT, none of the more supportive folk have ever claimed such.

We will get more from Kean as time goes on, and have a nice attacking duo.

Both are streets ahead of Cenk Tosun, which was always readily apparent to anyone watching with their eyes open.

UPDATE: Our problems, almost exclusively, lie in midfield/how we set up.  I am willing to be somewhat patient until Gbamin is back.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on October 03, 2019, 01:16:57 AM
Almost like some people don't want to be proved wrong in this thread...

I like that DCL is suddenly starting to get more chances and although he maybe should have had more goals, his confidence must have improved in recent weeks and that can only be a good thing for us.

Absolutely loved that he robbed Coleman's goal as well, that's the sort of instinct he needs to show.

Iíd love to be proved wrong. 2 goals against a championships sides second team and a header which was already half way across the line isnít proving anyone wrong though

The opposite is true we are right back to people claiming how well heís doing when thereís zero evidence of it
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on October 03, 2019, 01:24:17 AM
Iíd love to be proved wrong. 2 goals against a championships sides second team and a header which was already half way across the line isnít proving anyone wrong though

The opposite is true we are right back to people claiming how well heís doing when thereís zero evidence of it

He cant win.

 if he doesn't score in that game then he gets criticised, he scores and gets no credit.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on October 03, 2019, 01:28:40 AM
So you moan that he only scored those goals against a poor side and when he follows it up with a goal against the champions of England, you complain about the type of goal he scored.

What happens if he scores against Burnley? "Just relegation fodder"
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on October 03, 2019, 01:35:59 AM
So you moan that he only scored those goals against a poor side and when he follows it up with a goal against the champions of England, you complain about the type of goal he scored.

What happens if he scores against Burnley? "Just relegation fodder"


Parody account mate. Youíve been had off.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on October 03, 2019, 01:39:55 AM
Parody account mate. Youíve been had off.

Would love to know who he actually rates
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cereal Killer on October 03, 2019, 01:52:40 AM
Would love to know who he actually rates

Salah, Mane and Firminio  :whistle:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: gizzblue on October 03, 2019, 01:58:31 AM
Quote from: brap2  lolol=topic=98178.msg1614432#msg1614432 date=1570028778
Scored 4 in his last 3 hasn't he?

Sshhhh Brap you will upset a few with talk like this  lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on October 03, 2019, 03:31:55 AM
if everyone wrote down their best 20 to 30 strikers, or people that can play in that position, in the Premiership id be surprised if DCL was included that often.

But given we can't pick and choose who we want he is clearly looking like the best option at the current time. I don't think he offers much, but hes got a few goals in the last few games and irrespective of the manner or opposition they still count, so you need to give him credit for doing what he rarely does, which is score, and hopefully it'll continue as without his goals we don't seem to have anyone else stepping up.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: boothill on October 03, 2019, 06:43:17 AM
Have you got a partner KNT ?
I'd love to be proved wrong. 2 goals against a championships sides second team and a header which was already half way across the line isn't proving anyone wrong though

The opposite is true we are right back to people claiming how well he's doing when there's zero evidence of it

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 03, 2019, 02:17:32 PM
Have you got a partner KNT ?
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Yeah, Waltzer and Farnham.

Itís a threesome of sexy negativity.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on October 03, 2019, 04:56:49 PM
Scored 4 in his last 3 hasn't he?

Exactly mate and where have those 4 goals come from...inside the box.....proves my point to a tee...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on October 03, 2019, 07:30:35 PM
Round and round and round we go....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on October 03, 2019, 07:43:23 PM
Round and round and round we go....

(https://media3.giphy.com/media/1360oC2M0B62k/giphy.gif?cid=790b761141278e1f329620716c3d1371862522a82c8004cc&rid=giphy.gif)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on October 03, 2019, 09:00:01 PM
Yeah, Waltzer and Farnham.

It's a threesome of sexy negativity.
I try to look at myself as being objective and honest, if that comes across as negative I apologies.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 03, 2019, 10:50:21 PM
I try to look at myself as being objective and honest, if that comes across as negative I apologies.

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Phwooar, is that the seduction line you use on KNT and MF?  :hug:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Heath on October 05, 2019, 04:10:39 AM

Credit where it's due. We wanted the lad to start scoring, and he has done. Now we can turn our attention to someone else in the squad. That Kean, eh... what a waste of money he was. Not a single hattrick yet. Out of his depth, not good enough at this level, overrated, etc etc


Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on October 05, 2019, 06:42:45 PM
Phwooar, is that the seduction line you use on KNT and MF?  :hug:

It is and Iím hard already xxx you want to watch just ask
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on October 05, 2019, 07:30:04 PM
He'll be a double figures a season, in all competitions, striker from here on in. Which is what you want from a forward in your squad.

Our concern is that Sig has probably peaked and won't be posting the numbers he used to anymore. We also have little coming down the left too.

All of which puts a huge burden on Richarlison and Kean, two young players finding their way in the game, as there's not much coming from elsewhere either.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 05, 2019, 07:56:24 PM
It is and Iím hard already xxx you want to watch just ask

We all have no choice but to watch on here. Youíve turned us all into unwitting, negative voyeurs ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on October 05, 2019, 08:19:22 PM
We all have no choice but to watch on here. Youíve turned us all into unwitting, negative voyeurs ;)

Haha. Sorry. If he scores today Iíll give you a week off my DCL moaning (Iíll stay on the sigurdsson thread)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 05, 2019, 08:20:55 PM
Haha. Sorry. If he scores today Iíll give you a week off my DCL moaning (Iíll stay on the sigurdsson thread)

Haha, guarantee Sigurdsson gets a goal and an assist from 10 touches today.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on October 05, 2019, 08:23:38 PM
Haha, guarantee Sigurdsson gets a goal and an assist from 10 touches today.

Hope so. We desperately need a win to get this season started
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Fynci on October 05, 2019, 08:24:21 PM
Haha, guarantee Sigurdsson gets a goal and an assist from 10 touches today.

Should have more touches, needs to be involved more.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on October 05, 2019, 08:25:18 PM
Should have more touches, needs to be involved more.

Really?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Fynci on October 05, 2019, 08:50:25 PM
Really?

I didn't think that needed a winky face, but I was wrong.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on October 05, 2019, 09:47:25 PM
Really poor decision making by us all half
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on October 05, 2019, 09:49:29 PM
Clueless performance really
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: toshyboy on October 05, 2019, 11:19:00 PM
We donít service our front men at, they essentially have to make their own chances
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Free Agent on October 06, 2019, 09:00:19 AM
Even the commentators were saying DCL was making the right runs but the ball never came to him from midfield.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on October 06, 2019, 02:12:14 PM
Haha, guarantee Sigurdsson gets a goal and an assist from 10 touches today.

Umm... how do I make a claim under this guarantee?

My Sigurdsson did not score and assist even though it had more than the recommended 10 touches.

This item was bought in good faith at full price.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 06, 2019, 02:34:59 PM
Umm... how do I make a claim under this guarantee?

My Sigurdsson did not score and assist even though it had more than the recommended 10 touches.

This item was bought in good faith at full price.

Iím shocked he had 10 touches in 70 minutes, actually
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on October 06, 2019, 10:50:38 PM
Here's where we got the ball to our strikers v Burnley.

Another 0 shots  fired from Moise Kean as well, poor bastard.

Can't stress enough that get rid of silva and put a capable manager in, and we will start blowing teams like this off the park. The leagues wide open this year beyond the top two positions, we can't afford to waste any more time waiting for him to pull his head out the sand.

Even with this dreadful paucity of chances created, we've still been up 'in the stats' v villa, sheff u, Bournemouth and Burnley.

change it a bit, find someone who can work on possession and combinations with the impressive forward talent he has at his disposal, sort set pieces and fly up the league.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 06, 2019, 10:53:53 PM
Here's where we got the ball to our strikers v Burnley.

Another 0 shots  fired from Moise Kean as well, poor bastard.

Can't stress enough that get rid of silva and put a capable manager in, and we will start blowing teams like this off the park. The leagues wide open this year beyond the top two positions, we can't afford to waste any more time waiting for him to pull his head out the sand.

Even with this dreadful paucity of chances created, we've still been up 'in the stats' v villa, sheff u, Bournemouth and Burnley.

change it a bit, find someone who can work on possession and combinations with the impressive forward talent he has at his disposal, sort set pieces and fly up the league.

Would you gamble with your career if the bloos came knocking, @brap2 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=666) ?

Ironically, Portugal have produced a few managerís with no professional football experience ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on October 07, 2019, 04:58:48 AM
Here's where we got the ball to our strikers v Burnley.

Another 0 shots  fired from Moise Kean as well, poor bastard.

Can't stress enough that get rid of silva and put a capable manager in, and we will start blowing teams like this off the park. The leagues wide open this year beyond the top two positions, we can't afford to waste any more time waiting for him to pull his head out the sand.

Even with this dreadful paucity of chances created, we've still been up 'in the stats' v villa, sheff u, Bournemouth and Burnley.

change it a bit, find someone who can work on possession and combinations with the impressive forward talent he has at his disposal, sort set pieces and fly up the league.

This is exactly why I find it hard to criticise DCL, Kean or even sigurdsson.

I feel like a lack of ability, confidence and bottle from our holding midfielders combined with an obsession with playing safe passes through the full backs mean we have no penetration through the middle and all of our central attackers suffer as a result.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on October 07, 2019, 05:04:20 AM
This is exactly why I find it hard to criticise DCL, Kean or even sigurdsson.

I feel like a lack of ability, confidence and bottle from our holding midfielders combined with an obsession with playing safe passes through the full backs mean we have no penetration through the middle and all of our central attackers suffer as a result.


My argument for a long time. You could have Brazilian Ronaldo up top for us but we wouldn't get him anywhere near the ball because our attacking play is very very dire.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on October 07, 2019, 01:52:32 PM
My argument for a long time. You could have Brazilian Ronaldo up top for us but we wouldn't get him anywhere near the ball because our attacking play is very very dire.
Completely disagree, Ronaldo made things happen, just like Aguero, Salah, Kane etc etc etc. They occupy the defenders and create space, ours don't. When we had Lukaku up top and were scoring a fair few and our midfield consisted of Osman, Mccarthy, Atsu, Naismith, Barkley and Mirallas. What we have now has much more creativity, we just don't have the outlet like we did.
You look at our midfield at times during games and there is a massive disconnect, they look frustrated as there is nothing up top. I agree they need to do more, but I just think they have little to no confidence in our strikers and I think it's got to the point that they'd rather go somewhere else with the ball than use that route as they know nothing will come from it.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on October 07, 2019, 03:15:43 PM
Completely disagree, Ronaldo made things happen, just like Aguero, Salah, Kane etc etc etc. They occupy the defenders and create space, ours don't. When we had Lukaku up top and were scoring a fair few and our midfield consisted of Osman, Mccarthy, Atsu, Naismith, Barkley and Mirallas. What we have now has much more creativity, we just don't have the outlet like we did.
You look at our midfield at times during games and there is a massive disconnect, they look frustrated as there is nothing up top. I agree they need to do more, but I just think they have little to no confidence in our strikers and I think it's got to the point that they'd rather go somewhere else with the ball than use that route as they know nothing will come from it.


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Well its a game of opinions. I have no idea how you can watch us and come out with that opinion, but there we are.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on October 07, 2019, 03:37:34 PM
Well its a game of opinions. I have no idea how you can watch us and come out with that opinion, but there we are.
I get your point, it's a chicken and egg thing imo, we're not creating things as we don't have anything to top, if we had more up top we'd have more options and it'd give the midfield more opportunities to be creative

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on October 07, 2019, 04:20:15 PM
Completely disagree, Ronaldo made things happen, just like Aguero, Salah, Kane etc etc etc. They occupy the defenders and create space, ours don't. When we had Lukaku up top and were scoring a fair few and our midfield consisted of Osman, Mccarthy, Atsu, Naismith, Barkley and Mirallas. What we have now has much more creativity, we just don't have the outlet like we did.
You look at our midfield at times during games and there is a massive disconnect, they look frustrated as there is nothing up top. I agree they need to do more, but I just think they have little to no confidence in our strikers and I think it's got to the point that they'd rather go somewhere else with the ball than use that route as they know nothing will come from it.


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I get where your coming from with this and kind of agree.....good forwards make things happen both for themselves and for others....
The midfield need a forward outlet ball...and we don't have that.....I don't think its a question of "confidence" in the forwards........it's more a question of they look for the pass and see our 1 centre forward marked by 2/3 central defenders...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on October 07, 2019, 05:33:31 PM
it's more a question of they look for the pass and see our 1 centre forward marked by 2/3 central defenders...

Then surely our number 10 coming short for it, drawing a defender out, and creating three potential passing triangles would be useful.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on October 07, 2019, 06:21:00 PM
The fact we are in effect playing with 10 men most of the time would hinder anyone.

How can you hope to get any attacking momentum with a No 10 who literally doesn't touch the football or occupy a defender for large parts of the game.

Imagine how DCL or Kean must feel playing against four defenders on their own. It's no wonder DCL drops back to do some grunt work, if he didn't he wouldn't see the ball for long periods.

If Silva can't see this then he doesn't deserve £3m a year in charge of a club like ours.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on October 07, 2019, 08:06:25 PM
If we actually played through the middle he might get on the ball a bit more instead of waiting for a cross on the edge of the box looking useless all the time
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on October 08, 2019, 10:56:33 AM
I think teams play like that against us by congesting the middle and left hand side allowing Coleman to bomb on the right and get crosses over. He is just bad at it so we hardly ever have any danger from that side.

We need a new RB.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Juanito on October 08, 2019, 08:33:40 PM
The fact we are in effect playing with 10 men most of the time would hinder anyone.

How can you hope to get any attacking momentum with a No 10 who literally doesn't touch the football or occupy a defender for large parts of the game.

Imagine how DCL or Kean must feel playing against four defenders on their own. It's no wonder DCL drops back to do some grunt work, if he didn't he wouldn't see the ball for long periods.

If Silva can't see this then he doesn't deserve £3m a year in charge of a club like ours.

I imagine a busy little number 10 like Maddison would make a big difference. Iím sure a different manager would try Bernard in there, too. Iwobi. Something!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on October 08, 2019, 09:00:53 PM
It's a bit of both, we need more quality on both ends really.

Would we improve with a striker that was more of a handful? Sure.
Would our strikers look better if we were creating more chances? Sure.

Personally, I think our main issue is we lack enough goals in the side. We can afford the nearly players, players like Bernard who are good on the ball but don't score much. Iwobi too you could include in that. So we're easier to nullify because the opposition can afford to let our players have the ball because we lack that threat. It also puts a huge burden on the striker. The chasm left by Lukaku is clearly still being felt.

Who is a regular, proven goal threat in our side? Sigurdsson. Richarlison. Digne to a degree..? That's it. It's often that simple for me. We've lost the ability to get goals from a broader selection of players. Our CBs don't score, our wing backs don't often, our central midfielders don't. So we're too easy to nullify.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on October 08, 2019, 09:24:11 PM
The midfield problem is such a chasm, that we can't properly assess CF until it is addressed.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on October 08, 2019, 09:28:12 PM
It's a bit of both, we need more quality on both ends really.

Would we improve with a striker that was more of a handful? Sure.
Would our strikers look better if we were creating more chances? Sure.

Personally, I think our main issue is we lack enough goals in the side. We can afford the nearly players, players like Bernard who are good on the ball but don't score much. Iwobi too you could include in that. So we're easier to nullify because the opposition can afford to let our players have the ball because we lack that threat. It also puts a huge burden on the striker. The chasm left by Lukaku is clearly still being felt.

Who is a regular, proven goal threat in our side? Sigurdsson. Richarlison. Digne to a degree..? That's it. It's often that simple for me. We've lost the ability to get goals from a broader selection of players. Our CBs don't score, our wing backs don't often, our central midfielders don't. So we're too easy to nullify.

I agree to an extent but we have more than 6 goals in 9 games worth of talent in the squad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Thomas on October 09, 2019, 09:01:44 AM
The more I read from @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) the more I swear it's @Thomas (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=347) in disguise.

Negative.
Admin can check IP addresses.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on October 10, 2019, 02:54:00 PM
Negative.
Admin can check IP addresses.

Yeah donít he ridiculous. Me and KNTs obviously arenít the same person 😉
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on October 12, 2019, 01:47:06 PM
What we have now has much more creativity

This is the precise point at which you lost me.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on December 05, 2019, 07:24:43 AM
The starting striker position remains a huge issue.

Richarlison is I think head and shoulders our best front man right now.

I just don't think we play that well when DCL starts games. Could've won a penalty tonight but never really looked confident he'd score from that position, he had a decent head start but his pace just isn't of that level to take him away from defenders.

Not all on him, as obviously Kean missed his big chance too. He seems to be rushing his shots a bit though. I guess he is at least getting them away.

Perhaps I'm forgetting a game, but I don't remember the last time we played well and he started up top. Do think he makes a much more effective sub though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on December 05, 2019, 11:44:18 AM
The starting striker position remains a huge issue.

Richarlison is I think head and shoulders our best front man right now.

I just don't think we play that well when DCL starts games. Could've won a penalty tonight but never really looked confident he'd score from that position, he had a decent head start but his pace just isn't of that level to take him away from defenders.

Not all on him, as obviously Kean missed his big chance too. He seems to be rushing his shots a bit though. I guess he is at least getting them away.

Perhaps I'm forgetting a game, but I don't remember the last time we played well and he started up top. Do think he makes a much more effective sub though.
Kean has had 2 starts at CF, at most. He had half an hour last night, which is a lot compared to the 8 minutes he is usually given.

He needs to play, you can see the quality he has and his potential. The strength when he first came on, the run for his chance, the shot against Leicester.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on December 08, 2019, 01:20:56 PM
Two goals yesterday is obviously great, but the real joy for me was watching him absolutely bully their defence.

Look at this:


Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Free Agent on December 08, 2019, 01:49:05 PM
Thatís from the Ashley Barnes school of subtlety that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: wepull on December 08, 2019, 01:51:36 PM
Two goals yesterday is obviously great, but the real joy for me was watching him absolutely bully their defence.

Look at this:


He's a real pain in the arse for defenders. He needs to work a bit on composure in front of the goal. Definitely think he has improved this season compared to the last one even though we have been quite shoddy as a team

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on December 08, 2019, 02:00:55 PM
Very similar yesterday to the Arsenal game last season.

Still feel thereís lots of room for improvement in hold up play when into feet/ chest rather than flick ons and running the channels as thatís what we lack vs dross and we need controlled platforms with the ball.

As often said though, that type of player usually develops that later in their career.

Was pleased to see him put away his first goal having missed the first chance where he seemed rushed. He doesnít look like heís got the instincts to rack up serious numbers but heís not without skill/ technique so with confidence up he should be able to get decent returns.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Fynci on December 08, 2019, 02:14:56 PM
Donít know how to fit it all together but DCL and Kean up top could be a real pain.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Nicco on December 08, 2019, 02:57:58 PM
Two goals yesterday is obviously great, but the real joy for me was watching him absolutely bully their defence.

Look at this:


Commented that during the game. So Big Dunc that. Put an unnecessary tackle in so that the defender doesn't know wheter its coming next time and get a little bit more insecure and prone to a mistake.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 08, 2019, 03:01:11 PM
Alan Shearer absolutley loved it. Waxed lyrical on MOTD about how DCL bullied the Chelsea defenders :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on December 08, 2019, 07:09:42 PM
Does seem better suited currently to playing with a partner.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Thomas on December 08, 2019, 11:08:26 PM
Does seem better suited currently to playing with a partner.

He is definitely an enigma.

But I agree he needs to play in a 442.

The whole team needs to play 442.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 08, 2019, 11:10:39 PM
He is definitely an enigma.

But I agree he needs to play in a 442.

The whole team needs to play 442.

How would you anticipate a 442 working out against teams who let us have possession for ~65% of the game?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: van der Meyde on December 08, 2019, 11:19:46 PM
I see he's knocking goals in at rate that's basically a goal every other match.

The lad can't finish though, eh.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 08, 2019, 11:24:20 PM
I see he's knocking goals in at rate that's basically a goal every other match.

The lad can't finish though, eh.

Depends on whether you count all comps or not; he's got 5 in 16 league matches. Even with all comps though, 4 of his 7 goals are in 2 matches, so I think we just need to see a bit more consistency and then I can easily see him being a once every 2-3 games or so threat.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 08, 2019, 11:29:05 PM
Depends on whether you count all comps or not; he's got 5 in 16 league matches. Even with all comps though, 4 of his 7 goals are in 2 matches, so I think we just need to see a bit more consistency and then I can easily see him being a once every 2-3 games or so threat.

Itís unlikely heíll ever be a 1 in 2 striker, mate, theyíre about as common as rockinghorse shit.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 08, 2019, 11:31:11 PM
Itís unlikely heíll ever be a 1 in 2 striker, mate, theyíre about as common as rockinghorse shit.

I'm just trying on being polite for a spell lolol

You know I view Kean as our future.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 08, 2019, 11:32:27 PM
I'm just trying on being polite for a spell lolol

You know I view Kean as our future.

Oh really, you shouldíve said.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 08, 2019, 11:34:08 PM
Oh really, you shouldíve said.

Probably should have. I was thinking short-term as in the rest of this year. Crazily enough, he & Richy are on pace for about ~27 goals between them in League play.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on December 08, 2019, 11:35:35 PM
How would you anticipate a 442 working out against teams who let us have possession for ~65% of the game?
It could suit us.

If teams concede possession to us for most of the game and we only have one striker, we aren't much of a threat. With two up top there'll be an extra man in the penalty box for the crosses etc.

And anyway, we can still play direct against "the lesser" teams. I dont see why that wouldn't be effective. Historically the lower PL teams have always had defensive centre halves who are brilliant in the air, but the PL has changed, most teams have changed to a more possession based continental style, even teams like Norwich and Bournemouth.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 08, 2019, 11:35:56 PM
Probably should have. I was thinking short-term as in the rest of this year. Crazily enough, he & Richy are on pace for about ~27 goals between them in League play.

;) I was messing with ya.

27 would be a more than tidy return.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 08, 2019, 11:39:33 PM
;) I was messing with ya.

27 would be a more than tidy return.

*shakes fist in your direction*

Why I oughtta....

Did it surprise you to hear that yesterday became the first time in Richy's career he scored in 3 straight games? Don't know why, but it did me.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 08, 2019, 11:44:16 PM
*shakes fist in your direction*

Why I oughtta....

Did it surprise you to hear that yesterday became the first time in Richy's career he scored in 3 straight games? Don't know why, but it did me.

 ;D

I guess that is a tad surprising, seeing as he played in Brazil. Heís played most of his career as a winger, though, plus heís still only 22, so, a baby, really.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on December 08, 2019, 11:45:52 PM
Big fan of his.

Improves his hold up play a bit and adds a few more goals and he'll be a strong option. Still young with time to improve - absolutely should not see Tosun on the pitch instead of him.

Might see him hit about 12 or so this year in the league and 15 total which would be a good return given we have been shite at creating good, clear chances.

Dont mind if it's him keeping Kean out of the team as at least we know he's got room to grow. Kean's ceiling must be higher than his though.

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Title: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 08, 2019, 11:45:58 PM
*shakes fist in your direction*

Why I oughtta....

Did it surprise you to hear that yesterday became the first time in Richy's career he scored in 3 straight games? Don't know why, but it did me.
Also he scored the first and last goal of Silva's reign.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 08, 2019, 11:47:51 PM
Also he scored the first and last goal of Silva's reign.


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That in and of itself is a nice footnote to know for future rounds of Everton trivia  lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on December 08, 2019, 11:58:07 PM
He's on for at least double figures that isn't bad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on December 09, 2019, 12:01:02 AM
He's on for at least double figures that isn't bad.

Double figures at most I reckon.

Triple might be asking too much.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 09, 2019, 12:16:30 AM
9th in the league for xg per 90, with 0.58. So a 1 in 2 striker per 90 minutes this year.

Here's how he ranks for some per 90 metrics against forwards in the league.

Apologies if this is teaching anyone to suck eggs but a percentile ranks works roughly like ; 0.8 means you're in the 80th percentile so you are better than 80% of other people at that thing.

He's not perfect, far from it. But he's also 22, and probably about 50th on our list of problems or priorities.

https://twitter.com/insightMrkt/status/1203328564738834432?s=19
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 09, 2019, 01:27:06 AM
Was great yesterday.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: van der Meyde on December 09, 2019, 02:02:31 AM
Depends on whether you count all comps or not; he's got 5 in 16 league matches. Even with all comps though, 4 of his 7 goals are in 2 matches, so I think we just need to see a bit more consistency and then I can easily see him being a once every 2-3 games or so threat.
Yes but he isnít actually playing every minute of those matches is he. If you include all matches, his record per minute on the pitch is even better.

Definitely with you that he (and the team) doesnít offer a threat consistently though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 09, 2019, 02:12:37 AM
Yes but he isnít actually playing every minute of those matches is he. If you include all matches, his record per minute on the pitch is even better.

Definitely with you that he (and the team) doesnít offer a threat consistently though.

Very good call, fair. I'm really not good at math, but it looks like he's bagged a goal every 1 3/4 games (per 90), so that's not at all bad. As brap has mentioned, he has a pretty high xG so if he could both shoot more, and convert better, he'd actually have quite a few more goals. Whether he can do either of those 2 things, we shall see!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 09, 2019, 02:31:21 AM
Weíve got three talented forwards who are 22, 22 and 19. All will get better, grow into men and be worth a combined tidy sum, you would think.

Now if we could just work out how to provide them with better, more regular chances I donít think the future is too bad at all.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: arteta4spain on December 09, 2019, 02:38:29 AM
We've got three talented forwards who are 22, 22 and 19. All will get better, grow into men and be worth a combined tidy sum, you would think.

Now if we could just work out how to provide them with better, more regular chances I don't think the future is too bad at all.
I think thatís the crux of our entire problem. I actually think our defence isnít too bad. With gana gone and Gomes out were severely lacking in that department. Need a playmaker to give dcl and Kean the chances. More chances then higher possibility weíll score.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 09, 2019, 03:06:21 AM
Now if we could just work out how to provide them with better, more regular chances I donít think the future is too bad at all.

Two more players like Iwobi, who want the ball, are good at finding space, can pass forward accurately, have great engines, big desire, and are strong on the ball.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 10, 2019, 06:07:12 AM
Was great yesterday.

what did someone hack your account ?

next thing you will be telling me is 442 is not dead
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 10, 2019, 11:49:45 AM
what did someone hack your account ?

next thing you will be telling me is 442 is not dead

Well youíve got the wrong person with the 4 4 2 stuff as Iíve never mentioned it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 10, 2019, 12:25:31 PM
Two more players like Iwobi, who want the ball, are good at finding space, can pass forward accurately, have great engines, big desire, and are strong on the ball.

Agree with this - love Iwobi - one thing though, if anyone can explain, is he slow? Or does he look slow but is deceptively quick? Because most games he looks slow for most of it but there are one or two sprints a game that make me think he's quick.

But if he's quick - why isn't he quick all game? I'm confused.

His rag doll running style does not help!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Trublue on December 10, 2019, 04:49:16 PM
I think he could form a decent partnership, with Richarlison. Richarlison could drop back to the 10 role or more to the wings at times when required.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 12, 2019, 08:30:41 PM
Interesting article

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11671/11884661/evertons-dominic-calvert-lewin-has-all-round-ability-to-be-key-figure
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 12, 2019, 09:10:18 PM
Interesting article

https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11671/11884661/evertons-dominic-calvert-lewin-has-all-round-ability-to-be-key-figure

I do think he's improved and have said as much, but here's why these articles are poorly written/presented:

"Those match-winning goals took his tally to five in his last 10 appearances, his best run of form at this level."


The 5 goals came in 3 games, and 2 were against Sheffield Wednesday in the 2nd Carabao Cup tie. Let's have a little perspective here (not you; the author).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on December 12, 2019, 09:38:46 PM
ďHe doesnít score enough goalsĒ

*starts scoring goals*

ďWell, he doesnít score the right types of goalsĒ

Give me a fucking break.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 12, 2019, 09:46:24 PM
ďHe doesnít score enough goalsĒ

*starts scoring goals*

ďWell, he doesnít score the right types of goalsĒ

Give me a fucking break.

In the event that's directed at me, it's not what I said. All I said is that 2 of the 5 were non-league against a Championship side, and that all 5 came in 3 of the 10 matches the author used as his timeframe. He needs consistency, not goals that are more "right" than the ones he has scored.

If it wasn't directed at me, never mind then. 🙂
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on December 12, 2019, 10:20:11 PM
In the event that's directed at me, it's not what I said. All I said is that 2 of the 5 were non-league against a Championship side, and that all 5 came in 3 of the 10 matches the author used as his timeframe. He needs consistency, not goals that are more "right" than the ones he has scored.

If it wasn't directed at me, never mind then. 🙂

Doesnt really matter. If the leagues top scorer also won the league, then 100% of goals will have come against inferior teams.

They all count.
In the league this season Richarlison has 6 in 16 starts & DCL has 5 in 9 starts (+5 sub).
In cups they're both 2 in 3 (with a DCL appearance being a sub)


We can't consider Richarlison as top class prospect and discount the lad (who is the same age as him) who is 1 goal behind him (having played less games/minutes).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 12, 2019, 10:23:17 PM
Doesnt really matter. If the leagues top scorer also won the league, then 100% of goals will have come against inferior teams.

They all count.
In the league this season Richarlison has 6 in 16 starts & DCL has 5 in 9 starts (+5 sub).
In cups they're both 2 in 3 (with a DCL appearance being a sub)


We can't consider Richarlison as top class prospect and discount the lad (who is the same age as him) who is 1 goal behind him (having played less games/minutes).

Completely fair. And I don't want to seem like I don't appreciate any goals, given that we can't really seem to score many of them to start with. I'd like more consistency all around tbf.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Deano Blue Boy on December 15, 2019, 10:24:07 PM
He played great today, and I have been one of his doubters. Hopefully he can really kick on
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: duncandisorderly on December 15, 2019, 10:37:45 PM
Yeah I've been a critic of him but he was brilliant today as he was last week.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 15, 2019, 11:27:46 PM
Yeah I've been a critic of him but he was brilliant today as he was last week.

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Same.

The introduction of Dunc as manager and his confidence in him has upped his game no end in the last 2.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 15, 2019, 11:29:10 PM
The introduction of a bit of support around him seems to have helped him no end. Who would have thought it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 15, 2019, 11:34:26 PM
Think the role he's being asked to do is a difficult but uncomplicated one and it suits him.

Still no closer to providing any more threat than usual.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Heath on December 16, 2019, 12:01:31 AM

Dominic Calvert-Lewin really put himself about today, gave the United defence a hard time and made sure they knew that they were not going to have it all their own way. Tracked back, made clearances from our goal area, and pretty much ended the game in midfield to accommodate the Prince. The lad worked his bollox off (as did the whole team).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on December 16, 2019, 12:03:00 AM
Think the role he's being asked to do is a difficult but uncomplicated one and it suits him.

Still no closer to providing any more threat than usual.
You mean aside from the two goals he scored last week?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on December 16, 2019, 12:13:31 AM
Think the role he's being asked to do is a difficult but uncomplicated one and it suits him.

Still no closer to providing any more threat than usual.
Yea but the other players are finding themselves either with the ball in better positions or with a bit more space/time as a result.

Getting players closer to him so he can play it off to them more quickly is much better. He still struggles to hold it up to let the defense get out but if someone is near him he is very good at flicking it or controlling it down for them to get on the ball and give us that extra few seconds to get up the pitch.

Hope to see him get a few more chances and put a few more away but even just what he is doing now has done us a world of good.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 16, 2019, 12:20:33 AM
You mean aside from the two goals he scored last week?

You can spin stats however you like, that's the fun part of stats!

Those 2 goals gave him 3 in his past 10 league matches...so maybe?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on December 16, 2019, 12:21:12 AM
Yea but the other players are finding themselves either with the ball in better positions or with a bit more space/time as a result.

Getting players closer to him so he can play it off to them more quickly is much better. He still struggles to hold it up to let the defense get out but if someone is near him he is very good at flicking it or controlling it down for them to get on the ball and give us that extra few seconds to get up the pitch.

Hope to see him get a few more chances and put a few more away but even just what he is doing now has done us a world of good.

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Think going forward that itís more, that in these past two games thereís loads of space and it suits his mix of height/ space to run in to.

Itíll still be the games against 10 men behind the ball where bigger tests of development will come as theyíre the ones that test close control and sniffing out half chances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on December 16, 2019, 12:29:50 AM
Watching DCL and Richarlison up front together is a real eye opener to how nails DCL is compared to Rich.

DCL is becoming a proper bully and if we can coach some of that in to Richarlison too they'd be impossible to deal with
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on December 16, 2019, 12:30:21 AM
Think going forward that it's more, that in these past two games there's loads of space and it suits his mix of height/ space to run in to.

It'll still be the games against 10 men behind the ball where bigger tests of development will come as they're the ones that test close control and sniffing out half chances.
Agreed. Not sure he's got the guile to find those half spaces and touches required against a team sitting 10 men behind the ball.

We'll have to see. Big fan is his and would love him to move his game up a level.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on December 16, 2019, 12:41:14 AM
I don't think its a coincidence that DCL has been so good the last couple of games. This more direct style suits him. He can bully defenders in the air and use his pace to stretch the defence out. It won't be as easy against tighter defences, as space will be at a premium but it will be interesting to see if Ferguson or our next manager can find a way to take advantage of his strengths to cause problems for more defencive teams.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 16, 2019, 03:20:49 AM
You mean aside from the two goals he scored last week?

Yes aside from those goals, yes.

I think he's doing about the same stuff he was already doing over the last 18 months. The stuff I love about him seems to be getting more hype now which is nice but he still has lots to work on doesn't he.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee_4_Life on December 16, 2019, 09:49:46 AM
Yes aside from those goals, yes.

I think he's doing about the same stuff he was already doing over the last 18 months. The stuff I love about him seems to be getting more hype now which is nice but he still has lots to work on doesn't he.

He's been doing the same things as the past 18 months, the difference is the system a s playing 2 up top. Makes what he does much more effective both for himself and the others he brings into the game.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on December 16, 2019, 01:06:15 PM
He's been doing the same things as the past 18 months, the difference is the system a s playing 2 up top. Makes what he does much more effective both for himself and the others he brings into the game.


He was getting the same sort of praise after the Arsenal home game last season for example though, another game where there was lots of space and not particularly aggressive cbs.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on December 16, 2019, 04:07:42 PM
The thing that stuck out for me yesterday was when he got the ball to feet about 25 yards out, two touches to shift it left and make space and then get a shot away and on target.

He scuffed the shot, so it wasnt a big thing in the context of the game but itís the type of thing heís never really done so itís hoping progress in his development.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 26, 2019, 11:00:14 PM
Calvert-Lewin Szn
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on December 26, 2019, 11:08:19 PM
Hell of a header that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 26, 2019, 11:08:27 PM
Calvert-Lewin Szn

Maybe just maybe DCLs emergence and Kean's potential and presumed growth under Don Carlo means we can spend lavishly elsewhere.
Title: DCL
Post by: mikey_blue on December 26, 2019, 11:11:35 PM
Having a good season isn't he. I'm buzzing, really rooting for him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on December 26, 2019, 11:12:09 PM
Well done DCL. Great header! Playing well and scoring. Long may it continue.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on December 26, 2019, 11:13:24 PM
Helluva header mate. Absolutely superb.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on December 26, 2019, 11:14:57 PM
Boss!!

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EMunOLhXYAIpst8?format=png&name=900x900)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 26, 2019, 11:15:47 PM
well KN10,s anything to say

what was it you said he will not get 10 goals this year
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on December 26, 2019, 11:21:49 PM
Massive improvement this lad this season.

Long may it continue.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on December 26, 2019, 11:25:09 PM
Massive improvement this lad this season.

Long may it continue.

It's actually not that massive, his continual development has been plain to see for quite some time.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 26, 2019, 11:30:11 PM
Missed with a couple of far easier headers earlier and scores with the hard one.

Glad he's proved me wrong in the end though :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on December 26, 2019, 11:35:03 PM
Looking like an Everton number 9, great to see.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Brownie on December 26, 2019, 11:40:48 PM
It's actually not that massive, his continual development has been plain to see for quite some time.

Not to the Ďblack and white, no grey areasí brigade
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 27, 2019, 12:41:58 AM
Btw DCL has by far the best goals/90' on the team, with 1 every 175'. Richy by comparison is 1 every 275'.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 27, 2019, 12:50:11 AM
Btw DCL has by far the best goals/90' on the team, with 1 every 175'. Richy by comparison is 1 every 275'.

Prem only or all?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 27, 2019, 12:59:17 AM
Prem only or all?

Yes, sorry, EPL only.

But taking all comps into consideration, DCL has a goal every 165' and Richy has one every 246'.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bally on December 27, 2019, 01:02:37 AM
It's actually not that massive, his continual development has been plain to see for quite some time.
Not from those who didn't want to see it

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 27, 2019, 01:03:52 AM
well KN10,s anything to say

what was it you said he will not get 10 goals this year

Did I. Iíve no clue if I did or not. Has he got 10? You show me I said that and I guess Iíll apologise to you if it would make you feel better
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on December 27, 2019, 01:04:09 AM
Not to the Ďblack and white, no grey areasí brigade

Interesting word brigade. Inoffensive word that in recent times is mainly used as an insult.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Brownie on December 27, 2019, 01:07:19 AM
Interesting word brigade. Inoffensive word that in recent times is mainly used as an insult.

Say what now?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mayor Farnum on December 27, 2019, 01:12:17 AM
Say what now?

Brigade. Always used in a negative context.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 27, 2019, 01:13:43 AM
What?The word brigade is offensive now? This PC brigade has a lot to answer for.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Brownie on December 27, 2019, 01:14:02 AM
Brigade. Always used in a negative context.

Oh well. Never mind
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 27, 2019, 01:14:24 AM
Brigade. Always used in a negative context.

Youth Brigade is an awesome SoCal hardcore punk band.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 27, 2019, 01:14:37 AM
Yes, sorry, EPL only.

But taking all comps into consideration, DCL has a goal every 165' and Richy has one every 246'.

That's even better then if it's only EPL.

He's on 7 for the season now I think. Even Salah only has two more.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 27, 2019, 01:18:26 AM
That's even better then if it's only EPL.

He's on 7 for the season now I think. Even Salah only has two more.

6 league (same as Richy). In fact they both have 6 league, 2 Cup. But given the disparity in minutes it's a pretty excellent ratio. Assuming he continues to start every game, and why wouldn't he, he's on pace to lead the team with 16 goals. That would be amazing for him (and us). Richy's on pace for about 13. Kean still tracking to 0. 😭😂
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 27, 2019, 01:20:30 AM
6 league (same as Richy). In fact they both have 6 league, 2 Cup. But given the disparity in minutes it's a pretty excellent ratio. Assuming he continues to start every game, and why wouldn't he, he's on pace to lead the team with 16 goals. That would be amazing for him (and us). Richy's on pace for about 13. Kean still tracking to 0. 😭😂

Thought I saw DCl on 7 now for EPL. Just checked and it is just the 6. He's nearly hit Kean's target. :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: The Analog Kid on December 27, 2019, 01:26:03 AM
The lad is a beast, unfortunately he can't do it all on his own up there

I'm a huge fan of his
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 27, 2019, 01:28:31 AM
The minimum of what we expect is 6 league goals?




 ??? ??? ??? ??? ???
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 27, 2019, 01:32:26 AM
I donít think itís anything positive. Itís more anyone claiming heís good enough to lead the line for a decent premier league team (or more outlandishly heís worth a minimum of 40m and spurs and arsenal would sign him or best still the best young player in the world)

His potential is up for debate. Not sure his current record is. Itís just plain poor.

The outlandish claims donít come from me. They come from people who claim ďif you donít rate DCL you just donít understand footballĒ and other such nonsense

Anyone want to have a bet he doesnít score 12 in the league next season?

ok 12 not 10

remember now if you don't rate DCL you don't understand football
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 27, 2019, 01:42:33 AM



 ??? ??? ??? ??? ???

Did you not expect him to get 6 league goals. You seem to be saying I was right? 😉
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 27, 2019, 01:47:37 AM
ok 12 not 10

remember now if you don't rate DCL you don't understand football

I donít especially (rate him or probably understand football)
Heís been good recently but it still always feels like we are never gonna get him through on goal. He works hard, bullies defenders and wins flick ons on his good days but I think his movement will have to vastly improve for him to still be in the team as we hopefully improve.

Heís got 6 in almost half a season (in the league) so heís on track for 12 which would be a very decent haul for a young player. I just worry that heís very much part of the problem as to why we donít carve out good chances
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 27, 2019, 01:50:27 AM
ok 12 not 10

remember now if you don't rate DCL you don't understand football

Just read what you quoted. I assumed Iíd said there was no chance him getting 12 the way you were going on while I was just offering a bet which I donít think anyone took up. Odd that 4 months later with him just about outperforming the 12 in a season youíd return to it. 4 months ago you could have been on the way to becoming a very rich man (maximum bet £20)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 27, 2019, 01:55:34 AM
Just read what you quoted. I assumed Iíd said there was no chance him getting 12 the way you were going on while I was just offering a bet which I donít think anyone took up. Odd that 4 months later with him just about outperforming the 12 in a season youíd return to it. 4 months ago you could have been on the way to becoming a very rich man (maximum bet £20)

well you could say the way I have been on at you every week about it ,  that I took it up

but if you mean betting money with someone over the internet lol come on now how would that work
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 27, 2019, 01:56:34 AM
Did you not expect him to get 6 league goals. You seem to be saying I was right? 😉

ok sure
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Risky on December 27, 2019, 02:01:05 AM
What a difference having another player up top to support him makes.  Now he's got someone to link up with, rather than being expected to control and hold up hopeful balls without anyone to help him out.

Now he's getting chances, and hopefully learning to be more clinical.  Today's goal was brilliant, can't beat a diving header.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Simon Paul on December 27, 2019, 02:10:05 AM
was there any need for how long that ball took to cross the line?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lazarou on December 27, 2019, 02:20:48 AM
Is it just me or do you not see a lot of diving headers these days?

That was right up there with the best.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Risky on December 27, 2019, 02:29:42 AM
Is it just me or do you not see a lot of diving headers these days?

That was right up there with the best.

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Remember Cottee scoring a belting diving header against Forest in a 4-0 win around 1990.  Think it was an ITV televised game.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 27, 2019, 02:30:23 AM
I donít especially (rate him or probably understand football)
Heís been good recently but it still always feels like we are never gonna get him through on goal. He works hard, bullies defenders and wins flick ons on his good days but I think his movement will have to vastly improve for him to still be in the team as we hopefully improve.

Heís got 6 in almost half a season (in the league) so heís on track for 12 which would be a very decent haul for a young player. I just worry that heís very much part of the problem as to why we donít carve out good chances

Not true, really. He's got 1 goal every 2 games, so if he maintains that pace and continues to start, he's on pace for 16. Take that!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee1 on December 27, 2019, 02:31:23 AM
Remember Cottee scoring a belting diving header against Forest in a 4-0 win around 1990.  Think it was an ITV televised game.

This one from Andy Gray is a good one.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 27, 2019, 02:51:03 AM
Remember Cottee scoring a belting diving header against Forest in a 4-0 win around 1990.  Think it was an ITV televised game.

I remember that night well, Whiteside scored 2 as well. My dad loved Cloughís Forest, so I rubbed it in a tad.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 27, 2019, 02:56:33 AM
Remember Cottee scoring a belting diving header against Forest in a 4-0 win around 1990.  Think it was an ITV televised game.

But this Heath one lives longer in my memory

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on December 27, 2019, 03:00:30 AM
Keith Houchen :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: WeimaranerBlues on December 27, 2019, 03:07:21 AM
I remember that night well, Whiteside scored 2 as well. My dad loved Cloughís Forest, so I rubbed it in a tad.


should have scored 10 that day
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 27, 2019, 03:20:00 AM
Keith Houchen :)

That was the archetypal diving header. Such a great result, as well, totally against the mediaís wishes.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on December 27, 2019, 03:59:33 AM
Benefitting from the 442. Him and Richarlison are forging a decent partnership.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cods on December 27, 2019, 04:29:42 AM
Is it just me or do you not see a lot of diving headers these days?

That was right up there with the best.

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For me todayís goal was a flashback to the time his mentor and our assistant manager was leading the line.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueForYou on December 27, 2019, 04:44:22 AM
Peter Osgood v Leeds

Mick Lyons v Leeds

Sandy Brown v Liverpool!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 27, 2019, 07:06:47 AM
Very good header today fair play to him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on December 27, 2019, 07:46:00 AM
Be arsed with @brap2 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=666) being right
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on December 28, 2019, 10:21:31 PM
@brap2 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=666) mate 😏
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on December 28, 2019, 10:40:18 PM
Enjoyable reading this back :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 28, 2019, 10:41:31 PM
Cant score. Everything else sound
Added goals... He could be anything from here now
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 28, 2019, 10:55:41 PM
well KN10,s its that time again , not just one goal today but two of them I will be back later with his goals per 90  8)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 28, 2019, 10:58:52 PM
Hindsight is 20/20 of course but if you have an athlete like that who has clear upsides to his game, you don't give up on him because he hasn't added the most difficult thing in the game by the time he's 22.

Has undoubtedly come on leaps and bounds, which he had to do to wear that 9, and there's still more to come I'm sure, but I think we should be delighted with the player we've got on our hands here.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 28, 2019, 10:59:13 PM
Brilliant today and now scoring the type of goals he was not in a position to score previously. Well in lad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Trublue on December 28, 2019, 11:00:36 PM
This lad is starting to be the player we want him to be. Goals to add to his work rate and what seems to be a good understanding with Richarlison. Very happy with what I'm seeing from this lad at the moment.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on December 28, 2019, 11:01:47 PM
Just loving his continued upward trajectory.

Long may it continue.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 28, 2019, 11:03:20 PM
Hindsight is 20/20 of course but if you have an athlete like that who has clear upsides to his game, you don't give up on him because he hasn't added the most difficult thing in the game by the time he's 22.

Has undoubtedly come on leaps and bounds, which he had to do to wear that 9, and there's still more to come I'm sure, but I think we should be delighted with the player we've got on our hands here.

and that's the best thing there is still a lot more to come form him

best match up for me would be the Wolves SF and he is 28 and at his peak , DCL is at his LVL at 22

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on December 28, 2019, 11:03:22 PM
He's the real deal, he's a starter now and he's earned it. He's the first player in a long time to take the number 9 and make it mean something
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Duncs_a_legend on December 28, 2019, 11:03:54 PM
Dominic Calvert-Lewindowski
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on December 28, 2019, 11:04:22 PM
I know i mentioned it in the other thread... (did i?)

But he makes me well up when i see him score and grab the badge, he fucking loves the club doesnt he.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: The Analog Kid on December 28, 2019, 11:06:07 PM
Remember Cottee scoring a belting diving header against Forest in a 4-0 win around 1990.  Think it was an ITV televised game.

It was, it was midweek and the first win against them in yonks!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on December 28, 2019, 11:09:26 PM
<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="no" dir="ltr">UTFT pic.twitter.com/jXDBWmDkIS (https://t.co/jXDBWmDkIS)</p>&mdash; ŞΔM🐦🎄 (@SamG_9) December 28, 2019 (https://twitter.com/SamG_9/status/1210969867580563457?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 28, 2019, 11:12:07 PM
well KN10,s its that time again , not just one goal today but two of them I will be back later with his goals per 90  8)

That time again? Youíve only been doing this 2 days.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 28, 2019, 11:12:22 PM
goal every ‬1.573 games
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 28, 2019, 11:13:17 PM
goal every ‬1.573 games

yeah ok sure
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on December 28, 2019, 11:15:54 PM
That time again? Youíve only been doing this 2 days.

I think everyone needs to reasonably concede now though he is good enough to be starting games for Everton
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on December 28, 2019, 11:17:01 PM
Change in system has massively helped and has given him the opportunity to be in the positions he needs to be to score goals. He does seem more of a poacher than a banging it in from all angles/distances kinda striker and playing with Richarlison/Kean has given him that chance to shine.

Very pleased to see him getting on the scoresheet more often.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on December 28, 2019, 11:19:14 PM
You can see why Carlo's in no rush to get a new striker in. If we can start getting Kean scoring then that's some impressive, young firepower we could have with DCL, Keane and Richarlison.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 28, 2019, 11:21:57 PM
I think everyone needs to reasonably concede now though he is good enough to be starting games for Everton

Never 😉

Heís doing really well recently. Scoring goals and working hard. Obviously a decent premier league player already. Very pleasantly surprised. Still plenty of work to do though. Think he needs to improve his movement and his heading in the box
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Heisenberg on December 28, 2019, 11:23:10 PM
Donít really like doing ĎI told you soí. But really glad heís shutting a lot of the miseryís up. His hard grafting is finally paying off when used in a functioning system
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 28, 2019, 11:28:54 PM
You can see why Carlo's in no rush to get a new striker in. If we can start getting Kean scoring then that's some impressive, young firepower we could have with DCL, Keane and Richarlison.

If all of them carry on progressing youíve just future-proofed your attack for the best part of the next decade.

Or at the very least financially safeguarded your rebuilding if they get tempted elsewhere.

Promising times.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 28, 2019, 11:31:39 PM
It's a new era.

DCL for £1.5 from Sheffield Utd is the new Seamus Coleman for £60k from Sligo Rovers.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on December 28, 2019, 11:32:30 PM
It's a new era.

DCL for £1.5 from Sheffield Utd is the new Seamus Coleman for £60k from Sligo Rovers.



I thought it was about £6m?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on December 28, 2019, 11:32:35 PM
Inject this into my VIENS

Flag blue in the field I'm scoring goals, coming like Calvert-Lewin


<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="und" dir="ltr">💥 pic.twitter.com/spuIa6kgnr (https://t.co/spuIa6kgnr)</p>&mdash; Gamble (@Gamble1878) December 28, 2019 (https://twitter.com/Gamble1878/status/1210975023877492737?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw) <script async src="https://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" charset="utf-8"></script>


Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee_4_Life on December 28, 2019, 11:33:08 PM
Ancelotti has just said he thinks he's going to be "the best in England and Europe "

😲😲
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on December 28, 2019, 11:33:26 PM
I thought it was about £6m?

£1.62m
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 28, 2019, 11:35:53 PM
Have to given Unsworth some credit. He spotted the potential at Shedf Utd and brought him back with him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 28, 2019, 11:42:13 PM
well KN10,s its that time again , not just one goal today but two of them I will be back later with his goals per 90  8)

He's at 1 goal every 142' now (league). That has to be top 5 in the league (don't know how to check that).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 28, 2019, 11:43:11 PM
Dominic Calvert-Lewindowski

As a huge GOALandowski fan, this was brilliant lol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Omar on December 28, 2019, 11:49:26 PM
I think 2 up top is massively helping his game as well.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 28, 2019, 11:51:04 PM
I think 2 up top is massively helping his game as well.

Imagine that. Not asking under-23 y.o. forwards to play up top solo in the EPL lol.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: 74Blue on December 28, 2019, 11:53:52 PM
£1.62m
That sounds about right.
If I'm not mistaken it was just over £1.5m for DCL, whilst Holgate was just over £1m from Barnsley.
That is fantastic business for under £3m
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 28, 2019, 11:55:14 PM
That sounds about right.
If I'm not mistaken it was just over £1.5m for DCL, whilst Holgate was just over £1m from Barnsley.
That is fantastic business for under £3m

It's fantastic business but has taken a few years to pay off. They have both developed into first teamers now.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: 74Blue on December 29, 2019, 12:01:04 AM
It's fantastic business but has taken a few years to pay off. They have both developed into first teamers now.
True, it has taken a couple of years of development, but at what price would you sell either of them now? It would be a damn sight more than the three million  quid that we laid out on the pair of them.
Both are developing into proper quality players and, as an extra little bonus, are both English, so would command an even more outrageous fee if we did ever decide to cash in.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on December 29, 2019, 12:01:27 AM
I think 2 up top is massively helping his game as well.

It's not just him, we're generally looking better for it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 29, 2019, 12:09:05 AM
True, it has taken a couple of years of development, but at what price would you sell either of them now? It would be a damn sight more than the three million  quid that we laid out on the pair of them.
Both are developing into proper quality players and, as an extra little bonus, are both English, so would command an even more outrageous fee if we did ever decide to cash in.

Holgate was apparently linked in a 14 million move by the rags recently.

If we paid 27 for Kean, DCL may well be close to 40 now, but probably mid 20s realistically. Holgate perhaps close to 20. They've just come into their first form of their lives, so lets see if they keep it up.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on December 29, 2019, 12:14:57 AM
He's at 1 goal every 142' now (league). That has to be top 5 in the league (don't know how to check that).

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/top-scorers
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 29, 2019, 12:54:32 AM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/top-scorers

Sorry, I meant goals per minute. Almost all those other guys have played a LOT more minutes than DCL.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on December 29, 2019, 12:56:01 AM
Sorry, I meant goals per minute. Almost all those other guys have played a LOT more minutes than DCL.

Look harder. The goals per minute info is on there.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 29, 2019, 01:09:22 AM
Look harder. The goals per minute info is on there.

ohhhh, didn't see it tucked underneath there

Not bad company to keep, eh?

Aguero
Vardy
Ings
Abraham
Salah

the only 5 ahead of him (though Aubameyang is tied, and Sterling/Rashford are right behind them)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on December 29, 2019, 02:17:38 AM
Looks like we might have our #9, lads (and Audrey), Exciting times!


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 29, 2019, 02:26:38 AM
Watch his movement for the second goal, that is top top quality.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: eyesalwaysblue on December 29, 2019, 02:39:32 AM
He's had a tough time of it with recent managers being shite, and at a tender age is reaping some reward, fair fucks to him, didn't think it would end well for him but glad he's having some fun at last..
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Risky on December 29, 2019, 02:46:49 AM
Watch his movement for the second goal, that is top top quality.

Yeah it was brilliant watching that back.  Intelligent movement to find the space and give Richarlison the opportunity to find him.  Probably 3 distinct runs / movements too, which is great to see.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on December 29, 2019, 02:49:14 AM
It's fantastic business but has taken a few years to pay off. They have both developed into first teamers now.

Err yeah but thatís what you expect when you buy teenagers .
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on December 29, 2019, 02:57:18 AM
Fair play to DCL hope he keeps the run going as he's a real handful at the moment and adding goals, which have previously been lacking

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 29, 2019, 02:59:36 AM
Err yeah but thatís what you expect when you buy teenagers .

Go post that in the Kean thread.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on December 29, 2019, 03:13:12 AM
Go post that in the Kean thread.
Go do it yourself, not sure what you mean ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 29, 2019, 03:20:51 AM
Err yeah but that's what you expect when you buy teenagers .
Of course but not every teenager makes it. AST majority donít. Still sizeable investments.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on December 29, 2019, 03:57:45 AM
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/11896898/everton-boss-carlo-ancelotti-tips-dominic-calvert-lewin-to-rank-among-europes-best-strikers
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 29, 2019, 03:59:15 AM
Go do it yourself, not sure what you mean ?

I was being cheeky, nothing directed at you personally, just that there's more than a handful of folks wondering why he hasn't scored 17 goals already. :thumbsup:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Omar on December 29, 2019, 04:02:26 AM
I was being cheeky, nothing directed at you personally, just that there's more than a handful of folks wondering why he hasn't scored 17 goals already. :thumbsup:

Because he's shit!









 :snigger:






Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on December 29, 2019, 04:26:51 AM
Of course but not every teenager makes it. AST majority donít. Still sizeable investments.


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ďStill sizeable investmentsĒ you say, £3.5 million for the two of them less than four years ago was pretty good business Iíd say, considering theyíre only 22 and England internationals they probably have a combined worth of over £40 million plus, not bad business if you can get it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 29, 2019, 04:35:25 AM
"Still sizeable investmentsĒ you say, £3.5 million for the two of them less than three years ago was pretty good business I'd say !
Over three years ago. 2015 for Holgate and 2016 for DCL.

Of course not the same scale investment we made on Sandro and Kean. The fact that playing DCL as our main striker the past few years was a significant investment as had we had a proven striker in that time we may well have finished higher and thus not had to sack and pay off so many managers.

Our investment in DCL is significant. But it looks like itís coming together now fingers crossed.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on December 29, 2019, 06:17:38 AM
Shutting my stupid mouth up on a minute by minute basis almost. Brilliant form and well in DCL. Seems to have filled out and seems to be chasing less but becoming more useful.

I am converted...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 29, 2019, 06:27:08 AM
The big investment with youth is time and points. Think it was wenger who said you pay for youth players in points? He's absolutely right.

Play them, let them prove in the oven, and if you've recruited well and coached them well then you can leave a side in better shape than you find it, if you play only for results you can move league positions but the side itself ends up exactly as it was and needing to spend again. That needs a long term vision though rather than short term results driven strategy and we've not had a long term plan for a long time.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bally on December 29, 2019, 06:32:03 AM
Best Number 9 since Louis Saha?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bally on December 29, 2019, 06:34:45 AM
Said to everyone who slated him, if he's the same when we play to his strengths then fair enough.
Love the lad me always have and have always supported him, Everton Da's can go suck a fart out of my arse, even though I'm fucking older than most of them.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bally on December 29, 2019, 06:36:54 AM
Never

He's doing really well recently. Scoring goals and working hard. Obviously a decent premier league player already. Very pleasantly surprised. Still plenty of work to do though. Think he needs to improve his movement and his heading in the box
Think once he starts gambling a bit more that will come, his movement for the 2nd goal was perfect today, he does that a lot, just never had the ball put into that area or to fast or slow into that area, his heading ability and close control is brilliant.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on December 29, 2019, 07:06:16 AM
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11095/11896898/everton-boss-carlo-ancelotti-tips-dominic-calvert-lewin-to-rank-among-europes-best-strikers

I know this is childish, but I just want to make sure @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) sees this :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 29, 2019, 07:22:43 AM
I know this is childish, but I just want to make sure @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) sees this :)

If that's childish, 50% of my posts are downright embryonic.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 29, 2019, 11:25:50 AM
Best Number 9 since Louis Saha?

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Lukaku should have been a 9 but I guess he is. Canít think of many others.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee_4_Life on December 29, 2019, 12:00:04 PM
Lukaku should have been a 9 but I guess he is. Canít think of many others.


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Ramirez was.... And Landon Donovan was aswell wasn't he?!

EDIT - just checked it's these two and bloody Kone since Saha.  :Sick:
Jesus Christ. Thank you Dom to bringing some semblance of pride back to the fabled Everton number 9 shirt!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on December 29, 2019, 02:55:58 PM
Who'd have thought playing a system where your strikers score goals instead of those immediately behind him would have resulted in your striker scoring more goals?

Madness
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 29, 2019, 03:34:24 PM
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/top-scorers

Very good numbers for all sorts of reasons - including the sort of team he's played in for most of the season.

One area I expect him to be working on is assists. With his hold-up play, ball-winning ability, aerial prowess and pasing all being good - I think he should be able to get some assists here and there.

I think what's held him back on this so far is that he has been asked to be the team link-up when we move forward. So those times he gets the ball, he's generally 20 yards outside their box, all by himself and with his back to goal. So the next time he's involved is when he's getting on the end of it - hence the goals.

But with system changes (2 up front) and more support - I'd maybe expect to see some assists from him - he's clearly capable when not playing all on his own.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 29, 2019, 03:43:27 PM
The big investment with youth is time and points. Think it was wenger who said you pay for youth players in points? He's absolutely right.

Play them, let them prove in the oven, and if you've recruited well and coached them well then you can leave a side in better shape than you find it, if you play only for results you can move league positions but the side itself ends up exactly as it was and needing to spend again. That needs a long term vision though rather than short term results driven strategy and we've not had a long term plan for a long time.



Yeah I was gonna make a point along these lines - but not nearly so eloquently or concisely. It just shows the difference between teams like us and top, top teams who mostly field finished articles. They won't tend to have much youth in the side unless they are exceptional - and even then - they tend to be in a position where they can't do much damage like wingers, or a forward player when the game is already in the bag.

It's the likes of us with Jonjoe Kenny, Mason Holgate, Tom Davies and DCL all in the first team at the same time who pay for it with points and league position. Then when one of them becomes the finished article - that's when the top teams show up with a wad of cash and say "Gimme the boy."
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on December 29, 2019, 03:50:41 PM
think we need to make DCL the penalty taker and really piss all over KN10 posts about him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 29, 2019, 03:56:09 PM
think we need to make DCL the penalty taker and really piss all over KN10 posts about him

Taken some good ones for England U23's I think....?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on December 29, 2019, 03:57:21 PM
Great business by the club


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 29, 2019, 04:03:10 PM
Great business by the club


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Three Lions
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on December 29, 2019, 04:06:47 PM
I know this is childish, but I just want to make sure @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) sees this :)

I remember him bouncing round the forum taking the piss because I said heíd be worth £40m soon.

No mercy imo :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 29, 2019, 04:43:27 PM
I remember him bouncing round the forum taking the piss because I said heíd be worth £40m soon.

No mercy imo :)

Haha I remember you trying to claim you didnít really mean it so you get no credit for it now 😉
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on December 29, 2019, 04:45:31 PM
Haha I remember you trying to claim you didn’t really mean it so you get no credit for it now 😉

Anyway, nevermind that, what are you saying now? Open to a change of opinion?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on December 29, 2019, 07:21:06 PM
I suspect DCL will now start bagging assists when some of the defensive attention is forced to shift away from Richarlison.

All 3 of Richarlison, Kean, and Dom really seemed to intuitively "get" one another when together on the pitch yesterday.  There's something in that, methinks.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Everton Mint on December 29, 2019, 08:48:46 PM
Duncan Ferguson deserves some applause for how DCL has come on recently.

He's playing like a proper CF now and has the intelligence and guile to go with his physical attributes.

He is the Number 9 we've been looking for and the highest compliment I can give is he reminds me a lot of a certain Graeme Sharp.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 29, 2019, 08:51:30 PM
Duncan Ferguson deserves some applause for how DCL has come on recently.

He's playing like a proper CF now and has the intelligence and guile to go with his physical attributes.

He is the Number 9 we've been looking for and the highest compliment I can give is he reminds me a lot of a certain Graeme Sharp.

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Absolutely this....it was like gave him some proper big bollocks when choosing him as his main starting forward and putting his arm around him. Great work imo.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 29, 2019, 10:55:10 PM
Anyway, nevermind that, what are you saying now? Open to a change of opinion?

Yes somewhat. Heís obviously a top flight quality player. Looks like he will get a good return goals wise this season. Works hard. Bullies defenders.

Iím still not convinced heís going to be a top player though. An awful lot of what he does is about him winning a battle (which he is doing at the moment) heís got to improve him movement, heading in the box and his general finishing for me. Heís been a hell of a lot better than I expected him to be though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 29, 2019, 11:08:38 PM
Yes somewhat. He's obviously a top flight quality player. Looks like he will get a good return goals wise this season. Works hard. Bullies defenders.

I'm still not convinced he's going to be a top player though. An awful lot of what he does is about him winning a battle (which he is doing at the moment) he's got to improve him movement, heading in the box and his general finishing for me. He's been a hell of a lot better than I expected him to be though.
I think that will come sooner rather than later now he has support and a management team that will focus on his abilities rather than the aimless leadership we had with Silva.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: pjk on December 29, 2019, 11:32:45 PM
Always tried to stay on the fence with DCL. 50/50 if he was going to make top grade. He's already ahead of the average prem striker. Tosun being one. I've got to change from the 50/50 to something more like between 70 to 80%. That's a massive improvement in such a short time. If he can keep it going with consistency, the skies the limit. It looks to all intents and purposes, like he was being held back by previous management.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Outworlder47 on December 30, 2019, 02:38:40 AM
Holgate was apparently linked in a 14 million move by the rags recently.

If we paid 27 for Kean, DCL may well be close to 40 now, but probably mid 20s realistically. Holgate perhaps close to 20. They've just come into their first form of their lives, so lets see if they keep it up.

40 is probably close for DCL now. I still go back to Dominic Solanke, who was sold for 19M last year (and is 6mo younger than DCL), despite a sum-total of zero Prem goals in 25+ appearances and just the one somewhat decent loan season at VitChelsea. DCL is now at 27 from 115 for Everton in all comps, roughly 1 in 4 which given his recent form, age and serious injury to start off is pretty solid.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 30, 2019, 02:45:08 AM
Solanke went for 19??? Wow. When did dcl have a serious injury?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 30, 2019, 03:22:30 AM
On December 10, as per Transfermarkt

Solanke was valued at about £13m.
DCL was valued at about £19m.

Based on the same % increase, DCL's value would be right about £30m, though it's worth noting he's scored 3 goals since then. Not sure how week-by-week changes values since Transfermarkt only updates market value every 6 months.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 30, 2019, 03:37:33 AM
On December 10, as per Transfermarkt

Solanke was valued at about £13m.
DCL was valued at about £19m.

Based on the same % increase, DCL's value would be right about £30m, though it's worth noting he's scored 3 goals since then. Not sure how week-by-week changes values since Transfermarkt only updates market value every 6 months.
I wouldnít imagine values change much on a week by week basis. Form is temporary. Six months makes sense.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 30, 2019, 04:42:28 AM
40 is probably close for DCL now. I still go back to Dominic Solanke, who was sold for 19M last year (and is 6mo younger than DCL), despite a sum-total of zero Prem goals in 25+ appearances and just the one somewhat decent loan season at VitChelsea. DCL is now at 27 from 115 for Everton in all comps, roughly 1 in 4 which given his recent form, age and serious injury to start off is pretty solid.

Think youíre getting him mixed up with Barkley or someone else with regards injury; Heís only missed 12 games through injury in his whole Everton career.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 30, 2019, 04:50:29 AM
Can't compare him to solanke cos let's face facts, everyone over pays for Liverpool players
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: MmmblueBernard on December 30, 2019, 07:09:10 AM
Needs to be able to create his own goals as well as poaching to be considered truly too class.

Also I canít recall him scoring from outside the box.

Canít really complain tho.....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on December 30, 2019, 07:57:38 AM
Can't compare him to solanke cos let's face facts, everyone over pays for Liverpool players
Especially Bournemouth.

Love them a Liverpool player who is completely unproven and outlandishly overpriced.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cods on December 30, 2019, 08:10:54 AM
I know this is childish, but I just want to make sure @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) sees this :)

Not sure that the article reported fairly the tone of the interview. There was more in it that was not said rather than what was, as the questions were obviously around Calvert-Lewin, but were leading.
Ancelotti is not going to talk down Calvert Lewinís performance which would dent his confidence. But a top European striker, not yet by a long way.

I like his endeavour and efforts, and physical presence.
The good finish (not the scuffed one) was one of the only proper finishes I recall seeing him make for Everton. Iíve seen a couple of good finishes when heís been playing for England, so know he has it in him, but canít remember any for Everton.
His headers come off his shoulders, a few shots have been scuffed...not a clinical striker yet.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cods on December 30, 2019, 08:19:36 AM
40 is probably close for DCL now. I still go back to Dominic Solanke, who was sold for 19M last year (and is 6mo younger than DCL), despite a sum-total of zero Prem goals in 25+ appearances and just the one somewhat decent loan season at VitChelsea. DCL is now at 27 from 115 for Everton in all comps, roughly 1 in 4 which given his recent form, age and serious injury to start off is pretty solid.
Shots to goals ratio would be interesting to see.  I would think DCL has had a lot more opportunities than Solanke.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 30, 2019, 08:42:51 AM
Shots to goals ratio would be interesting to see.  I would think DCL has had a lot more opportunities than Solanke.

This is pretty easy. DCL has 42 shots, 10 goals (all comps). Solanke has 23 shots, 0 goals (all comps). Only thing I don't know is breakdown per 90 but it doesn't really matter.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cods on December 30, 2019, 08:55:08 AM
This is pretty easy. DCL has 42 shots, 10 goals (all comps). Solanke has 23 shots, 0 goals (all comps). Only thing I don't know is breakdown per 90 but it doesn't really matter.
conversion rate pretty good in comparison then.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 30, 2019, 01:19:33 PM
conversion rate pretty good in comparison then.

This season yes definitely, DCL has one of the highest conversion rates in europe.

Solanke has been taking shots from terrine positions, probably due to not playing much and snatching at half chances.

He's a player Solanke tbh and was rightly highly rated, but his development has definitely stalled while Dom is finally kicking on.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 30, 2019, 03:17:00 PM
Think itís fair to say heís in a decent run of form but then again most players go through a purple patch at some stage in their development.

The time to make an assessment is at the end of the season. I hope his form carries on into a permanent leap into the next stage of his career but only time will tell.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Paddockoldie on December 30, 2019, 03:56:06 PM
Playing two up front has definitely helped him out. It was a thankless task at times on his own but credit to him he kept on trying.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on December 31, 2019, 04:15:47 AM
United after him for £50 million apparently
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 31, 2019, 04:17:02 AM
United after him for £50 million apparently
That escalated quickly !
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 04:18:39 AM
That escalated quickly !

Right?

We should just hold out for his next goal and pocket a cool hundo million.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on December 31, 2019, 04:23:22 AM
*Smug face*

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee Tuesdays on December 31, 2019, 04:25:00 AM
"Ancelotti said he'd been tracking the Sheffield native for some time in Naples, per Phil Kirkbride of the Liverpool Echo: "He was a player we followed as a young striker, he was one of the players we followed but there was no possibility (to sign him). There are a lot of people who have eyes on him.""

Was this discussed? Couldn't find it.  Any truth in this you think or its like a new signing saying 'It was always my dream to play for _____'.  Crazy though most on here didn't even think he was prem quality a month ago, or at least not good enough for us, meanwhile supposedly top clubs have been keeping an eye on him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Trowel on December 31, 2019, 04:35:23 AM
Perhaps Carlo is just going through that newboy phase of saying he tried to sign everyone to make them like him.

"We followed him closely for years, but in the end there was no possibility to sign Cuco."
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 31, 2019, 04:36:59 AM
*Smug face*



You said 40 and to arsenal or spurs. Wrong and wrong
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 04:44:37 AM
You said 40 and to arsenal or spurs. Wrong and wrong

Technically, neither of you are right or wrong, because it's a completely bollocks rumor lol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Brownie on December 31, 2019, 06:39:49 AM
*Smug face*



Just read the story and my first thought was @TheRam (http://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=1602) is going to love this 😂😂
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 31, 2019, 07:27:28 AM
United after him for £50 million apparently
Sold.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on December 31, 2019, 12:23:26 PM
Technically, neither of you are right or wrong, because it's a completely bollocks rumor lol

Nah, itís probably got some truth I reckon.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary Todd on December 31, 2019, 01:51:13 PM
Utd can fuck right off and look elsewhere Dcl is going nowhere he's happy with us anyway......

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on December 31, 2019, 01:56:29 PM
The last thing he needs right now is to join someone's squad rotation and fight for a place from the bench when he is leading the line for a Premier League team every week.

He stays here for at least a couple of years and he's got the chance to really kick on.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 31, 2019, 02:00:09 PM
Itís the most obvious rumour you could make up, based on DCLís recent run of form.

File it in the bullshit category.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on December 31, 2019, 02:11:36 PM
Iíd say in terms of potential heís going to be as good as someone like Callum Wilson or Joshua King, which is nothing to sniff at as Wilson was linked with a £50m move to Chelsea when he was on good form.

Thereís still time to change it but the big concern for me is that he doesnít strike a football particularly well, so you canít really imagine him drilling one home from the edge of the box like all the top strikers can.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Paddockoldie on December 31, 2019, 02:51:42 PM
Utd can fuck right off and look elsewhere Dcl is going nowhere he's happy with us anyway......

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To the media we're a utd feeder club... They are yesterday's club for status for drawing top players.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on December 31, 2019, 02:55:12 PM
I could see their interest being real, they've just missed out on Haaland so are clearly in the market for a young striker... And DCL is hot property right now.

I just can't see us selling him, or wanting to leave, so even if they do want him it's a non starter.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 31, 2019, 02:56:31 PM
Iíd say in terms of potential heís going to be as good as someone like Callum Wilson or Joshua King, which is nothing to sniff at as Wilson was linked with a £50m move to Chelsea when he was on good form.

Thereís still time to change it but the big concern for me is that he doesnít strike a football particularly well, so you canít really imagine him drilling one home from the edge of the box like all the top strikers can.

I still need to see him do other things before Iím convinced heís going to be a top player. Like you say look threatening from range, look capable of getting played in behind a defence, to threat more in the air (he wins lots even in the box but not enough with any conviction towards the goal)

I am impressed with him this season but itís all battling and getting the scrappy goals. Think he does need to improve technically in terms of heading finishing and movement if heís going to be a top player. I still have my doubts but heís far better than I ever thought heíd be already
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on December 31, 2019, 04:20:37 PM
I still need to see him do other things before Iím convinced heís going to be a top player. Like you say look threatening from range, look capable of getting played in behind a defence, to threat more in the air (he wins lots even in the box but not enough with any conviction towards the goal)

I am impressed with him this season but itís all battling and getting the scrappy goals. Think he does need to improve technically in terms of heading finishing and movement if heís going to be a top player. I still have my doubts but heís far better than I ever thought heíd be already

His heading for goals is good. Youíre not going to get bullet headers all the time.

Iíd say what he needs to improve on most is providing a platform when heís not running. Standard ball into feet and hold the cb off is a big thing for a central striker.

Other is more standard through ball finishing, or shots on the turn with a defender really tight.

Obviously time for these.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on December 31, 2019, 04:39:02 PM
Iíd say in terms of potential heís going to be as good as someone like Callum Wilson or Joshua King, which is nothing to sniff at as Wilson was linked with a £50m move to Chelsea when he was on good form.

Thereís still time to change it but the big concern for me is that he doesnít strike a football particularly well, so you canít really imagine him drilling one home from the edge of the box like all the top strikers can.

Itís too early to say what he will or wonít be.

Harry Kane was jobbing around the lower leagues for years and Drogba was a late developer.

Just let him develop under a stable, experienced management setup and see where he gets to.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on December 31, 2019, 04:55:35 PM
Harry Kane was jobbing around the lower leagues for years and Drogba was a late developer.

Just let him develop under a stable, experienced management setup and see where he gets to.

This is why I really struggle with the view of people like @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) , who has blindly refused the kid development time when all the best strikers in the world (bar the very elite) were afforded plenty. You have to trust in young players, and the experts around them.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Robioto on December 31, 2019, 04:59:18 PM
United after him for £50 million apparently

Going to be a lot of this shite from the media trying to unsettle things while they are still rattled by the Ancelotti appointment.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 31, 2019, 05:33:08 PM
This is why I really struggle with the view of people like @KoemansNumberTens (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=3905) , who has blindly refused the kid development time when all the best strikers in the world (bar the very elite) were afforded plenty. You have to trust in young players, and the experts around them.

I donít refuse to give him time. Thereís a difference between that and not seeing his potential

Kane is a crazy example though. He wasnít the norm at all. Itís like pointing out Vardy as a reason to sign none league players or drogba for a late developer
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: The Analog Kid on December 31, 2019, 05:34:56 PM
To the media we're a utd feeder club... They are yesterday's club for status for drawing top players.

I'd say we've taken more from United than they have us over the years

They've had a go at signing some of ours over the years only to be told no, however much truth was in them (Baines, Jags being two to jump out)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 07:13:04 PM
Nah, itís probably got some truth I reckon.

Source: this thread. 😂
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on December 31, 2019, 07:19:52 PM
I donít refuse to give him time. Thereís a difference between that and not seeing his potential

Kane is a crazy example though. He wasnít the norm at all. Itís like pointing out Vardy as a reason to sign none league players or drogba for a late developer

It's how most players develop, over time, and with patience.
Title: DCL
Post by: Blue Lagoon on December 31, 2019, 07:22:08 PM
Clearly too early to say if he'll go on to be great but often the things that hold good players up from being great is having world class managers and world class players to play alongside. Hopefully we can start to give DCL that in the coming years .


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 31, 2019, 08:13:46 PM
New contract, £70-75k
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 31, 2019, 08:33:13 PM
New contract, £70-75k

Really?

Thatís a Steve Walsh style wage hike.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Django on December 31, 2019, 08:35:38 PM
United are after him and were sniffing in the summer.

From DCL's POV though, would United really be a step up now? He's first choice here under a world class manager and would have to move to working under OGS and no guarantee of being first choice. Would be a weird time to jump ship IMO.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on December 31, 2019, 08:39:52 PM
Think we'll tie him to a new contract within the next month.

Lots of development left and plenty of room to do it here in the current setup/squad.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on December 31, 2019, 08:41:28 PM
New contract, £70-75k
Whatís he on now ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on December 31, 2019, 08:42:24 PM
United are after him and were sniffing in the summer.

From DCL's POV though, would United really be a step up now? He's first choice here under a world class manager and would have to move to working under OGS and no guarantee of being first choice. Would be a weird time to jump ship IMO.

Hopefully he looks at Harry Maguire and sees that sometimes it's better to stay because Man United are absolutely no guarantee of success these days.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on December 31, 2019, 08:43:39 PM
It's how most players develop, over time, and with patience.
It's how most players develop, over time, and with patience.

Itís actually not. Most players donít develop regardless of time x
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 31, 2019, 08:43:44 PM
Very few have left Everton and been a success elsewhere. He should look at all the strikers that left us and apart from Rooney, the rest pretty much fell flat on their faces.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 08:44:00 PM
Whatís he on now ?
Really?

Thatís a Steve Walsh style wage hike.

I think that's ballpark 3x where he is, but it seems pretty fair given today's market rates, no? Otherwise there IS only a matter of time before a United throws stupid money at him to sit on their bench.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 08:46:32 PM
Very few have left Everton and been a success elsewhere. He should look at all the strikers that left us and apart from Rooney, the rest pretty much fell flat on their faces.

Lukaku is doing juuuust fine. But he may be the only other one.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on December 31, 2019, 08:49:11 PM
Lukaku is doing juuuust fine. But he may be the only other one.

Wasn't as big a success at Utd though, but his stats were still very good. He's one of the exceptions. We've never really been too successful with strikers in the premier league era though. Can count the number of quality strikers we've had at their peaks on one hand.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Polledreng on December 31, 2019, 08:50:29 PM
Lukaku is doing juuuust fine. But he may be the only other one.
was about to write that. Thanks for saving me from that 👍👍
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 31, 2019, 08:52:28 PM
Whatís he on now ?

£20k, so almost quadruple.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on December 31, 2019, 08:58:49 PM
£20k, so almost quadruple.

He and Holgate both got new contracts last year, if DCL getting one based on performance would imagine Holgates agent to be on the blower !
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 09:04:45 PM
He and Holgate both got new contracts last year, if DCL getting one based on performance would imagine Holgates agent to be on the blower !

DCL signed his last contract back in Dec 2017, for 6-years btw
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on December 31, 2019, 09:05:15 PM
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2019/12/31/dominic-calvert-lewin-rewarded-goalscoring-streak-70000-a-week/
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Polledreng on December 31, 2019, 09:19:32 PM
£20k, so almost quadruple.
wow but you could argue he is 4 times the player he was 2years ago
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 31, 2019, 09:23:20 PM
Seems bad to me that kids can earn £1m a year having done nothing but a prime minister with all the AG it brings, probs only gets like 150k. Something wrong there.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on December 31, 2019, 09:31:03 PM
Representative of his position as first team striker imo
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee_4_Life on December 31, 2019, 09:35:03 PM
Very few have left Everton and been a success elsewhere. He should look at all the strikers that left us and apart from Rooney, the rest pretty much fell flat on their faces.

A fact Moyes liked to point out before ironically going on to do exactly the same!

The grass is rarely greener Davey!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on December 31, 2019, 09:52:10 PM
£70k is good business by us, if true.

Apparently Abraham at Chelsea is refusing a new deal as he wants the same £180k p/w Hudson-Odoi is on.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on December 31, 2019, 09:53:46 PM
Seems bad to me that kids can earn £1m a year having done nothing but a prime minister with all the AG it brings, probs only gets like 150k. Something wrong there.

lol, first day on the planet?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Paddockoldie on December 31, 2019, 09:58:12 PM
Seems bad to me that kids can earn £1m a year having done nothing but a prime minister with all the AG it brings, probs only gets like 150k. Something wrong there.

No rent, no bills and when you leave you can claim grands for an hours after dinner speech... Then your memoirs.. If it wasn't a gravy train they wouldn't do it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Everton Mint on December 31, 2019, 10:07:38 PM
https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/1212033419166674945
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee Tuesdays on December 31, 2019, 10:17:28 PM
https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/1212033419166674945

Would be very strange.  He certainly wouldn't improve them and they already have young attacking talent like Rashford and Martial.  Would think if they go for a striker they'd want a more established player
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on December 31, 2019, 10:17:48 PM
https://twitter.com/BBCSport/status/1212033419166674945

Yeah, that's just the same link referred to earlier in the thread, with the source being the Sun newspaper.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: The Analog Kid on December 31, 2019, 10:33:39 PM
Seems bad to me that kids can earn £1m a year having done nothing but a prime minister with all the AG it brings, probs only gets like 150k. Something wrong there.
In the meantime one of them is doing his job whilst the other is making a hash of it. I know who I would rather give the money to
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on December 31, 2019, 10:39:05 PM
In the meantime one of them is doing his job whilst the other is making a hash of it. I know who I would rather give the money to

Yeah, and oneís a working class kid making the most of his talents while he can, and the other is a privileged, rich since birth member of the Bullingdon Club.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 31, 2019, 11:10:29 PM
In the meantime one of them is doing his job whilst the other is making a hash of it. I know who I would rather give the money to
It was more a general observation which in the real world seems mad.

Put it another way how can Cuco Martina earn more than the prime minister ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on December 31, 2019, 11:20:49 PM
It was more a general observation which in the real world seems mad.

Put it another way how can Cuco Martina earn more than the prime minister ?

Because football is the most popular sport in the world, the Premier League is the richest league in the world, and supply and demand. Don't worry about the racist bellend who is PM. He's got millions tucked away in the bank already.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 31, 2019, 11:33:02 PM
You must be the only person in the world who looks at our pm and thinks poor bastard, he should be on footballers wages also, I'd rather Martina pm..... And that depfefel left back for us tbh
It was more a general observation which in the real world seems mad.

Put it another way how can Cuco Martina earn more than the prime minister ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on December 31, 2019, 11:34:09 PM
Because football is the most popular sport in the world, the Premier League is the richest league in the world, and supply and demand. Don't worry about the racist bellend who is PM. He's got millions tucked away in the bank already.

Which bank?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on December 31, 2019, 11:43:00 PM
You must be the only person in the world who looks at our pm and thinks poor bastard, he should be on footballers wages also, I'd rather Martina pm..... And that depfefel left back for us tbh
Nah I couldnt care a less about Boris or whether he can afford his champers etc.
 
It's more about a worse than average footballer earning so much vs people who deserve it. Let's say a heart surgeon then.....saving peoples lifes and taking risks/pressure day in day out will earn in a year what Cuco earns in a month which makes no sense to me.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on December 31, 2019, 11:47:59 PM
Now that's sommet I can agree with
Nah I couldnt care a less about Boris or whether he can afford his champers etc.
 
It's more about a worse than average footballer earning so much vs people who deserve it. Let's say a heart surgeon then.....saving peoples lifes and taking risks/pressure day in day out will earn in a year what Cuco earns in a month which makes no sense to me.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on January 01, 2020, 03:19:01 AM
To close out 2019, one more note of praise for DCL. It's only fair as I've been pretty critical of him in the past.

Taking penalties out of the equation, the goal leaders this year are:

Vardy 14
Abameyang 12
Abraham 12
Ings 12
Sterling 11
Mane 10
Kane 9
Pukki 9
Rashford 8
DCL 8
Aguero 8

That puts him tied for 9th overall. Now that's not to say he'd get to take pens but Everton doesn't get them awarded to us anyway.

But still, his performance thus far is even more impressive when you look at it this way.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on January 01, 2020, 04:16:03 AM
His performance is EVEN more impressive, given that he's been playing in a garbage team with little to no creativity for most of that time.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on January 01, 2020, 04:39:02 AM
One thing that I donít understand about him though, whatís the deal with his shorts?

Does he order custom made tiny ones or something?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on January 01, 2020, 04:39:54 AM
One thing that I donít understand about him though, whatís the deal with his shorts?

Does he order custom made tiny ones or something?

He hikes them up when anticipating leaping to win a header
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on January 01, 2020, 04:57:25 AM
One thing that I donít understand about him though, whatís the deal with his shorts?

Does he order custom made tiny ones or something?
Hes trying to show off little DCL.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on January 01, 2020, 05:00:20 AM
Anyone remember the days when 90% of the DCL chat centred around his bird?

How times have changed.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Alanvideo on January 01, 2020, 05:35:51 AM
New deal for DCL
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2019/12/31/dominic-calvert-lewin-rewarded-goalscoring-streak-70000-a-week/
Title: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on January 01, 2020, 01:03:34 PM
...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 01, 2020, 02:31:24 PM
Media trying to sell our best players again. Cunts.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on January 01, 2020, 02:59:05 PM
Iíd be more disappointed if the media wasnít trying to sell off our best players.

The fact that the Ancelotti appointment has woke them up to our existence is all positive for our increased profile.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: 74Blue on January 01, 2020, 05:57:32 PM
£70k is good business by us, if true.

Apparently Abraham at Chelsea is refusing a new deal as he wants the same £180k p/w Hudson-Odoi is on.


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£180k a week? For a kid that's done fuck all of note as yet, that's fucking scandalous!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on January 01, 2020, 07:01:42 PM
£180k a week? For a kid that's done fuck all of note as yet, that's fucking scandalous!

He was gonna go for nowt though. I guess they figure 45m in wages is only what theyíd lose on a transfer fee
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: penguinofdoom1878 on January 06, 2020, 12:02:42 AM
don't suppose Utd still want to give us £50m for him, will deal at £25m
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on January 06, 2020, 12:03:47 AM
don't suppose Utd still want to give us £50m for him, will deal at £25m

Fucking hell. As if he was the issue today.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 06, 2020, 12:05:19 AM
don't suppose Utd still want to give us £50m for him, will deal at £25m
Bit harsh blaming DCL for that today when he didn't even play

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on January 06, 2020, 12:05:39 AM
He was poor though, can't deny that
Fucking hell. As if he was the issue today.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on January 06, 2020, 12:06:30 AM
He was poor though, can't deny that

They all were fucking shite. Bit pathetic coming on and saying sell him though dont you think?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on January 06, 2020, 12:07:14 AM
Yeah. Think its more the point that he isn't a 50m player
They all were fucking shite. Bit pathetic coming on and saying sell him though dont you think?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: NickNack on January 06, 2020, 12:08:42 AM
DCL (and maybe Richarlison although there was little effort from him today) could use tiredness as an excuse, DCL did at least keep trying. The rest were just plain awful.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on January 06, 2020, 12:08:53 AM
Yeah. Think its more the point that he isn't a 50m player

Ah so we are doing that thing where he scores a few and we all think he is a world beater, but go a game doing nothing ans he is worth fuck all?? Noted.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on January 06, 2020, 12:10:25 AM
Heís been good recently but his finishing is still shite. Heís no composure when he has great chances.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on January 06, 2020, 12:11:20 AM
I'm not saying its correct, just saying that that's the point I think he is trying to make
Ah so we are doing that thing where he scores a few and we all think he is a world beater, but go a game doing nothing ans he is worth fuck all?? Noted.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 06, 2020, 12:13:27 AM
I dont think it's fair to put any of this on DCL, we should be firmly looking at Ricky, Digne, Coleman actually the rest of them. DCL imo isn't that good regardless of his recent form, but he's one of the most inexperienced in our squad, the senior players, or those with more experience are a fucking disgrace and are the real issue

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on January 06, 2020, 12:14:42 AM
I mean, we can have a pop at individual players yeah, and I'll do that til the cows come home (Theo Walcott's never been a footballer, for example), but it's the whole club from top to bottom isn't it? We've had loads of sets of players who should've done summat against them for the last 10/20 years and they pretty much never have.

We turn out weak players. Mentally weak players. Not one of them had the bravery (yet again) to put their foot on the ball and pick a pass or drop a shoulder. They had 13 year olds doing it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on January 06, 2020, 12:31:09 AM
Can't see how DCL would get much blame, since everyone was dreadful. In addition to him, Richarlison, Holgate, Mina, and (to a degree) Kean all did very poorly at finishing.

I hope Ancelotti gives Duncan free reign to crack skulls this week during training.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 06, 2020, 12:51:31 AM
He's mostly a 6 yard box finisher. If we're asking him to do it from anywhere else, if we're not going to provide that service, we're going to be disappointed in the outcome more times than not.

The chance he had and scuffed from the edge of the box in space was the most disappointing finish of the game for me, a PL striker should be taking those really. Those sort of moments are the difference. That and the Richarlison chance.

He's been doing better in the positions he's been getting into lately, but I still think our side lacks a natural goal scorer. Or failing that, enough goals spread around the team. Midfield in particular, but even the CBs aren't really contributing as much as they could on corners and such.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on January 06, 2020, 01:12:08 AM
Been flogged to death the last few weeks.

Needs a day off.

Won't blame him for today when others are much more responsible.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on January 06, 2020, 01:23:51 AM
Been flogged to death the last few weeks.

Needs a day off.

Won't blame him for today when others are much more responsible.

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He had Thursday, Friday and Saturday off.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on January 06, 2020, 01:26:30 AM
Been shit the last two games but cant blame him solely.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: jongre123 on January 06, 2020, 01:42:16 AM
Feel like he was let down today by the complete lack of midfield in the second half. Won his fair share but there was no one following up on the knock downs / 2nd balls.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on January 06, 2020, 03:17:42 AM
Feel like he was let down today by the complete lack of midfield in the second half. Won his fair share but there was no one following up on the knock downs / 2nd balls.
Agreed.

We didnt even play the long ball well today, he wasnt supported when he had a chance of winning it and the rest of the time the ball was no where near him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 11, 2020, 11:16:13 PM
I'm not trying to drag this up as a way to knock the guy, he has a place in the squad no doubt, but have to say I was never really confident when he got 1 on 1 there 2nd half.

He seems to be cementing his place as more of a poacher, that seems to be his reliable finishing range, but I would love a striker on our books who you'd be confident would take those chances more often than not from the top of the box.

Lukaku scores that goal, and we're not all nervous the last 20 minutes. Not an easy get of course, but for all the talk of missing a CM and a CB...still think we need that striker who can provide something else...a bit of calmness in those moments.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: kramer0 on January 11, 2020, 11:26:31 PM
Richy and DCL have carried us for the past month plus.

Centre forward is literally the LAST position on the pitch we need to upgrade.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 11, 2020, 11:34:38 PM
Richy and DCL have carried us for the past month plus.

Centre forward is literally the LAST position on the pitch we need to upgrade.

Last game people wanted to throw the whole side out.

I don't think it's as clear cut as you paint it here.

Genuinely, did you think DCL would score that chance? If the answer is maybe or anything other than a straight up yes, I think there is room to improve our squad is all. Think back to Lukaku in the same position, 9 times out of 10 that's a goal.

Anyhow, it's just a random thought and I'm not trying to belabour the point, we won, I'm happy but I still think we're missing a player in our strike force.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on January 11, 2020, 11:44:45 PM
I'm not trying to drag this up as a way to knock the guy, he has a place in the squad no doubt, but have to say I was never really confident when he got 1 on 1 there 2nd half.

He seems to be cementing his place as more of a poacher, that seems to be his reliable finishing range, but I would love a striker on our books who you'd be confident would take those chances more often than not from the top of the box.

Lukaku scores that goal, and we're not all nervous the last 20 minutes. Not an easy get of course, but for all the talk of missing a CM and a CB...still think we need that striker who can provide something else...a bit of calmness in those moments.
I thought he should have scored when I first saw it but on the replay you could see that it was an awkward ball that didn't drop for him the way he wanted, meaning he had to find a way to control it at full flight. I don't think he ever got proper control of it. Possibly he took the shot too early but maybe he wasn't confident of his touch at that speed. I do think DCL has a glaring weakness when shooting from outside the area but it wasn't as easy a chance as it seemed.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: kramer0 on January 11, 2020, 11:45:13 PM
Last game people wanted to throw the whole side out.

I don't think it's as clear cut as you paint it here.

Genuinely, did you think DCL would score that chance? If the answer is maybe or anything other than a straight up yes, I think there is room to improve our squad is all. Think back to Lukaku in the same positions, 9 times out of 10 that's a goal.

Anyhow, it's just a random thought and I'm not trying to belabour the point, we won, I'm happy but I still think we're missing a player in our strike force.

Lukaku doesn't do the closing down that makes our 4-4-2 work.

The work Richarlison and DCL do grinding down opposing CBs every week is pretty much what makes us tick.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on January 11, 2020, 11:45:28 PM
Thought he was good again today. Some clever movement getting him some decent openings. As for the chance where he was through. He never really got it far enough out of his feet to run the ball nearer the keeper. It wasnít a bad finish and it wasnít quite a great chance

I do worry (not directed at DCL) that we donít appear capable of scoring a decent number of goals against anyone. Played well for most of the game today but we never convince that the goals are coming
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on January 11, 2020, 11:45:47 PM
I thought he should have scored when I first saw it but on the replay you could see that it was an awkward ball that didn't drop for him the way he wanted, meaning he had to find a way to control it at full flight. I don't think he ever got proper control of it. Possibly he took the shot too early but maybe he wasn't confident of his touch at that speed. I do think DCL has a glaring weakness when shooting from outside the area but it wasn't as easy a chance as it seemed.

Agreed. He also had to re-"straighten" himself after the shoulder/clutch by whichever defender that was.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on January 11, 2020, 11:46:33 PM
Last thing we need to worry about.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: kramer0 on January 11, 2020, 11:54:27 PM
I should also add... we haven't gotten to see it much but I think Kean can and will do some of the counterattacking things Lukaku used to do once he's fully settled.

Watch the way he runs with the ball and some of the instinctive shots he takes in those Juve clips. I expect to see a similar type of player* emerge as we get him up to speed through 30 minutes cameos and the odd start. It was a shame the match wasn't right for him today.

* won't ever match Lukaku for strength but that's alright
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on January 11, 2020, 11:59:09 PM
Thought he was good again today. Some clever movement getting him some decent openings. As for the chance where he was through. He never really got it far enough out of his feet to run the ball nearer the keeper. It wasnít a bad finish and it wasnít quite a great chance

I do worry (not directed at DCL) that we donít appear capable of scoring a decent number of goals against anyone. Played well for most of the game today but we never convince that the goals are coming
His movement has really improved the last few months and he's worked out how to make space for himself around the 6 yard box.
Agree with the second part too. We are capable of controlling the game and have enough of it near the opposition penalty area but we need to work a lot harder than other teams to actually create a good chance for a goal.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on January 12, 2020, 12:19:32 AM
Think weíll see him start netting those chances

Wasnít as easy as people think but you do need your strikers scoring those efforts.

The rest of his game is so good at the moment and with richy next to him his limitations infront of goal shouldnít be too much of an issue.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 12, 2020, 02:18:22 AM
Thought he was good again today. Some clever movement getting him some decent openings. As for the chance where he was through. He never really got it far enough out of his feet to run the ball nearer the keeper. It wasn't a bad finish and it wasn't quite a great chance

I do worry (not directed at DCL) that we don't appear capable of scoring a decent number of goals against anyone. Played well for most of the game today but we never convince that the goals are coming
As a team we're not clinical enough, that's true.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on January 12, 2020, 02:21:07 AM
Thought it was an excellry save from Ryan to be honest, as was the point blank chance too.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 12, 2020, 04:35:11 AM
Think weíll see him start netting those chances

Wasnít as easy as people think but you do need your strikers scoring those efforts.

The rest of his game is so good at the moment and with richy next to him his limitations infront of goal shouldnít be too much of an issue.

Wasnít easy, but for a PL striker you need to score those more often than not.

If weíre not expecting that of him we have to have good goal tallies from the other forwards. The problem there is itís only really Richarlison who does. The entire rest of our forward line and midfield do not score many these days.

So either you need to find a striker whoíll score more or replace the players around him to do so.

We got away with it today. They couldíve scored that chance late on and theyíd have got an undeserved point. We need more goals in the team one way or another or weíll always be liable to drop points no matter how dominant weíve been.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 12, 2020, 04:42:03 AM
0.13xg understat have it as.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on January 12, 2020, 04:43:46 AM
0.13xg understat have it as.



Does that mean a goal was less likely in that instance?

Does it take into account his pace advantage in the situation? The fact he could have taken it further forwards before shooting?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 12, 2020, 04:57:02 AM
Does that mean a goal was less likely in that instance?

Does it take into account his pace advantage in the situation? The fact he could have taken it further forwards before shooting?

Nah I think they just do shot location, the place where the player took the shot, compared to every shot taken from that location in the history of the prem and the outcomes.

So I think it'd be for every 100 of those in the prem history, 13 have gone in?

Ive not looked at a how it works type blog for ages so I may have totally fucked that up but I think it's that.

In general the rule is, almost everybody overrates chances very heavily all the time.

That's not to say its not a very good chance because it is (its very rare in football to gave a sitter) and he did well to get it, but it's not a chance you will see scored more than missed regardless of what it feels like, and I will admit it does feel like that.

Micheal Caley rates it higher than Richarlisons, think he uses opta xg data which feels similar to whatever understat uses.

But to be fair, it probably isn't very good or accurate to analyse single chances by xg and it probably is quite boring talking about it. I wish he had buried it like.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on January 12, 2020, 05:03:31 AM
Loved his little dinked effort in the first half.

Would never try that under the previous managers.

Interesting that Carlo dedicated part of his programme notes to him, saying he wants he to think like a striker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on January 12, 2020, 12:40:05 PM
Nah I think they just do shot location, the place where the player took the shot, compared to every shot taken from that location in the history of the prem and the outcomes.

So I think it'd be for every 100 of those in the prem history, 13 have gone in?

Ive not looked at a how it works type blog for ages so I may have totally fucked that up but I think it's that.

In general the rule is, almost everybody overrates chances very heavily all the time.

That's not to say its not a very good chance because it is (its very rare in football to gave a sitter) and he did well to get it, but it's not a chance you will see scored more than missed regardless of what it feels like, and I will admit it does feel like that.

Micheal Caley rates it higher than Richarlisons, think he uses opta xg data which feels similar to whatever understat uses.

But to be fair, it probably isn't very good or accurate to analyse single chances by xg and it probably is quite boring talking about it. I wish he had buried it like.

Yeah itís what I donít know with xg.

Think it is just pretty basic as DCL header vs City wasnít an xg of 1 even though he was on the line and no defender there.

For that to be less than 1 Iíd assume must pull in things like often chances from that distance will be from corners when there are scrambles with defenders and the keeper probably on/ behind the line so shots from there donít always make it in.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 12, 2020, 03:20:00 PM
I love that he tried to cheat to get a goal. Handball and then play acting.

He needs a nasty streak in him the lad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: bigdunc9 on January 12, 2020, 03:40:38 PM
I think is was just natural instinct getting the ball over the line. I thought he got kicked on the back of his head to be fair.
I love that he tried to cheat to get a goal. Handball and then play acting.

He needs a nasty streak in him the lad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on January 12, 2020, 03:45:02 PM
I love that he tried to cheat to get a goal. Handball and then play acting.

He needs a nasty streak in him the lad.

I donít think he really tried to cheat. He just threw his body in the direction of the ball and just hoped that itíd somehow go in legally. He failed.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on January 12, 2020, 04:42:08 PM
Thought it was an excellry save from Ryan to be honest, as was the point blank chance too.

Watching it again he was really deep. Oddly so I think as normally youíd expect the keeper to come out and close the striker down.

DCL would probably have been better just hitting hard in the direction he was going given that, as when he then went back across himself it was more difficult to generate loads of power.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on January 12, 2020, 05:13:53 PM
Watching it again he was really deep. Oddly so I think as normally youíd expect the keeper to come out and close the striker down.

DCL would probably have been better just hitting hard in the direction he was going given that, as when he then went back across himself it was more difficult to generate loads of power.

Seems typically what youíre ďmeantĒ to do - as in those scenarios created on the training ground. Keeper totally didnít act as he should, but resulted in a good save so intentional or not he outwitted DCL on that occasion.

For the reaction save, though both DCL and the keeper did the best they could. Gave DCL a tiny area to aim at and covered it well.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 12, 2020, 05:27:34 PM
The good thing is he's getting lots of shots in these days.

Goals will keep coming for him.

Thought some of his link up was good as well yesterday.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: van der Meyde on January 12, 2020, 05:39:45 PM
Yeah itís what I donít know with xg.

Think it is just pretty basic as DCL header vs City wasnít an xg of 1 even though he was on the line and no defender there.

For that to be less than 1 Iíd assume must pull in things like often chances from that distance will be from corners when there are scrambles with defenders and the keeper probably on/ behind the line so shots from there donít always make it in.
Statsbomb, who take into account defender locations, had it as 0.99. The figures you see will only compare like with like too, so itíll be only headers from open play going into the calculations. It just acknowledges that sometimes there are absolutely howlers where the player hits the bar from there etc. Itís not unheard of, thereís a video of a howler from that position on Twitter once every month or two.

The one where he broke through yesterday was a good chance, for sure. Itís rated as a goal 35 odd times at 100 if you account for defender location. But heís shooting from the edge of the box, under the pressure from defenders, with a goalkeeper in position.

Weíre all disappointed he didnít get at least one yesterday, but it shouldnít be a mark against his finishing. Over the past three seasons he has an xG of 18 and heís scored 18. His finishing is fine. Whatís always been the issue is that heís not actually taking shots/getting in position to shoot with feet and heís completely turned that on itís head this season.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 12, 2020, 05:43:58 PM
His runs have noticeably improved.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on January 12, 2020, 05:45:14 PM
Interviews well the lad....smart and likeable.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 12, 2020, 05:53:32 PM
I have felt for a long time that he is absolute spit of Loll from This Is England / Line of Doody

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Everton Mint on January 12, 2020, 05:59:27 PM
DCL reminds more more and more of Graeme Sharp. That has to be a good thing.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on January 12, 2020, 06:10:20 PM
Was poor yesterday
Wasnt alone mind
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on January 12, 2020, 07:55:44 PM
I'm all over the shop with him atm.

I ve gone from the 'hes never gonna to be good enough camp', to the 'I think he ll make it' to the 'I'm not sure'.

It's really difficult as I am not sure hes got the eye of the tiger to be a top marksman that ll fire us into the top 4, but then again he has improved a lot this season (beyond what I thought he was capable of) so far so maybe that can improve further.

Then I look at the stats and hes got 19 goals in 96 appearances which, for a 22 year old, isnt bad darts especially as a lot would have been substitute appearances.

Hes also a  22 year old unit, fit as a fiddle and game as fuck so you think maybe.

I'm literally on the fence now as he needs to be taking chances like the couple yesterday and we dont want to invest excess 1st team minutes in someone who isnt gonna be good enough.

That said if he comes good its saving us £50m plus and sorting out that position for 10 years.



Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 12, 2020, 08:00:29 PM
I'm all over the shop with him atm.

I ve gone from the 'hes never gonna to be good enough camp', to the 'I think he ll make it' to the 'I'm not sure'.

It's really difficult as I am not sure hes got the eye of the tiger to be a top marksman that ll fire us into the top 4, but then again he has improved a lot this season (beyond what I thought he was capable of) so far so maybe that can improve further.

Then I look at the stats and hes got 19 goals in 96 appearances which, for a 22 year old, isnt bad darts especially as a lot would have been substitute appearances.

Hes also a  22 year old unit, fit as a fiddle and game as fuck so you think maybe.

I'm literally on the fence now as he needs to be taking chances like the couple yesterday and we dont want to invest excess 1st team minutes in someone who isnt gonna be good enough.

That said if he comes good its saving us £50m plus and sorting out that position for 10 years.
He's already made it. Hes good enough for the PL as he is now.

The question is how good will he be at his peak.

The key thing for me is he is realising his strengths and weaknesses, with the help of the coaching staff. Playing to his strengths and working on his weaknesses.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on January 12, 2020, 08:02:24 PM
He's already made it. Hes good enough for the PL as he is now.

The question is how good will he be at his peak.

The key thing for me is he is realising his strengths and weaknesses, with the help of the coaching staff. Playing to his strengths and working on his weaknesses.
Yeah hes proven to be prem league quality but is able to be of the quality we need to progress. The million dollar question.....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 12, 2020, 08:12:27 PM
Yeah hes proven to be prem league quality but is able to be of the quality we need to progress. The million dollar question.....
Hopefully as the club moves forward we wont have to rely on one striker. All the big clubs have other options.

If he keeps progressing, in line with the club's aspirations, he's going to be good enough to be a squad player at least.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on January 12, 2020, 08:15:50 PM
I have felt for a long time that he is absolute spit of Loll from This Is England / Line of Doody



I went out with a girl who looked like Vicky McClure about five years ago.

Sian.

Cor.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on January 12, 2020, 08:16:45 PM
Hopefully as the club moves forward we wont have to rely on one striker. All the big clubs have other options.

If he keeps progressing, in line with the club's aspirations, he's going to he good enough to he a squad player at least.

DCL, Richarlison, and Kean are potentially excellent options.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 12, 2020, 08:19:43 PM
DCL, Richarlison, and Kean are potentially excellent options.
The potential of our strikers look rosy. Hopefully Kean can get off the mark soon.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 12, 2020, 11:43:26 PM
For that particular chance I think he needs to play to his current limitations, which means not shooting from that sort of distance.

Run it in and wait to shoot from much further inside the box. Itís not meant to be a criticism per se, just where he shot from felt like in that moment he lacked some composure as he had some space to run into and shooting from that distance really isnít his forte.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: van der Meyde on January 13, 2020, 02:14:14 AM
For that particular chance I think he needs to play to his current limitations, which means not shooting from that sort of distance.

Run it in and wait to shoot from much further inside the box. Itís not meant to be a criticism per se, just where he shot from felt like in that moment he lacked some composure as he had some space to run into and shooting from that distance really isnít his forte.
Donít think that was an option with the defender that close to him and sliding in.

If he doesnít shoot then, he either gets tackled or ends up going further away from goal.

(Though thereís an argument that a more experienced striker plays for a penalty...)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 13, 2020, 03:06:25 AM
Finally got chance to watching MOTD as was working yesterday so didn't see the match or any highlights... Can't believe people bring critical of him missing that chance, thought it must have been a gilt edged one on one judging by some of the comments posted.

It's a hard chance, very hard in fact... Hit it hard, hit the target and hope for the best is all he could do there, don't think any blame can be placed on him for not scoring there, not many strikers would have beaten the keeper with that one imo.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 13, 2020, 04:14:06 PM
Just seen the Felippe Anderson chance for West Ham Vs Sheff UTD... Very similar but he's actually closer to the goal, doesn't even hit the target, so definitely think DCL did a decent enough job of his one
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on January 13, 2020, 05:35:58 PM
He did everything right up to getting into the area.....bearing in mind this kid must be knackeredÖ..My only "criticism" of the chance at the time was one extra correct touch could've either...Ö. opened the angle up better for him to go either side of the keeper...OR go across the front of the defender drawing the foul/pen....having said that VAR would've fkked us over and said no pen.....so under the circumstances the lad did alright.....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 13, 2020, 05:55:44 PM
He did everything right up to getting into the area.....bearing in mind this kid must be knackeredÖ..My only "criticism" of the chance at the time was one extra correct touch could've either...Ö. opened the angle up better for him to go either side of the keeper...OR go across the front of the defender drawing the foul/pen....having said that VAR would've fkked us over and said no pen.....so under the circumstances the lad did alright.....

I was thinking about this extra touch and I'm not sure it would have helped tbh...

He's moving at speed, so keeper coming out and his touch and momentum would mean that 18 yards closes to maybe 10 yards with the keeper several yards out of his goal... Becomes incredibly tight to get a shot away, and that's presuming a perfect touch.

Or...

He he slows as he takes that touch to be more in control and the defender whose close probably gets close enough to block.

I think which ever option he chooses there's different issues, and no option seems distinctly better then the other.  Add in the fact DCL seems more of an instinctive striker of the ball and that extra touch might play in to his weaknesses rather then strengths.

I think Aubumeyang probably takes an extra touch and possibly scores, Kane hits it where DCL does and possibly scores, so where and how you take it definitely is influenced by your skill set as a striker
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on January 13, 2020, 06:03:36 PM
I was thinking about this extra touch and I'm not sure it would have helped tbh...

He's moving at speed, so keeper coming out and his touch and momentum would mean that 18 yards closes to maybe 10 yards with the keeper several yards out of his goal... Becomes incredibly tight to get a shot away, and that's presuming a perfect touch.

Or...

He he slows as he takes that touch to be more in control and the defender whose close probably gets close enough to block.

I think which ever option he chooses there's different issues, and no option seems distinctly better then the other.  Add in the fact DCL seems more of an instinctive striker of the ball and that extra touch might play in to his weaknesses rather then strengths.

I think Aubumeyang probably takes an extra touch and possibly scores, Kane hits it where DCL does and possibly scores, so where and how you take it definitely is influenced by your skill set as a striker

and there's the rub...and why he's not classed as a great striker as yet.....the big difference of the great strikers over the good strikers over the "decent strikers" is their decision making in a split second.....easy for me to say but I would of took the extra touch to open the goal up....the extra touch also makes the keeper have to make a decision....which in turn helps the striker decide....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 13, 2020, 07:14:04 PM
and there's the rub...and why he's not classed as a great striker as yet.....the big difference of the great strikers over the good strikers over the "decent strikers" is their decision making in a split second.....easy for me to say but I would of took the extra touch to open the goal up....the extra touch also makes the keeper have to make a decision....which in turn helps the striker decide....

I actually think his decision making was right though, as I said an extra touch plays more in to his weaknesses instead of strengths, he's not got the finess of Aubumeyang so he needs to take it earlier ala Kane. 

The difference though between DCL and a absolute top level striker like Kane is that the latter is more likely to score hitting it from there, so as DCL isn't as good his likelihood of scoring is less... But I dont think many strikers score that chance regardless because it's a tough opportunity either way.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary1878 on January 13, 2020, 07:24:28 PM
and there's the rub...and why he's not classed as a great striker as yet.....the big difference of the great strikers over the good strikers over the "decent strikers" is their decision making in a split second.....easy for me to say but I would of took the extra touch to open the goal up....the extra touch also makes the keeper have to make a decision....which in turn helps the striker decide....

The difference isn't the decision making, it's the execution of the decision and the ability needed to do what the mind is telling it to do. I think DCL comes across as a pretty smart chap, and tactically seems very aware. He also seems to make good choices during the game, but to step up to that level and become one of the league's top scorers takes some serious ability.

He knows what he has to do, but ultimately it is only down to him whether he can become that 1 in 2 striker we desperately need.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on January 13, 2020, 10:14:45 PM
i'd slightly disagree it is his decision making that's important.....this comes before the execution and either makes the execution easier or harder..

ie: he decides to take it early and shoot further out...he then has to be technically better than he was in his placement of the shot...he hit it with power but arguably not accurately enough to beat the keeper..

he decides to take another touch....he then either plays for the foul coming in on him or he has to play a defter touch to lift over the keeper... or place wide of the keeper..so again the technique is totally different again....

all bearing in mind he has a split second to do this in front of 39000 slavering fans....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on January 13, 2020, 10:39:55 PM
Both decision making and execution get better with experience.
Lets not over-analyse a solitary shot from a child and try to use it to determine his worth/future-ability hey?

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on January 13, 2020, 11:14:59 PM
Both decision making and execution get better with experience.
Lets not over-analyse a solitary shot from a child and try to use it to determine his worth/future-ability hey?

I donít think anyone is trying to determine his worth/future ability....merely giving my observations on how I saw it live on the day.....and giving my opinion on aaís observations....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on January 14, 2020, 12:04:25 AM
Wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, just the forum as a whole - what are we, 3, 4 pages into the discussion over this one shot?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 14, 2020, 12:25:23 AM
Wasn't aimed at anyone in particular, just the forum as a whole - what are we, 3, 4 pages into the discussion over this one shot?

We've become so shot shy over recent seasons any shot now has become a point of conversation 🤣
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 14, 2020, 01:59:31 AM
They did a piece on him on the statsbomb pod before crimbo.

He's developing really well. Looking like a genuine top striker prospect. Has always had his obvious physical abilities, and in the air has been one of the best at competing with cbs for long balls in the league for a while, but his shots have stsrted increasing, he's finding more opportunities, and not dropping off in quality of opportunity so he's not just taking pot shots.

Just not worth worrying about. 22 is he? Cost a song, top goalscorer, gives cbs hell, lots of stuff to improve on and lots of time to do it?

I'm made up personally.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on January 14, 2020, 02:04:40 AM
I adore him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on January 14, 2020, 03:02:27 AM
I adore him

Iíve got a proper man-crush
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on January 14, 2020, 03:07:14 AM
Iíve got a proper man-crush

He is a great footballer yes, but he is handsome too and sounds clued up and intelligent. Needs a beard, and i'll think he is the one.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: formerKHL on January 15, 2020, 12:30:53 AM
Heís definitely improved over the last 6-8 games and hopefully will continue to improve....

I can remember not too long ago on here he was getting slated.....how fickle we are...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 15, 2020, 05:14:51 PM
2 strikers in the top 10 European U23 leading goalscorers, not bad!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7889809/Marcus-Rashford-Tammy-Abraham-lead-U23-goal-scoring-charts-Europes-five-leagues.html

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary1878 on January 15, 2020, 07:06:19 PM
2 strikers in the top 10 European U23 leading goalscorers, not bad!

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-7889809/Marcus-Rashford-Tammy-Abraham-lead-U23-goal-scoring-charts-Europes-five-leagues.html

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Yeah just saw this. Keep these two up top for the next few years and surely we won't be in bad shape!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on January 17, 2020, 11:42:29 PM
Big chance of a place in the Euros with Kane told he will likely miss it.

Rashford been playing out wide.
Vardy retired.
Callum Wilson not very good.

Interesting six months for him, Abraham and Ings I think.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 17, 2020, 11:54:34 PM
Big chance of a place in the Euros with Kane told he will likely miss it.

Rashford been playing out wide.
Vardy retired.
Callum Wilson not very good.

Interesting six months for him, Abraham and Ings I think.

While he might deserve to be, I doubt he's in the conversation. They'd drag Vardy out of retirement first or I think Southgate was talking about Greenwood at Man Utd too.

Abraham and Ings would be the likelist though.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 18, 2020, 12:01:32 AM
Big chance of a place in the Euros with Kane told he will likely miss it.

Rashford been playing out wide.
Vardy retired.
Callum Wilson not very good.

Interesting six months for him, Abraham and Ings I think.

Will come across as anti DCL im sure, but I can't see it. As a goal threat he still doesn't offer enough, they'll move Rashford up top, play Sterling there, or drag Vardy back. Ings and Abraham ahead of him and in terms of a developing real threat id probably say Mason Greenwood has more of a chance than DCL of getting into the squad, that kid looks like he has a lot to offer.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 18, 2020, 12:26:52 AM
Aka you've seen him score on MOTD
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on January 18, 2020, 12:41:42 AM
Will come across as anti DCL im sure, but I can't see it. As a goal threat he still doesn't offer enough, they'll move Rashford up top, play Sterling there, or drag Vardy back. Ings and Abraham ahead of him and in terms of a developing real threat id probably say Mason Greenwood has more of a chance than DCL of getting into the squad, that kid looks like he has a lot to offer.

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Haha, good one.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on January 18, 2020, 01:35:54 AM
Wouldnít think DCL was banging them in would you.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 18, 2020, 01:44:45 AM
Wouldnít think DCL was banging them in would you.

Mate we had the same posters week in week out saying Lukaku was shite, nothing changes
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on January 18, 2020, 01:47:02 AM
Mate we had the same posters week in week out saying Lukaku was shite, nothing changes

That was me and Iíve kind of cut down on my DCL is shite posts.
Surely itís right that heís currently behind ings rashford vardy and Abraham though
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jimmywhack on January 18, 2020, 01:56:17 AM
Take vardy out the equation as he's retired but yeah. Agreed

He has a different skill set to the others tho IMO.
That was me and I've kind of cut down on my DCL is shite posts.
Surely it's right that he's currently behind ings rashford vardy and Abraham though
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 18, 2020, 01:59:43 AM
Wouldnít think DCL was banging them in would you.

Unless you play for the top branded clubs that doesn't always mean much. Didn't Darren Bent get a ton of goals one season ahead of a tournament (20+ maybe?) and didn't get to go.

That said, it's reasonable to suggest that players who have scored more Abrahams/Ings and potentially Vardy would be ahead of him still.

DCL offers something different, so maybe he does get a look in, we shall see. Just think it's unlikely unless he has a storming back end of the season and gets closer to Abrahams/Ings goal tallies.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on January 18, 2020, 02:01:04 AM
Not greenwood though ffs
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on January 18, 2020, 02:03:09 AM
Southgate will generally go with youngsters rather than the likes of Ings so that's in DCL's favour.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cereal Killer on January 18, 2020, 02:15:06 AM
Southgate will generally go with youngsters Dominic Solanke rather than the likes of Ings so that's in DCL's favour.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 18, 2020, 02:40:03 AM
If Calvert-Lewin carries on the way he is then he should absolutely go.

Same for Abraham.

Ings if you want goals off the bench fine.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on January 18, 2020, 02:54:18 AM
Current pecking order (without Kane or Vardy) in my opinion is

Rashford
Abraham
Ings
DCL
Greenwood

Callum Wilson would be in there halfway somewhere if his form hadn't dropped off a cliff.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 18, 2020, 03:10:42 AM
I think the front 3 would be Sancho Rashford and Sterling tbh.

But theres definitely a squad place up for grabs and I'd say Abraham is in poll position, with him being at Chelsea and having his breakthrough season.

DCL and Ings closely behind.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on January 18, 2020, 03:10:44 AM
Whatís so good about Ings? Nothing special just in some form. Not for the future.

Didnít know Vardy had retired.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 18, 2020, 03:14:40 AM
What's so good about Ings? Nothing special just in some form. Not for the future.

Didn't know Vardy had retired.


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Ings is a blurt.

But he's scoring a lot of goals at the moment.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 18, 2020, 03:16:18 AM
What's so good about Ings? Nothing special just in some form. Not for the future.

Didn't know Vardy had retired.


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But that's the important part isn't it, playing people in form? And he's only 27,it's not like he's passed it, if anything he's just coming into his prime

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 18, 2020, 03:34:00 AM
Not greenwood though ffs

I agree, although Southgate apparently was, according to some reports, considering Greenwood in a Sven Goran Eriksson bringing Walcott kinda I guess? Who knows.

DCL lacks much of any media attention on him too, so again unless he has a barnstorming end to the season and regularly get amongst the goals to pull him closer to/above the others I'd imagine he misses out.

Ings probably wasn't in the conversation really even 6 weeks ago so there is time. Although Ings also has the ex-Liverpool tag which doesn't seem to hurt too.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on January 18, 2020, 03:34:53 AM
Ings is an absolute fucking cunt isn't he.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on January 18, 2020, 03:38:46 AM
Ings is just having a bit of a Charlie Austin moment. Iíd have DCL over him every day of the week.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 18, 2020, 03:47:35 AM
Ings is just having a bit of a Charlie Austin moment. I'd have DCL over him every day of the week.
Ings isn't Kane, Messi or Ronaldo, but I think some are being a bit harsh, probably as he doesn't play for Everton and he played for the shite, but he's basically a 1 in 3 goalscorer over the span of his career, which is pretty decent considering some of the teams he's played at

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 18, 2020, 03:58:39 AM
Ings isn't Kane, Messi or Ronaldo, but I think some are being a bit harsh, probably as he doesn't play for Everton and he played for the shite, but he's basically a 1 in 3 goalscorer over the span of his career, which is pretty decent considering some of the teams he's played at

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Exactly, Ings is actually a very good player, he just suffers from two horrific afflictions... One is he used to play for the shite, and the other is that he has the most punchable face in football.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on January 18, 2020, 04:22:16 AM
Iíd imagine DCL is well thought of in the England ďsystemĒ.

Theyíve tended to go for progression through the age groups, so I would imagine heíd be in with a decent shout.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 18, 2020, 04:25:48 AM
Aka you've seen him score on MOTD
From match of the day and a few United games, his stats are decent though

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 18, 2020, 11:23:52 PM
Keep it going and he will put himself in contention for a call up.

Could use a run of goals to get on the radar and create a bit more hype around him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on January 18, 2020, 11:24:34 PM
Is he in double figures in the prem now?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on January 18, 2020, 11:25:00 PM
Is he in double figures in the prem now?

No.

9 in league, 11 over all.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 18, 2020, 11:27:49 PM
I'd think he'd need 6-7 goals in the second half of the season to have a good chance of a call up providing Kane stays unfit.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on January 18, 2020, 11:31:33 PM
Did well to crane his neck back to cushion that into the net. Scoring bread and butter goals on the reg now.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on January 18, 2020, 11:35:32 PM
He's become pretty much a rounded striker now. Just missing a few corkers from outside the box
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on January 18, 2020, 11:44:24 PM
He's become pretty much a more rounded striker now. Just missing a few corkers from outside the box, and getting a lot more clinical with the ball at his feet.

I altered that up a bit ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 18, 2020, 11:54:55 PM
He's become pretty much a rounded striker now. Just missing a few corkers from outside the box

He's a 6 yard box finisher right now, nothing wrong with that per se plenty of top strikers were, but if he could add some distance in there he'd be really put himself into a different class.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on January 19, 2020, 01:11:45 AM
Hard to watch Chelsea here and not think DCL is better than Abraham.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 19, 2020, 01:56:56 AM
Hard to watch Chelsea here and not think DCL is better than Abraham.
Abraham didn't look great tonight, at that moment I think when he's firing Abraham is much more of a goal threat, but DCL is probably a bit more consistent with his performance. That said Abraham also has better players supplying him

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on January 19, 2020, 02:12:09 AM
Was not happy today with a few of those around him.

Good sign as I think it shows his confidence to demand more and better from his teammates.

Walcott and Kean both played poor passes multiple times to him and that bit more quality he'd score even more.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 19, 2020, 03:12:47 AM
Another 4 shots today, 0.61xg and a well deserved goal.

Not signing a 30 year old striker at any point between koeman and now might be the smartest business we've done in years.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on January 19, 2020, 03:17:22 AM
Another 4 shots today, 0.61xg and a well deserved goal.

Not signing a 30 year old striker at any point between koeman and now might be the smartest business we've done in years.

Baller. Called it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on January 19, 2020, 05:49:15 AM
Another 4 shots today, 0.61xg and a well deserved goal.

Not signing a 30 year old striker at any point between koeman and now might be the smartest business we've done in years.
Apart from the millions wasted on sacked managers because weíve failed to score a decent amount of goals.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: bluestevie on January 19, 2020, 05:53:20 AM
Hilariously there's a guy over on GOT who constantly slates Dom and talks up the likes of Danny Ings and Callum Wilson as the type of 'quality' striker we should be signing, even though Dom has scored 2-3 less than Ings and more than Wilson, both of whom have only scored 10+ once in the past 5-6 years (Wilson last and Ings this)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 19, 2020, 05:55:43 AM
Apart from the millions wasted on sacked managers because weíve failed to score a decent amount of goals.


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They all needed to go one way or another. I'd rather invest in a potentially great young player than an average coach.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on January 19, 2020, 05:59:13 AM
They all needed to go one way or another. I'd rather invest in a potentially great young player than an average coach.
The problem is we finish low for all those seasons and by the time we do have someone of quality we donít have the quality to back it up.

We needed to replace Lukaku. We replaced him with Sigurdson.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on January 19, 2020, 06:04:49 AM
The problem is we finish low for all those seasons and by the time we do have someone of quality we donít have the quality to back it up.

We needed to replace Lukaku. We replaced him with Sigurdson.


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Oh we made almost every move wrong.

But getting game time for Calvert-Lewin and trusting him even when it wasn't magically perfect straight away was one good one.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on January 19, 2020, 06:39:06 AM
Oh we made almost every move wrong.

But getting game time for Calvert-Lewin and trusting him even when it wasn't magically perfect straight away was one good one.
We didnít really have a choice though as we never bought another striker in. Tosun and Niasse both poor which leaves dcl. Thankfully he is coming good and hopefully he will be good enough.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 19, 2020, 11:44:16 PM
With Rashford out for 3 months then that'll certainly help his cause getting an England call up

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on January 19, 2020, 11:52:23 PM
I honestly love this lad ya know.

Reckon hes gonna actually be brilliant for us in a few years.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on January 20, 2020, 02:20:02 AM
Hilariously there's a guy over on GOT who constantly slates Dom and talks up the likes of Danny Ings and Callum Wilson as the type of 'quality' striker we should be signing, even though Dom has scored 2-3 less than Ings and more than Wilson, both of whom have only scored 10+ once in the past 5-6 years (Wilson last and Ings this)

I know the guy. He's never played football so he doesn't understand the intricacies of the game. There's plenty more like him on GOT.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: stirlingblue on January 22, 2020, 12:34:45 PM
I know itís all doom and gloom after last night but I thought DCL was quality last night.

Took his goal well, but the biggest thing for me was the quality of his first touch which was the best Iíve seen it be
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 22, 2020, 01:30:31 PM
I know itís all doom and gloom after last night but I thought DCL was quality last night.

Took his goal well, but the biggest thing for me was the quality of his first touch which was the best Iíve seen it be

Anticipated the defender not getting there, and that meant his touch was spot on... So yes I agree but I actually think his anticipation was even more impressive then the touch, because he believed he'd get it, and that speaks volumes of the lad's confidence right know.

Was great to see!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 22, 2020, 01:31:57 PM
Also love him winding up Lascelles when he got all up.in his grill... Brilliant 🤣
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on January 22, 2020, 02:08:59 PM
I know itís all doom and gloom after last night but I thought DCL was quality last night.

Took his goal well, but the biggest thing for me was the quality of his first touch which was the best Iíve seen it be
He looks a different player doesnt he. It's like something just clicked.....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on January 22, 2020, 07:52:58 PM
I actually didn't think he played well last night but the fact he still scored is testament to the his form this season.

With 15 matches to go then he could feasibly get 18+ goals.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee_4_Life on January 22, 2020, 08:11:43 PM
Bit of a rallying cry on Instagram. Actually put a better slant in it than Ancelotti saying it shouldn't happen after dominating the game. Whereas the boss went with "not in our control "

Plays like an old fashioned 9. Wonder if he could develop into a leader in season or two? Think if he keeps scoring the confidence will help
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on January 22, 2020, 08:35:51 PM
Bit of a rallying cry on Instagram. Actually put a better slant in it than Ancelotti saying it shouldn't happen after dominating the game. Whereas the boss went with "not in our control "

Plays like an old fashioned 9. Wonder if he could develop into a leader in season or two? Think if he keeps scoring the confidence will help

Yeah, think he and Holgate both have "future captain" written all over them.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on January 22, 2020, 11:53:52 PM
 He's doing great, there's areas he needs to improve but hopefully with his current development trajectory he will do so.

I think he really needs to start assisting other players as his next step... If he's going to bag 15+ a year that's s great but I think so far he has zero assists?  Not knocking him for that, just saying it'll make him more of an all round forward if he can add that side too. 
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 23, 2020, 02:45:25 AM
Vardy injured now, Abrahams last night too. Rashford and Kane already out for a long while. Coupled with his form, his chances of a call up are growing daily.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on January 23, 2020, 02:47:29 AM
Vardy injured now, Abrahams last night too. Rashford and Kane already out for a long while. Coupled with his form, his chances of a call up are growing daily.

Vardy's injury doesn't change much, he's retired from international football.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on January 23, 2020, 02:47:50 AM
Vardy injured now, Abrahams last night too. Rashford and Kane already out for a long while. Coupled with his form, his chances of a call up are growing daily.
Rashford tweeted saying he'll be back sooner than everyone is saying

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on January 23, 2020, 02:48:54 AM
Vardy's injury doesn't change much, he's retired from international football.
Could change his mind if he is to be first choice at his last ever international tournament.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on January 23, 2020, 02:50:44 AM
Vardy's injury doesn't change much, he's retired from international football.

You'd have to have presumed there would have been some clabouring for him to come back in now so many are getting injured.

I did hear something with regard to that too that he only packed it in because Kane was playing pretty much every game (even dragging him back from injury to be thrown in half fit, England like to do that a lot not just with Kane) and he didn't want to be second fiddle to all that, which is understandable.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: kerryblue boy on January 23, 2020, 03:46:45 AM
He was a bit lucky not to get a second yellow last night needs to mind his tackling technique improving every match though
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on January 23, 2020, 05:53:33 AM
He's doing great, there's areas he needs to improve but hopefully with his current development trajectory he will do so.

I think he really needs to start assisting other players as his next step... If he's going to bag 15+ a year that's s great but I think so far he has zero assists?  Not knocking him for that, just saying it'll make him more of an all round forward if he can add that side too.

Might get more assists if there's more players in the box.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on January 23, 2020, 05:59:14 AM
Might get more assists if there's more players in the box.

True, but I get what Andy's saying. If we're completely unbiased, the worst part of DCL's game is his passing, especially because the majority of it takes place in the attacking third. Better passing in the attacking third = assists. That said, I thought he looked like he took it up 2 notches in this category yesterday, with several key passes, at least one of which was a great chance for a goal (I think it was the cross > Kean header shot). If he can maintain that level of improvement with his passing, our attack will become that much more deadly IMO.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on January 31, 2020, 07:07:39 PM
Well done lad

https://twitter.com/efc_statto/status/1223209119307444224
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Robioto on January 31, 2020, 09:54:57 PM
Well done lad

https://twitter.com/efc_statto/status/1223209119307444224

Nice to see three English players on there.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueForYou on February 01, 2020, 01:39:19 AM
Would be good to see two Everton players on there -

Come on, Moise!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 01, 2020, 01:48:59 AM
Richarlison isn't far off ten is he?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 01, 2020, 02:03:22 AM
Richarlison isn't far off ten is he?

8 goals, 3 assists.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueForYou on February 01, 2020, 02:42:29 AM
Make that three Everton players..............!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 01, 2020, 04:54:57 AM
Two for Richarlison tomorrow just to make that list


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 01, 2020, 05:23:48 AM
Two for Richarlison tomorrow just to make that list


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That would be most excellent like
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: pjk on February 01, 2020, 06:30:25 AM
DCL has come on leaps and bounds recently. I don't want to jinx him as this vast improvement has really kicked on since Silva left. Who got the ball rolling, Duncan Ferguson? And it's carried on apace since Ancelloti arrived. He's starting to look like the real deal, and as for the company he's keeping on that list? Its very impressive.  :clap:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 01, 2020, 07:11:23 AM
DCL has come on leaps and bounds recently. I don't want to jinx him as this vast improvement has really kicked on since Silva left. Who got the ball rolling, Duncan Ferguson? And it's carried on apace since Ancelloti arrived. He's starting to look like the real deal, and as for the company he's keeping on that list? Its very impressive.  :clap:

He needed not to be isolated up top.  Many folks had been bitching about that previously.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: pjk on February 01, 2020, 08:37:54 AM
He needed not to be isolated up top.  Many folks had been bitching about that previously.




It looks to me, like his attitude has changed. Still got the boyish youth about him and growing up fast. I think he knows if he works really hard, he's going to make it. 4th on that list is something very few were expecting 3 months ago. ("Including me"!) It's exciting to see one of our youngsters really start to flourish like a top player does. He's been very impressive recently. :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 01, 2020, 05:21:42 PM
He needed not to be isolated up top.  Many folks had been bitching about that previously.

No striker of that age needs to be left alone up top. It's a role best played by the likes of Diego Costa and people of that ilk so it was hardly surprising he struggled.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on February 02, 2020, 02:08:14 AM
No striker of that age needs to be left alone up top. It's a role best played by the likes of Diego Costa and people of that ilk so it was hardly surprising he struggled.

Exactly what i said 6 months ago and at various points of last season, i also said it when we re signed rooney he should be in a 2 up top formation, but looking back we needed rooney in midfield after losing barkley as there wasnt anyone else who was able to pass the ball forward,,, ive been dying to see to up top and im glad it was ferguson who made it happen
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on February 02, 2020, 02:20:29 PM
Not been in this thread for a while (DCL is great so what's to debate?), so I've just read the last 10 or so pages and I only have one question...

How the fuck is Danny Ings still only 27? He looks like he's spent at least 40 years down the mines!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 08, 2020, 08:29:04 PM
He's Going to do it isnít he. Heís really going to make it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Thomas on February 08, 2020, 08:31:28 PM
He's a great lad. Discussing Europe as our prime target.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 08, 2020, 08:39:21 PM
He'll only get better too. He'll fill out even more and learn the game as the years go by.

He's surprised me but it's great to see. Although I don't think he develops this season without the change and Richarlison up there with him. He does so much legwork for DCL and chips in with goals himself.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on February 08, 2020, 08:47:01 PM
He'll only get better too. He'll fill out even more and learn the game as the years go by.

He's surprised me but it's great to see. Although I don't think he develops this season without the change and Richarlison up there with him. He does so much legwork for DCL and chips in with goals himself.

He's a different player when playing with someone else up there.

Still would love him to become more reliable finisher from outside the 6 yard box, but for right now I'm happy for him to find his role as the poacher.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 08, 2020, 08:52:51 PM
Miss was shocking. Told you all he was shite

In all seriousness though heís improved so much. Finishing is a bit better, he seems to be much more consistent in providing a physical challenge to defenders but mainly his movement has gone from being quite poor to being really quite good. Hopefully more to come too
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 08, 2020, 08:54:26 PM
Miss was shocking. Told you all he was shite

In all seriousness though heís improved so much. Finishing is a bit better, he seems to be much more consistent in providing a physical challenge to defenders but mainly his movement has gone from being quite poor to being really quite good. Hopefully more to come too

Has it made you pause for thought before you completely write off young players at all?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 08, 2020, 08:59:10 PM
Has it made you pause for thought before you completely write off young players at all?

No. I thought he was shite. So I said it. Evertonís problem in terms of young players is that we paused too long before we judged them.

Saying we should give them more time because DCL and Holgate improved is the same daft argument to giving silva more time because it worked for us with Howard Kendall.
Iím more than happy to accept Iím not the most wonderful judge of a footballer but thereís nowt wrong with saying you donít see someoneís potential if you donít see their potential
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 08, 2020, 09:00:23 PM
No. I thought he was shite. So I said it. Evertonís problem in terms of young players is that we paused too long before we judged them.

Saying we should give them more time because DCL and Holgate improved is the same daft argument to giving silva more time because it worked for us with Howard Kendall.
Iím more than happy to accept Iím not the most wonderful judge of a footballer but thereís nowt wrong with saying you donít see someoneís potential if you donít see their potential

Doubling down on it. Fair enough. Just wondered.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Thomas on February 08, 2020, 09:01:24 PM
He'll only get better too. He'll fill out even more and learn the game as the years go by.

He's surprised me but it's great to see. Although I don't think he develops this season without the change and Richarlison up there with him. He does so much legwork for DCL and chips in with goals himself.

As we always said isn't it, he needed a partner. Some strikers need a foil.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 08, 2020, 09:02:39 PM
20 league goals between he & Richy.

Good thing we didn't sign a proven striker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 08, 2020, 09:03:48 PM
To be fair even up to three months ago a lot of fans were still querying if he had it in him, while we watched him slog his guts out on his on up front chasing lost balls while we were losing most weeks.

Big credit to Dunc seeing he just needed some help up top to bring his game on. It wasn't just patience we needed it was a manager that was halfway competent to get a tune out of the players we had. Now we have the best.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 08, 2020, 09:05:50 PM
Doubling down on it. Fair enough. Just wondered.

Wouldnít be much to talk about if we didnít share opinions for fear of being wrong
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 08, 2020, 09:09:19 PM
Wouldnít be much to talk about if we didnít share opinions for fear of being wrong

If you look back at what I asked you, I didn't say you shouldn't share opinions, nor worry about being wrong. I just asked if if would make you pause for thought before you dismiss a young player as 'shite'. Fair enough, you said you wouldn't.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 08, 2020, 09:13:33 PM
If you look back at what I asked you, I didn't say you shouldn't share opinions, nor worry about being wrong. I just asked if if would make you pause for thought before you dismiss a young player as 'shite'. Fair enough, you said you wouldn't.

No as I genuinely thought he was shite. Why would I pause when I thought he looked well short of the potential needed. If we wheeled on a young Stephen Hawking would you pause?

I was obviously wrong but surely if someone looks well short of the potential why would you or I pause to say it. Youth coaches make much quicker judgements on players. They are just better at it than me
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 08, 2020, 09:17:39 PM
As I have gotten older, I've started (or at least now actively TRY) to be less absolutist, sport-wise.  I'm usually a very rational and "shades of grey" person in real life, to the point I can fairly be described as without a pulse - at times.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Free Agent on February 08, 2020, 09:20:37 PM
Note to Southgate: Heís shite, end of. Donít pick him
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on February 08, 2020, 09:23:13 PM
Best bits for me were the soft fouls when little options on.

Get your body in the line of the ball and then fall over if contact. The pressure is relieved instantly.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 08, 2020, 09:25:05 PM
No as I genuinely thought he was shite. Why would I pause when I thought he looked well short of the potential needed. If we wheeled on a young Stephen Hawking would you pause?

I was obviously wrong but surely if someone looks well short of the potential why would you or I pause to say it. Youth coaches make much quicker judgements on players. They are just better at it than me

No worries. I think because I believe in learning from experiences and not repeating mistakes (of which I make plenty) and wondered what you thought about it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on February 08, 2020, 09:33:28 PM
Quite enjoyed his goal celebration too. Couldn't work out if it was riding a horse, or starting a petrol lawnmower.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 08, 2020, 09:34:04 PM
Quite enjoyed his goal celebration too. Couldn't work out if it was riding a horse, or starting a petrol lawnmower.

Latter I thought.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 08, 2020, 09:34:09 PM
No worries. I think because I believe in learning from experiences and not repeating mistakes (of which I make plenty) and wondered what you thought about it.

My mistake was being a poor a judge of potential not judging it too early. When do you suggest we should make judgements on a young players potential. Surely you arenít saying we should wait 3 years until they are on the verge of an international call up and on track for a 15 goal season before we talk about their potential? Not exactly backing your opinions with that. I think that Lionel Messi might be a potentially good player though (am I doing this right)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 08, 2020, 09:35:10 PM
My mistake was being a poor a judge of potential not judging it too early. When do you suggest we should make judgements on a young players potential. Surely you arenít saying we should wait 3 years until they are on the verge of an international call up and on track for a 15 goal season before we talk about their potential? Not exactly backing your opinions with that. I think that Lionel Messi might be a potentially good player though (am I doing this right)

Don't worry abar it. You've ground me into submission. I tap out.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 08, 2020, 09:39:53 PM
Don't worry abar it. You've ground me into submission. I tap out.

Win for Everton and a win for me. Having a great day now 😉
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: velimski on February 08, 2020, 09:44:21 PM
Latter I thought.

That was my initial thought.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Major Clanger on February 08, 2020, 10:23:47 PM
Wouldnít be much to talk about if we didnít share opinions for fear of being wrong

You're saying that like it's a bad thing.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on February 08, 2020, 11:29:18 PM
2mins 35

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 09, 2020, 12:19:48 AM
2mins 35


Annoys me that the chumps outside the club didnít know Jags was quick. Fastest CB in the league at that time without doubt.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on February 09, 2020, 12:29:23 AM
Annoys me that the chumps outside the club didn't know Jags was quick. Fastest CB in the league at that time without doubt.
Still probably one of the quickest.

It should be more surprising that he was so good in the air as he's not big for a CB.

Not many like him in his prime - quick, strong, good in the air, great timing of the tackle.

If he was a bit better on the ball he would have been nearly perfect.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on February 09, 2020, 12:31:33 AM
Absolutely love the lawnmower me
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 09, 2020, 01:40:50 AM
Oh he's not done it again as he

Calvert-lewin szn dot com loud for you.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 09, 2020, 02:14:37 AM
The last English player to get 11 in the league in a season for us was jigsaw Johnson. And that was his total. Dcl should beat that. In fact he should have done it today when he missed the open goal at the end.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 09, 2020, 02:20:42 AM
Thought he looked a bit lethargic and tired today, and last week too... Made up he scored and also assisted despite that.  He's got a rare quality where he just keeps going, doesn't matter if he's having a bad game or is tired, still puts himself about, doesn't hang his head, and gets his rewards as a result.

His character and willingness are amazing qualities to have, and I really think he's going to keep kicking on as a result.  Starting to become a proper player!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on February 09, 2020, 02:29:06 AM
His hold up play is getting better each game as well.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: cantoffee on February 09, 2020, 07:36:31 AM
Think the break will help him recharge before the end of season run.

Played a lot of hard minutes this year and hope he continues his good form especially over the next 4 games where we will need goals but also good hold up play when we end up under pressure.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on February 09, 2020, 02:38:00 PM
My mistake was being a poor a judge of potential not judging it too early. When do you suggest we should make judgements on a young players potential. Surely you arenít saying we should wait 3 years until they are on the verge of an international call up and on track for a 15 goal season before we talk about their potential? Not exactly backing your opinions with that. I think that Lionel Messi might be a potentially good player though (am I doing this right)

Bore off will ya. Point is you wrote him off far too early. Poor form that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 09, 2020, 03:35:44 PM
Bore off will ya. Point is you wrote him off far too early. Poor form that
To be fair mate weíve all done that to different players over the years


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 09, 2020, 03:45:12 PM
Bore off will ya. Point is you wrote him off far too early. Poor form that

The point is I was just wrong. If youíre saying I judged him too early then everyone who rated him at the same time is guilty of exactly the same thing.

Iíll ask you how many years before we are allowed to pass judgement on a young players potential on a football forum? Thereís a topic on Gordon on here. Are you there telling people not to express an opinion for 3 years? Imagine thinking people arenít entitled to give opinions on a football forum.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 09, 2020, 05:58:40 PM
Bore off will ya. Point is you wrote him off far too early. Poor form that

Whatever you do, don't go in the Kean thread.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 09, 2020, 07:07:15 PM
Having an opinion =/= passing judgement

"I don't think he will make it" =/= "he is shit"

Responding to posts explaining he is a kid/is expected to be inconsistent/explanations that he can work out the issues with his game with repetition of said child's shitness is what you're getting called out for.

And what people are pointing to when the next child is getting called shit.

Yes, it is too early to pass judgement on Gordon.
It's too early to pass judgement on Davies.
It's still too early to pass judgement on Holgate and DCL.

Kids like Cadamateri & Jeffers show that kids performing doesn't mean much.
Let them develop and everyone just needs to stop being a cunt when one of these children make a mistake or have a terrible game/run of games.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 09, 2020, 07:14:52 PM
Having an opinion =/= passing judgement

"I don't think he will make it" =/= "he is shit"

Responding to posts explaining he is a kid/is expected to be inconsistent/explanations that he can work out the issues with his game with repetition of said child's shitness is what you're getting called out for.

And what people are pointing to when the next child is getting called shit.

Yes, it is too early to pass judgement on Gordon.
It's too early to pass judgement on Davies.
It's still too early to pass judgement on Holgate and DCL.

Kids like Cadamateri & Jeffers show that kids performing doesn't mean much.
Let them develop and everyone just needs to stop being a cunt when one of these children make a mistake or have a terrible game/run of games.

Heís not a fucking child. Itís too early to pass judgement. Are you saying we shouldnít be commenting on a young players potential for what 3 years? Longer? What absolute nonsense. Are you calling out the people who passed positive judgement on him?? Surely they were equally early?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 09, 2020, 07:21:49 PM
Even when youíre wrong youíre right. We get it. Chill.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on February 09, 2020, 07:23:38 PM
Heís not a fucking child. Itís too early to pass judgement. Are you saying we shouldnít be commenting on a young players potential for what 3 years? Longer? What absolute nonsense. Are you calling out the people who passed positive judgement on him?? Surely they were equally early?

Why dont you understand??

No one is saying you cant have an opinion on a player. What they are saying is, will you think twice before shitting on a young player because of how DCL is apparently turning out.

Do you not understand the difference there?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 09, 2020, 07:26:24 PM
Heís not a fucking child. Itís too early to pass judgement. Are you saying we shouldnít be commenting on a young players potential for what 3 years? Longer? What absolute nonsense. Are you calling out the people who passed positive judgement on him?? Surely they were equally early?

I think what people are referring to is you saying quite definitively 'he is shit'. It was way too early to nail your colours to the mast either way.

The lad was chasing balls into the corner and feeding off scraps in a team that wasn't creating any real opportunities. He was being lambasted for for not being in goalscoring positions because he was doing the legwork across the front for two players while Sig stood and watched.

I'll be the first to admit I still had my doubts up to a few months ago and I still don't think we should hang our hat on him as he's clearly on the first hot streak of his career but it just shows what a change in formation/manager and a bit confidence can do to a young lad still making his way in the game.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 09, 2020, 07:30:44 PM
I think what people are referring to is you saying quite definitively 'he is shit'. It was way too early to nail your colours to the mast either way.

The lad was chasing balls into the corner and feeding off scraps in a team that wasn't creating any real opportunities. He was being lambasted for for not being in goalscoring positions because he was doing the legwork across the front for two players while Sig stood and watched.

I'll be the first to admit I still had my doubts up to a few months ago and I still don't think we should hang our hat on him as he's clearly on the first hot streak of his career but it just shows what a change in formation/manager and a bit confidence can do to a young lad still making his way in the game.

It was only 2 months ago, after his brace in the Chelsea match, that I was trying to downplay his quality for one reason or another. And now he has 8 goals in his last 11 games. I wonder if there's a hotter forward in the EPL?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 09, 2020, 07:38:14 PM
Why dont you understand??

No one is saying you cant have an opinion on a player. What they are saying is, will you think twice before shitting on a young player because of how DCL is apparently turning out.

Do you not understand the difference there?

No. Why would I. Do you think twice before passing judgement on a player because you wanted us to sign Joe Hart for 40m?

I shouldnít say I think someoneís shit because Iíve been wrong previously? Be very quiet on here if only people with 100% records are commenting
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 09, 2020, 07:40:52 PM
Haha just give it up lads and lizz

Heís beyond help.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 09, 2020, 07:48:19 PM
Haha just give it up lads and lizz

Heís beyond help.

I really donít understand the problem. I thought he was shit after 2 years plus and I said it. I admit Iím wrong.

Least I had an opinion. You went from worth 40m to Arsenal to was only joking to heís not good enough to this high and mighty bit. Thatís all this season. Which of your many judgements are you thinking twice about as it was too early?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on February 09, 2020, 07:53:16 PM
its not about your opinion. Are you fucking thick?

OK i give up.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 09, 2020, 08:03:26 PM
its not about your opinion. Are you fucking thick?

OK i give up.

Clearly I am. Iíve no clue what youíre talking about.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on February 09, 2020, 08:14:44 PM
I think he would have had a breakout regardless this season as he was showing really positive signs before we went 4-4-2
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 09, 2020, 08:59:29 PM
21 & 22 is most definitely a child, despite what 21 & 22 years olds may think.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 09, 2020, 09:16:42 PM
22 year olds nowadays are so lucky to be called children. When I was 22 I had 6 children of my own and 23 grandchildren. I was also a veteran of two World Wars.
But you try and tell the young people that today
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on February 09, 2020, 09:42:05 PM
His partnership with Richarlison is developing beautifully.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 09, 2020, 09:45:51 PM
His touch is a very underrated part of his game.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on February 09, 2020, 09:48:11 PM
His touch is a very underrated part of his game.



Yes it's very good it's always been his vision that has needed developing for me but there's signs that he is improving on that rapidly
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 10, 2020, 01:07:29 AM
I never thought after his debut appearance for us against Arsenal I think it was, that he would one day end up being our first choice striker.

Especially as we had Lukaku at the time.

But heís proving a lot of us wrong right now. Heís finally added goals to his game that i never thought he would add. Hope he continues to develop the same rate as these last few months.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: 74Blue on February 10, 2020, 02:23:49 AM
21 & 22 is most definitely a child, despite what 21 & 22 years olds may think.
Generally speaking, strikers tend to hit their peak at around 27/28, so yes he is still a kid. He's  still got another 5 maybe 6 years of improving yet before he really hits his absolute peak years.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Paddockoldie on February 10, 2020, 02:25:20 AM
I love his work rate and effort. He leaves everything on the pitch. When Siggy did that weave and the keeper saved it, Dom nearly folded himself in half but the wrong way round to try and get a contact on it. He's thriving off a two up front and will only get better.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 10, 2020, 02:43:12 AM
Generally speaking, strikers tend to hit their peak at around 27/28, so yes he is still a kid. He's  still got another 5 maybe 6 years of improving yet before he really hits his absolute peak years.
Cenk Tosun doesnít like this.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 10, 2020, 05:06:04 AM
I wish he had smashed that volley into the open goal rather than over the bar in the last minute.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 10, 2020, 05:13:40 AM
I wish he had smashed that volley into the open goal rather than over the bar in the last minute.


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Seemed harder to miss that than score.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: UnsyisaRhino on February 10, 2020, 06:01:00 AM
Seemed harder to miss that than score.


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Hit it too well in the end, if it had hit him it probably would have just bounced in.

Motd said he was probably already celebrating in his head and took his eye of the ball, kinda feels like it might not be far from the truth
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: mikey_blue on February 10, 2020, 01:30:15 PM
Hit it too well in the end, if it had hit him it probably would have just bounced in.

Motd said he was probably already celebrating in his head and took his eye of the ball, kinda feels like it might not be far from the truth

Just leaned back on the contact. Shows he still has loads of work to do.

Strangely thatís the most exciting part of Dom. So much room for improvement on an already quality foundation. Not to mention his excellent attitude and dedication to get to the next level. Exciting times.

People said a bit tongue and cheek about him doing a ďHarry KaneĒ a couple of season ago when people wrote him off. Doesnít look like Dom was in on the joke.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on February 10, 2020, 03:26:54 PM
Nice lad.

Developing into a very good footballer.

Lots of potential still to go.

What a cutie!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Cozzie on February 10, 2020, 03:30:09 PM
He is just gonna go from strength to strength.

Hes deffo thriving from a 4-4-2 formation.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 10, 2020, 03:30:27 PM
If Richarlison is worth upwards of £100m Whatís DCL worth in the same market ?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 10, 2020, 03:46:56 PM
Just leaned back on the contact. Shows he still has loads of work to do.

Strangely thatís the most exciting part of Dom. So much room for improvement on an already quality foundation. Not to mention his excellent attitude and dedication to get to the next level. Exciting times.

People said a bit tongue and cheek about him doing a ďHarry KaneĒ a couple of season ago when people wrote him off. Doesnít look like Dom was in on the joke.

Without that attitude he doesn't develop to where he is now, and it'll carry him forward in his development too.  Many more talented players fall by the wayside because their attitude isn't good enough, but Dom just seems to have such a high ceiling based on that desire to make it.

It's that kind of attitude that makes you a huge fan favourite, and he's now starting to look like he's going to become just that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 10, 2020, 04:24:56 PM
He's still only a few months into the first run of goalscoring form of his career, let's not put him on too much of a pedestal yet.

The signs are good and he looks to have the right attitude but he will go half a dozen games without a goal soon and his form will dip, it's inevitable, we just need to lay off him when it happens.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 10, 2020, 05:00:17 PM
He's still only a few months into the first run of goalscoring form of his career, let's not put him on too much of a pedestal yet.

The signs are good and he looks to have the right attitude but he will go half a dozen games without a goal soon and his form will dip, it's inevitable, we just need to lay off him when it happens.

Can't back this message enough. It's vital that we continue to accept he is developing and will likely be trash for large periods of the next 18 months.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 10, 2020, 08:42:29 PM
If Richarlison is worth upwards of £100m Whatís DCL worth in the same market ?


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35-40m on the high end IMO.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 10, 2020, 08:45:17 PM
If Richarlison is worth upwards of £100m What’s DCL worth in the same market ?


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Wouldn't surprise me if Man U decide to test that out in the summer.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 10, 2020, 08:55:04 PM
 :smug:
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 10, 2020, 09:28:09 PM
😂

(https://i.ibb.co/80vvbM9/FEC72123-7-DB4-4-B2-F-8-C46-4-F43622-A8-EB8.jpg)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary1878 on February 10, 2020, 11:06:12 PM
DCL was completely absent for most of the game on Saturday, but turned up and scored when it mattered. Being in the right place at the right time is all important for a striker, and he is getting better and better at it.

Would love to have seen him bury that second chance, as it would have elevated his confidence to sky high levels.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 11, 2020, 12:50:14 AM
If Richarlison is worth upwards of £100m Whatís DCL worth in the same market ?


DCL's market price is fuck right off.  :D
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 11, 2020, 01:33:24 AM
Dunno how to copy in the touch/heat maps, but someone else likely can:

https://theathletic.com/1593572/2020/02/09/dominic-calvert-lewin-everton-goals/

Dominic Calvert-Lewin: How the Ďstriker who doesnít scoreí became a Premier League poacher

By Greg O'Keeffe Feb 9, 2020 12
Dominic Calvert-Lewin is an energetic footballer with an appetite for hard work and endeavour. But curbing his natural inclination to top Evertonís running statistics is helping the 22-year-old become the centre-forward the club needs in their attempt to qualify for Europe.

Another game on Saturday, another goal for Calvert-Lewin.

The former Sheffield United youngster now has 11 in the Premier League this term, already more than in any of his previous three seasons in the top flight. His latest, a tap-in after strike partner Richarlisonís header hit the bar and dropped to him, will not win any goal of the season votes. But it did ensure Everton won three points against Crystal Palace, and the strike was the latest example of his evolving awareness and positioning in the penalty area.

Calvert-Lewin is learning to become a poacher.

The player sometimes critiqued as ďthe striker who doesnít scoreĒ is changing. It is resulting in fewer assists; his crafty lay-off to Richarlison before the crucial second goal against Roy Hodgsonís side was the first time he had set up a league goal this season. During the 2017-18 season he directly created seven Premier League goals. The last time he both scored and assisted a league game was December 2017 in a 2-0 win over Huddersfield at Goodison.

But creating goals is not his job, and Calvert-Lewin knows itís not the metric which counts.

ďI was aware more than anyone that I was putting in the work but maybe not getting the rewards,Ē he told The Athletic after the victory that moved Everton up to seventh in the table.

ďAs a No 9 youíre judged on how many goals youíve got at the end of the season. It doesnít matter how well you play, thatís the thing.

ďFor me it was important this season that I worked hard on getting in better positions to score. Iíve been looking at the percentages and where goals are scored more. Today it was just a little flick-on from a corner.

ďItís all about being in the right position and that doesnít come by accident. So for me it was about maintaining a consistent level of performance but adding the goals.Ē

Calvert-Lewin is noted at Finch Farm for being a quick learner. And as with most things, Carlo Ancelottiís simplified guidance is resulting in further progress; only Sergio Aguero has more league goals than the young striker since Evertonís new manager took over in late December.

ďHe is strong with his head but he can improve his movement without the ball,Ē the Italian said last month.

ďHe has to be more focused on the goal but, of course, he is really unselfish and he moves up and down, right and left. He has to stay, in my opinion, more focused on the centre of the box.Ē

Against Palace his average position was around the penalty spot. It led to a goal and he should have had another when another Richarlison effort was parried into his path by Vicente Guaita.



Dominic Calvert-Lewinís average position heatmap from the win over Crystal Palace

Calvert-Lewin also took more touches in the area against Palace than any team-mate. Extra sessions with assistant manager Duncan Ferguson have played their part in his improved movement, and Calvert-Lewin said he spends time analysing his own statistics away from the training ground.

ďDunc has helped me a lot and Iíve taken things into my own hands as well,Ē he says.

ďJust learning the game and really being a student of the game. Iím exactly where I want to be but Iím still learning and improving. I never forget I can become a better player each week. I watch top strikers. You can never do enough research and due diligence to improve your own game. Iím doing that daily on and off the training pitch.

ďCarlo has given me the backing and itís helped my confidence and freedom to just go and play. Iím not thinking about too much on the pitch, Iím just concentrating on my role.Ē

The touch map of Calvert-Lewinís performance against Huddersfied, below, in 2017 is typical of the strikerís game back then: running the channels, tracking back and spending less time in traditional goal scoring areas. He took four touches in the area, and none in the six yard box.



His touch map against Palace, below, shows a more disciplined centre forward display. His activity is more central, he has six touches in the area, one in the six yard box and two just outside



Playing in tandem with Richarlison is undoubtedly helping Calvert-Lewinís form too. With six goals in his last eight league appearances, mostly as part of a 4-4-2 under Ancelotti, he is benefiting from the Brazilianís creativity.

But he is far from living in his shadow. While Richarlisonís form approaches elite level, the evolution of Evertonís No 9 also continues apace. Each of those six goals, as with his entire tally so far this season, have been from inside the box. Calvert-Lewin is finding the space that top strikers thrive on, and resisting the urge to spread himself thin with runs across all attacking areas of the pitch.

His newfound discipline is carving a newfound reputation. The striker who scores.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 11, 2020, 01:53:09 AM
2 different ones:

(https://i.ibb.co/12mc5Db/Everton-3-1-Crystal-Palace-Premier-League-2019-2020-Live-2-10-2020-2-48-31-PM.png)
(https://i.ibb.co/60BnJZZ/2020-02-10-14-47-51.jpg)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: arteta4spain on February 11, 2020, 02:26:11 AM
Fucking love him. Itís the application I love from him and itís paying off!


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Heisenberg on February 11, 2020, 02:31:49 AM
Because we dont play this weekend I might go back and read this thread from the beggining  8)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 11, 2020, 02:38:52 AM
He's absolutely benefitting from the legwork Richarlison does down the channels, all the places he used to disappear down with no-one in support.

Simple coaching tips and a change in formation means our No 9 is in the box more, which shouldn't have been that hard to work out but we got there in the end.

Fancy him for a 15 goal season, which will perk people like Southgate and Ed Woodward up. Reckon we're in for some heavy interest this summer for our front two. 
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: BlueNoseMike on February 11, 2020, 02:31:33 PM
Clearly I am. Iíve no clue what youíre talking about.


You're just shit at judging potential

Bet you've written some top top players off in your time
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on February 11, 2020, 02:43:47 PM
Needs a new contract now, think heís only on about 30k a week ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 11, 2020, 02:44:12 PM
See, i told you all Duncan Ferguson was too young to be judged as a coach and you all had to give him time. It wasn't his fault he was being asked to do all the leg work in a shit system and being made to put the cones out.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 11, 2020, 04:33:46 PM
You're just shit at judging potential

Bet you've written some top top players off in your time

If everyone was as knowledgable as you your star wouldnít shine quite so bright.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on February 11, 2020, 06:47:10 PM
Ferguson being demoted from training the strikers under Silva, certainly set DCL back a fair bit, earlier this season.

I canít see any benefit Dom got from training under Boa Morte but since being back under Duncís wing, heís come on leaps and bounds.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 11, 2020, 06:57:06 PM
Ferguson being demoted from training the strikers under Silva, certainly set DCL back a fair bit, earlier this season.

I canít see any benefit Dom got from training under Boa Morte but since being back under Duncís wing, heís come on leaps and bounds.


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Which also coincided with the switch to 2 strikers up top. In retrospect, it's borderline insane Silva couldn't figure this out, or at least give it a go!

On the plus side, it's been nearly 2 months since I've incessantly bitched about 4231, so that's something 😄
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 11, 2020, 07:07:42 PM
4-2-3-1 is a very good formation. The formation wasn't to blame, it was the way we were implementing it. I reckon the biggest improvement as far as getting goals for DCL is the fact that he is now spending a lot more time inside the penalty box rather than wandering around the pitch trying to get involved in the build up.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on February 11, 2020, 07:08:26 PM
Ferguson being demoted from training the strikers under Silva, certainly set DCL back a fair bit, earlier this season.

I canít see any benefit Dom got from training under Boa Morte but since being back under Duncís wing, heís come on leaps and bounds.


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Where's this come from?

Didn't Boa Morte just replace the assistant manager who went to Formalicao?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 11, 2020, 07:11:59 PM
4-2-3-1 is a very good formation. The formation wasn't to blame, it was the way we were implementing it. I reckon the biggest improvement as far as getting goals for DCL is the fact that he is now spending a lot more time inside the penalty box rather than wandering around the pitch trying to get involved in the build up.

It's a very good formation if you have a world class striker (see: Bayern Munich), which DCL is not even close to being as of now.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 11, 2020, 07:55:34 PM
Every formation is the perfect formation if you have the players to make it work.

It's a strange obsession, football fans have, that somehow formations win games.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 11, 2020, 08:05:33 PM
It's a very good formation if you have a world class striker (see: Bayern Munich), which DCL is not even close to being as of now.
Not necessarily. Portugal used it very effectively for years and they had the likes of Nuno Gomes, Almeida, Postiga, Pauleta as their strikers. They won the final at Euro 2016 when they switched to a 4-2-3-1 and stuck Eder (the Portuguese Niasse) up front. France won the last world cup with their worst player as striker.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 11, 2020, 08:09:34 PM
Not necessarily. Portugal used it very effectively for years and they had the likes of Nuno Gomes, Almeida, Postiga, Pauleta as their strikers. They won the final at Euro 2016 when they switched to a 4-2-3-1 and stuck Eder (the Portuguese Niasse) up front. France won the last world cup with their worst player as striker.

While fair, I didn't say "only works if." There will always be outliers due to variables like execution, familiarity of a squad playing together, etc.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Major Clanger on February 12, 2020, 05:05:11 AM
https://twitter.com/neillafferty/status/1227364251112747009
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 12, 2020, 05:25:12 AM
https://twitter.com/neillafferty/status/1227364251112747009
I thought Tom Davies was Willie Wonka there


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 12, 2020, 06:05:24 AM
Why is Tom Davies wearing pajamas there?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 12, 2020, 06:42:15 AM
https://twitter.com/neillafferty/status/1227364251112747009

They both look amazing.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: howard1334 on February 12, 2020, 08:36:58 AM
While fair, I didn't say "only works if." There will always be outliers due to variables like execution, familiarity of a squad playing together, etc.

That was the only reasonable reading of your earlier cmt.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 12, 2020, 12:43:42 PM
They both look amazing.

In Tomís case I respectfully disagree.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on February 12, 2020, 12:52:47 PM
Where's this come from?

Didn't Boa Morte just replace the assistant manager who went to Formalicao?

From Dunc.

He did, but BM was given the strikers to coach, whereas is was Ferguson when Joao Pedro Sousa was here.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 12, 2020, 01:56:12 PM
In Tomís case I respectfully disagree.

*Partridge shrug gif*
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 12, 2020, 02:05:09 PM
Fashionistas out in force I see.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 12, 2020, 03:44:14 PM
I'm so fucking old
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: pjk on February 12, 2020, 04:49:57 PM
It doesn't matter how old anyone is. If I was 15, or 80, they'd still look like a pair of cunts.  Mind you, back in the 70's, I wore platform shoes.  ;D
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 12, 2020, 07:55:24 PM
https://twitter.com/neillafferty/status/1227364251112747009

Amazing 😂

That's in New York City, it's either a gag or it's Fashion Week (or both).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on February 12, 2020, 08:33:40 PM
Look like they've been to the Cam Newton school of dressing like a biff. :)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 12, 2020, 09:04:52 PM
There's a cracking picture of him on the Everton twitter account. He's wearing a fedora and a pin striped suit. I'd post it but I haven't got a clue how twitter works.
They're either very brave when it come to fashion or they're on some kind of joke over who can look the daftest.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 12, 2020, 09:41:11 PM
They both look amazing.

Suffice to say, I could not pull off either of those looks.  Fair play to Dom and Tom!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on February 12, 2020, 09:41:49 PM
"What do you fancy doing during the break Tom"

"Let's go and conquer New York'

"Sound"

Mission accomplished

https://twitter.com/JohnMc70/status/1227608193087479810
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 12, 2020, 09:49:17 PM
"What do you fancy doing during the break Tom"

"Let's go and conquer New York'

"Sound"

Mission accomplished

https://twitter.com/JohnMc70/status/1227608193087479810

Seriously fucking amazing. I want to take the train into NYC and go find them.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 12, 2020, 09:56:39 PM
Pair of shaggers
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Alanvideo on February 12, 2020, 10:09:36 PM
There's a cracking picture of him on the Everton twitter account. He's wearing a fedora and a pin striped suit. I'd post it but I haven't got a clue how twitter works.
They're either very brave when it come to fashion or they're on some kind of joke over who can look the daftest.
.................( hope this works )

                    Kid Creole & The Coconuts

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 12, 2020, 10:39:46 PM
It looks like they're wearing a completely different outfit every day. How much luggage have they taken with them?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Simon Paul on February 12, 2020, 10:57:19 PM
It looks like they're wearing a completely different outfit every day. How much luggage have they taken with them?
Not as much as they are bringing back
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Omar on February 12, 2020, 11:13:47 PM
Not as much as they are bringing back

fo sho
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 13, 2020, 12:10:03 AM
Not as much as they are bringing back

Perfect answer is perfect.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 13, 2020, 12:17:09 AM
Seriously fucking amazing. I want to take the train into NYC and go find them.

#captaincatfishgangbang
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 13, 2020, 01:00:12 AM
"What do you fancy doing during the break Tom"

"Let's go and conquer New York'

"Sound"

Mission accomplished

https://twitter.com/JohnMc70/status/1227608193087479810

Why is Davies dressed as wee Jimmy crankie? 🤣
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Sir Stealth on February 13, 2020, 01:22:52 AM
Can you imagine the NY fanny these 2 are dabbling in. the fucking lads

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on February 13, 2020, 01:27:46 AM
Both look boss, especially Dom....
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 13, 2020, 01:34:17 AM
Can you imagine the NY fanny these 2 are dabbling in. the fucking lads

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Dude. If it is fashion week, lower Manhattan is likely experiencing a condom shortage.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Simon Paul on February 13, 2020, 01:34:21 AM
Why is Davies dressed as wee Jimmy crankie?
Keith Flint
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 13, 2020, 01:35:06 AM
It's either that, or he joined Jamiroquai.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Major Clanger on February 13, 2020, 01:46:29 AM
I'm laughing cos I know if I had to guess what they were wearing, I'd have said something very similar.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 13, 2020, 02:12:38 AM
Dude. If it is fashion week, lower Manhattan is likely experiencing a condom shortage.

Ainít nothing goin on but bareback.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: boothill on February 13, 2020, 03:05:34 AM
I thought dcl was with michaela stracken then
Why is Davies dressed as wee Jimmy crankie?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee Tuesdays on February 13, 2020, 03:33:31 AM
It looks like they're wearing a completely different outfit every day. How much luggage have they taken with them?

Is changing clothes every day not normal?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 13, 2020, 03:37:42 AM
Domís the Don. Tom looks like Mick Hucknell.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 13, 2020, 03:55:02 AM
Is changing clothes every day not normal?
You're right. I've forgotten what travelling was like when I didn't have the 4 kids. Used to fill a suitcase to give me options. I'd often bring stuff back without wearing it. Now its 2 jeans, 2 hoodies, 1 jacket, 1 pair of shoes for a 1 week trip and hope to god the kids don't get their ice creams on me.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 13, 2020, 05:37:16 AM
A new day a new outfit


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 13, 2020, 05:57:01 AM
Theyíre having a ball over there.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on February 13, 2020, 06:16:49 AM
Tom Davies has proper corrupted Dom like
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 13, 2020, 06:48:30 AM
Anyone else think thatís the boots Tom was wearing when he passed to the ballboy last Saturday?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 13, 2020, 07:57:06 AM
Both pairs of shoes are boss.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: bluenuck on February 13, 2020, 10:51:51 AM
A new day a new outfit


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Iím pretty sure that photo was taken by the fashion news director at British vogue.

These guys are runnin with some serious fashionistas.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Paddockoldie on February 13, 2020, 12:46:04 PM
Couldn't see either outfit going down well in some boozers... Fashion doesn't always equate with taste. Dom pulls it off but Tom?? Maybe it's my age
Title: DCL
Post by: mikey_blue on February 13, 2020, 01:53:02 PM
Couldn't see either outfit going down well in some boozers... Fashion doesn't always equate with taste. Dom pulls it off but Tom?? Maybe it's my age

I doubt they're too arsed about what Keith, in his slip on Lonsdaleís, down the Black Bull thinks.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gary1878 on February 13, 2020, 02:56:55 PM
These boys look like they are having fun. Fair play to them!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on February 13, 2020, 03:51:35 PM
The fume on social media is brilliant
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Tinga on February 13, 2020, 04:20:12 PM
Couldn't see either outfit going down well in some boozers... Fashion doesn't always equate with taste. Dom pulls it off but Tom?? Maybe it's my age

Davies looks like my nan on a sunday morning.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toffee1 on February 13, 2020, 04:48:27 PM
In some of those outfits they would not look out of place in the film 'Whitnail and I'

Fair play to them they are young, have money and are enjoying their winter break in the city that never sleeps.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Goaljira on February 13, 2020, 04:53:18 PM
Dom looks like he's stepped away from a 70s cop show.  Cool as.  Tom's come from the set of The Big Lebowski, but fuck it if I thought I could get away with walking around in purple shoes and a dressing gown I'd do it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 13, 2020, 05:06:35 PM
Think some of their outfits have been dreadful personally but also made up they're doing their own thing rather than the usual skin tight joggers and sleeve tattoo outfit.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on February 13, 2020, 05:12:04 PM
Think some of their outfits have been dreadful personally but also made up they're doing their own thing rather than the usual skin tight joggers and sleeve tattoo outfit.

Completely agree, these lads refreshing to the identikit footballers.

While most other players are in Dubai having steak with fucking Salt Bae and posing in some wanky nightclub Tom and DCL are balling round New York having the time of their lives

They have been the best thing about this winter break.


Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 13, 2020, 06:00:07 PM
DCL looks like basically what ever he wears he looks like a total dude.

Davies looks like basically what ever he wears he looks like someones grandma.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 13, 2020, 06:05:03 PM
Not my personal choice of clothing, but like brap says I'm glad they have personalities and feel able to express and enjoy themselves.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 13, 2020, 06:24:39 PM
Think some of their outfits have been dreadful personally but also made up they're doing their own thing rather than the usual skin tight joggers and sleeve tattoo outfit.

DCL's have been mostly sound.

Davies makes it hard to defend him when he's whipping out a pair of purple winkle pickers like.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 13, 2020, 06:25:34 PM
Completely agree, these lads refreshing to the identikit footballers.

While most other players are in Dubai having steak with fucking Salt Bae and posing in some wanky nightclub Tom and DCL are balling round New York having the time of their lives

They have been the best thing about this winter break.




Moise Kean has been with salt bae ffs.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Sir Stealth on February 13, 2020, 06:38:43 PM
Really hope Davo and Dom, alongside Bainesy obvs are picking the pre match tunes in the changies, maybe big Yerry picking out some funky anthems to dance to as well

I remember seeing an interview with Wayne Rooney about him choosing the music for the dressing room when he was playing in the MLS and he said that he was playing a bit of Stereophonics, James Bay and Ed Sheeran for the lads

Imagine how uninspired that dressing room was!

I feel like Tom and Bainesy getting the squad into a bit of Fontaines DC could be essential for us playing European football next season

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on February 13, 2020, 06:41:49 PM
Really hope Davo and Dom, alongside Bainesy obvs are picking the pre match tunes in the changies, maybe big Yerry picking out some funky anthems to dance to as well

I remember seeing an interview with Wayne Rooney about him choosing the music for the dressing room when he was playing in the MLS and he said that he was playing a bit of Stereophonics, James Bay and Ed Sheeran for the lads

Imagine how uninspired that dressing room was!

I feel like Tom and Bainesy getting the squad into a bit of Fontaines DC could be essential for us playing European football next season

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Footballers are basic as fuck though mate, stick a bit of drake on and theyíll be happy
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 13, 2020, 06:44:33 PM
Really hope Davo and Dom, alongside Bainesy obvs are picking the pre match tunes in the changies, maybe big Yerry picking out some funky anthems to dance to as well

I remember seeing an interview with Wayne Rooney about him choosing the music for the dressing room when he was playing in the MLS and he said that he was playing a bit of Stereophonics, James Bay and Ed Sheeran for the lads

Imagine how uninspired that dressing room was!

I feel like Tom and Bainesy getting the squad into a bit of Fontaines DC could be essential for us playing European football next season

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Bet Fabian Delph loves the stereophonics and kasabian
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Sir Stealth on February 13, 2020, 06:55:18 PM
Bet Fabian Delph loves the stereophonics and kasabian
I've heard a rumour hes got every Kaiser Chiefs album

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Grand Master C on February 13, 2020, 06:56:26 PM
A new day a new outfit


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Tom's outfit just needs a Pan Galactic Gargle Blaster to finish the look !
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on February 13, 2020, 08:16:56 PM
On Sky Sports news now hahahhahhaah fucking love this.

They look amazing.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluebridge on February 13, 2020, 08:39:56 PM
Davies looks like my nan on a sunday morning.
lolol lolol lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 13, 2020, 08:43:46 PM
Davies looks like my nan on a sunday morning.

Plays that way too, sometimes ;D
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ravardo on February 13, 2020, 08:52:33 PM
Good job there wasnt any ladys near dom when these pics were taken, the poor fucker would probably get nicked for being a pimp lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on February 13, 2020, 10:06:19 PM
The replies to this, fucking hell

https://twitter.com/SkySportsNews/status/1227952820630048770
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 13, 2020, 10:26:24 PM

Footballers are basic as fuck though mate, stick a bit of drake on and theyíll be happy

Drake?  What are they, strippers?  :D
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 13, 2020, 10:53:19 PM
Domís the Don. Tom looks like Mick Hucknell.


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Thatís a contradiction in terms; Don and Hucknall in the same post is a classic!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 14, 2020, 12:53:41 AM
Great looks from the boys but the last one with the purple boots and dressing gown is a tough one to pull off. You can get away with it in New York because New Yorkers have seen everything you can imagine and are just not fazed. I once saw a naked woman wearing only big headphones walking down the street singing. I was the only one who looked shocked, everyone else just seemed like it was another normal day.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 14, 2020, 01:07:30 AM
Great looks from the boys but the last one with the purple boots and dressing gown is a tough one to pull off. You can get away with it in New York because New Yorkers have seen everything you can imagine and are just not fazed. I once saw a naked woman wearing only big headphones walking down the street singing. I was the only one who looked shocked, everyone else just seemed like it was another normal day.

Can confirm.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GLewis on February 14, 2020, 01:50:43 AM
Moise Kean has been with salt bae ffs.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B8g7gYko5yj/?igshid=nzth7t9xdozl

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 14, 2020, 03:01:31 AM
https://www.instagram.com/p/B8g7gYko5yj/?igshid=nzth7t9xdozl



Oh my god, a benzema style music video about his holiday.

He's headed to the top.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 14, 2020, 03:02:05 AM
When you got it, you got it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 14, 2020, 03:07:02 AM
Pretty sure Iíve been dressed in something similar to DCL and Davies downstairs in Garlands around 4am off my box at some point in my past.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 14, 2020, 03:41:51 AM
https://www.instagram.com/p/B8g7gYko5yj/?igshid=nzth7t9xdozl



Big fan of this.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 14, 2020, 04:12:09 AM
Can confirm.
That was you???


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: pjk on February 14, 2020, 04:26:15 AM
Got to admit! When I saw Tom's kit, I immediately thought, "Allied Carpets!" DCL is doing the business and Tom is explaining it, fashion wise like. Tom's a Liverpool lad; all the competition to buy the best stuff! Not sure if they do that in Sheffield? I think that's close to where Dom's from? Great to see them smiling, in the Big Apple. That coat is well fucked though. I know there's no accounting for taste! I need to use a but'.    [url=https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=390]#smfpackscodeMick 1995 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=390)[/url]
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on February 14, 2020, 04:36:30 AM
Further evidence that DCL and TD are struggling on their meagre wages. Buying cast offs from charity shops.

Hopefully, a pay rise will help them buy decent clothes! Though I suspect employing a stylist is more helpful.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on February 14, 2020, 04:36:46 AM
Pretty sure Iíve been dressed in something similar to DCL and Davies downstairs in Garlands around 4am off my box at some point in my past.

Mate, you're more likely to have dressed in something similar on a Sunday night with your slippers on, after a bath with a hot chocolate watching Countryfile. ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 14, 2020, 04:38:42 AM
That was you???


Hey, if you got it, flaunt it!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Ramjam on February 14, 2020, 11:54:12 AM
Brooklyn Museum


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Sir Stealth on February 14, 2020, 12:25:06 PM
Are they actually just doing some modelling with it being fashion week in New York?

Or have they possibly been given cameos in the new Wes Anderson film The French Dispatch?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: MmmblueBernard on February 14, 2020, 02:55:05 PM
Big Pimpin.

Iím hoping they didnít spend their own cash on those rags.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: dazfrancis on February 14, 2020, 02:57:57 PM
Meanwhile in Germany

https://twitter.com/s04_en/status/1228019505231618048
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 14, 2020, 05:54:51 PM
Are they actually just doing some modelling with it being fashion week in New York?

Yea.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on February 14, 2020, 06:23:28 PM
https://twitter.com/michaelkirby_1/status/1227985884731101186
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Audrey Horne on February 14, 2020, 07:01:49 PM
Turned up at the new york supporters club. Nice one Lads
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 14, 2020, 07:49:09 PM
Hey, if you got it, flaunt it!

Oh he/she certainly had it...
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on February 14, 2020, 08:12:34 PM
Got to admit! When I saw Tom's kit, I immediately thought, "Allied Carpets!" DCL is doing the business and Tom is explaining it, fashion wise like. Tom's a Liverpool lad; all the competition to buy the best stuff! Not sure if they do that in Sheffield? I think that's close to where Dom's from? Great to see them smiling, in the Big Apple. That coat is well fucked though. I know there's no accounting for taste! I need to use a but'.    [url=https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=390]#smfpackscodeMick 1995 (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=390)[/url]

It's Valentine's Day. If not now then when?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Toddacelli on February 14, 2020, 08:13:08 PM
Oh my god, a benzema style music video about his holiday.

He's headed to the top.

He's already there - did you not see the video?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: mikey_blue on February 14, 2020, 08:38:37 PM
https://twitter.com/toffeetvefc/status/1228326928907722758?s=21

100k a week.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 14, 2020, 08:47:36 PM
https://twitter.com/toffeetvefc/status/1228326928907722758?s=21

100k a week.
Crazy if he goes to 100k a week after his first bit of scoring form. 50/60k a week with a goal bonus should be where he's at

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 14, 2020, 09:31:14 PM
Nah, 100k is what he should be getting.

If we low ball him then a better team than us will pay him more.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 15, 2020, 12:56:14 AM
There is literally no chance he's a 100k/week striker, not yet. You're approaching best strikers in the world pay.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 15, 2020, 02:14:04 AM
There is literally no chance he's a 100k/week striker, not yet. You're approaching best strikers in the world pay.

You're at around 20% of the best striker in the world pay on that.

Fuck, it's still only 50% or less of the best strikers in this country.

It's gylfi Sigurdsson money.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on February 15, 2020, 02:15:41 AM
80k seems fair.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on February 15, 2020, 02:20:22 AM
Bernard is on at least that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Evertonian in NC on February 15, 2020, 03:52:27 AM
You're at around 20% of the best striker in the world pay on that.

Fuck, it's still only 50% or less of the best strikers in this country.

It's gylfi Sigurdsson money.

Yep.  Pay the handsome, stylish man!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 15, 2020, 05:09:12 AM
You're at around 20% of the best striker in the world pay on that.

Fuck, it's still only 50% or less of the best strikers in this country.

It's gylfi Sigurdsson money.

Lewandowski doesn't make 500k/week lol. Even if he did, I only said "approaching." Mane makes 100k/week; Aguero 230k.

i just refuse to believe we'd hand out those wages to someone who just tied his total goals from his previous 3 years combined. Hell, Richarlison is still on 90k/week, though not sure if his recent extension increased that.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: American Evertonian on February 15, 2020, 05:17:04 AM
Turned up at the new york supporters club. Nice one Lads

Damn. I live here. Maybe I should pay more attention to that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on February 15, 2020, 05:40:44 AM
Lewandowski doesn't make 500k/week lol. Even if he did, I only said "approaching." Mane makes 100k/week; Aguero 230k.

i just refuse to believe we'd hand out those wages to someone who just tied his total goals from his previous 3 years combined. Hell, Richarlison is still on 90k/week, though not sure if his recent extension increased that.

Not trying to be smart here, but you like to quote transfer fees and salaries etc like they're fact but you do realise that Premier League wages aren't public knowledge (apart from John Arne Riise) and that most quoted salaries on the internet are at best rumours and guestimates? I know a lot US sports publicise contracts etc but there's no official source for Premier League salaries or transfers, a lot of transfer fees get announced but salaries don't and other than speculation none of them are released.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 15, 2020, 05:49:46 AM
Not trying to be smart here, but you like to quote transfer fees and salaries etc like they're fact but you do realise that Premier League wages aren't public knowledge (apart from John Arne Riise) and that most quoted salaries on the internet are at best rumours and guestimates? I know a lot US sports publicise contracts etc but there's no official source for Premier League salaries or transfers, a lot of transfer fees get announced but salaries don't and other than speculation none of them are released.

Not to mention *extensive* bonuses that are v v rarely published.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 15, 2020, 06:05:35 AM
Not trying to be smart here, but you like to quote transfer fees and salaries etc like they're fact but you do realise that Premier League wages aren't public knowledge (apart from John Arne Riise) and that most quoted salaries on the internet are at best rumours and guestimates? I know a lot US sports publicise contracts etc but there's no official source for Premier League salaries or transfers, a lot of transfer fees get announced but salaries don't and other than speculation none of them are released.

I do know that but you can pretty much triangulate to get close. Salary figures aren't kept under wraps to all, clubs reveal (team) wages in financials, agents leak shit, etc. I think you'd be surprised at just how much is actually known. There aren't countless sites that report on these things - some you actually have to pay for - for the heck of it or because they're a complete unknown. Smoke, fire, and all.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Gash on February 15, 2020, 06:15:56 AM
I do know that but you can pretty much triangulate to get close. Salary figures aren't kept under wraps to all, clubs reveal (team) wages in financials, agents leak shit, etc. I think you'd be surprised at just how much is actually known. There aren't countless sites that report on these things - some you actually have to pay for - for the heck of it or because they're a complete unknown. Smoke, fire, and all.

I think you'd be surprised at just how much is actually a guess. Don't get me wrong I know some of it is fairly accurate, I'm just suggesting that you maybe shouldn't quote figures to people like they're fact especially when you often tell people you won't believe something until it comes from an official source and Transfermarkt certainly isn't an official source. ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 15, 2020, 06:24:26 AM
I think you'd be surprised at just how much is actually a guess. Don't get me wrong I know some of it is fairly accurate, I'm just suggesting that you maybe shouldn't quote figures to people like they're fact especially when you often tell people you won't believe something until it comes from an official source and Transfermarkt certainly isn't an official source. ;)

That's fair, and I certainly can't disprove it. I just tend to trust in the "likeliness" of the data being close to accurate. I was looking into the methodologies behind several of these financials sites and they appear to be mostly research think tanks. They're data collectors. Big surprise that, I believe in data lolol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: howard1334 on February 15, 2020, 12:05:41 PM
Damn. I live here. Maybe I should pay more attention to that
Do you ever go to Turnmill? Or Mr. Dennehy's before that?

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 02:39:33 PM
Definitely doesn't deserve £100k a week yet... If he's on £30k double it to £60k, he'll be more than happy with that.  If he's still banging them in come 18 months time then it's time to talk a new contract on those terms.

People complain about our wage bill, then advocate £100k a week to a striker with one purple scoring patch, absolute madness.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 15, 2020, 02:41:26 PM
Definitely doesn't deserve £100k a week yet... If he's on £30k double it to £60k, he'll be more than happy with that.  If he's still banging them in come 18 months time then it's time to talk a new contract on those terms.

People complain about our wage bill, then advocate £100k a week to a striker with one purple scoring patch, absolute madness.

No, people moan about our wage bill when it's tied up with players that represent no value.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 02:53:09 PM
No, people moan about our wage bill when it's tied up with players that represent no value.

It still all adds up though, it's crazy to give DCL £100k a week at this stage, the wage bill is a HUGE  issue, it's as daft giving a striker with one decent scoring patch £100k a week as it is Schneiderlin, purely because it's unnecessary
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 15, 2020, 03:05:44 PM
No, people moan about our wage bill when it's tied up with players that represent no value.

Exactly. So maybe we need a longer run of form from him before we commit to making him 1 of our top earners for the next 5 years. We have a lad on 28k a week on loan in league 1 because he put in a couple of good crosses. We shouldnít rush to very expensive long term judgements
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 15, 2020, 03:19:59 PM
No, people moan about our wage bill when it's tied up with players that represent no value.
Just look at players like Garbutt that we can't shift as we gave him a contract he didn't really warrant. I'm not saying this will happen to DCL and I hope it doesn't, but to date there's more evidence to suggest this is a purple patch rather than the norm, give him an increase as that's what he deserves regardless, but 100k would be nuts

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on February 15, 2020, 03:41:32 PM
Calvert Lewin last season was worth a wage hike it's not like he wasn't a good player anyway, this is a hands off warning to others and I'm good with that
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 15, 2020, 03:49:16 PM
it's as daft giving a striker with one decent scoring patch £100k a week

Yea, I'm sure that's the reason.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 15, 2020, 03:49:57 PM
Just look at players like Garbutt that we can't shift as we gave him a contract he didn't really warrant. I'm not saying this will happen to DCL and I hope it doesn't, but to date there's more evidence to suggest this is a purple patch rather than the norm, give him an increase as that's what he deserves regardless, but 100k would be nuts

Get in the bin.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 15, 2020, 04:09:42 PM
Madness that this is being taken as gospel.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on February 15, 2020, 04:24:49 PM
Madness that this is being taken as gospel.

Whatís being taken as gospel ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 15, 2020, 06:43:00 PM
It still all adds up though, it's crazy to give DCL £100k a week at this stage, the wage bill is a HUGE  issue, it's as daft giving a striker with one decent scoring patch £100k a week as it is Schneiderlin, purely because it's unnecessary

It isnít crazy at all and weíre not offering him a contract because of a purple patch.

Offer him 60k all we want but that will get rejected and he knows he can get more at a bigger club than us.

Tying down our main man up top for five years on a good deal that will keep the big clubs away is exactly what we should be doing.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on February 15, 2020, 06:48:49 PM
It isnít crazy at all and weíre not offering him a contract because of a purple patch.

Offer him 60k all we want but that will get rejected and he knows he can get more at a bigger club than us.

Tying down our main man up top for five years on a good deal that will keep the big clubs away is exactly what we should be doing.

Even giving him £100k wonít tie him down for five years if he fulfills his potential next year and starts scoring for fun but it would be one hell of a return on our investment if we did sell.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 08:47:07 PM
It isnít crazy at all and weíre not offering him a contract because of a purple patch.

Offer him 60k all we want but that will get rejected and he knows he can get more at a bigger club than us.

Tying down our main man up top for five years on a good deal that will keep the big clubs away is exactly what we should be doing.



You're basing this on an assumption he'd go sit on the bench at say Man U for more money, than being first choice for us and continuing his development.

DCL doesn't strike me for one second a player whose going to move just for money, so whilst he deserves a pay rise it'd be pretty bat shit crazy to pay him £100k a week

Double his wages sure, pay him £100k a week? Absolutely not!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 15, 2020, 09:26:42 PM
Even giving him £100k wonít tie him down for five years if he fulfills his potential next year and starts scoring for fun but it would be one hell of a return on our investment if we did sell.

I'm not sure his weekly wages matter all that much when looking to sell someone, other than the buying team being willing to at least match them, no?

I think it's more the length of the remaining current contract though now as I type this, it would seem the remaining total value of the player's wages should absolutely influence the asked for transfer fee.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 15, 2020, 09:29:18 PM
You're basing this on an assumption he'd go sit on the bench at say Man U for more money, than being first choice for us and continuing his development.

DCL doesn't strike me for one second a player whose going to move just for money, so whilst he deserves a pay rise it'd be pretty bat shit crazy to pay him £100k a week

Double his wages sure, pay him £100k a week? Absolutely not!

Not making any assumptions, itís basic football economics.

You have an asset, you invest money into it to protect its potential value.

We are lowballing him at 60k a week. If he accepts that we run the risk of losing him in a years time if he continues this run of form. Either that or we end up offering him a lot more than 100k to keep him here.

100k for him in this financial climate is perfectly reasonable and will keep the vultures away for the foreseeable future.

 
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 09:53:18 PM
Not making any assumptions, itís basic football economics.

You have an asset, you invest money into it to protect its potential value.

We are lowballing him at 60k a week. If he accepts that we run the risk of losing him in a years time if he continues this run of form. Either that or we end up offering him a lot more than 100k to keep him here.

100k for him in this financial climate is perfectly reasonable and will keep the vultures away for the foreseeable future.

 

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, personally I think £100k a week is absolute madness for DCL right now.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 15, 2020, 10:05:39 PM
How much dya reckon you'd have to pay his replacement?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 15, 2020, 10:11:45 PM
How much dya reckon you'd have to pay his replacement?

We already have him. ;)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 10:28:04 PM
How much dya reckon you'd have to pay his replacement?

About as hypothetical a question as you can get that.

It's based on an assumption he'd leave if we didn't pay him £100k a week, and would depend on if we signed a promising young player on say £40k a week, or an Aubumeyang style player on £150k a week (maybe not quite that standard as he's better than we could get).
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 15, 2020, 10:29:29 PM
How much dya reckon you'd have to pay his replacement?
About 3 months ago he was part of a strike force that didn't score goals, so we wouldn't have to pay much. Now he's scoring, a fair bit id imagine, but let's see if that continues before potentially making him one of our highest earners

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 15, 2020, 10:32:05 PM
About 3 months ago he was part of a strike force that didn't score goals, so we wouldn't have to pay much. Now he's scoring, a fair bit id imagine, but let's see if that continues before potentially making him one of our highest earners

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How long do we wait?

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on February 15, 2020, 10:53:04 PM
I'm not sure his weekly wages matter all that much when looking to sell someone, other than the buying team being willing to at least match them, no?

I think it's more the length of the remaining current contract though now as I type this, it would seem the remaining total value of the player's wages should absolutely influence the asked for transfer fee.
You trying to teach your grandma to suck eggs again! I know that the weekly wage doesnít matter
to any of the top clubs, not at 100k anyway, the return on investment would be based on the fact that we paid £1.5 million for him and if he were banking in 20 plus as a 24 yr old English striker you could expect at least an £80 plus million profit on that. That would certainly help if we were in an FFP mess.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 15, 2020, 10:58:32 PM
About as hypothetical a question as you can get that.

It's based on an assumption he'd leave if we didn't pay him £100k a week, and would depend on if we signed a promising young player on say £40k a week, or an Aubumeyang style player on £150k a week (maybe not quite that standard as he's better than we could get).

Sounds about right then ey
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 15, 2020, 10:58:56 PM
To add context.

Tammy Abraham is on 50k a week and is in talks for a new deal worth 100k.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 11:07:10 PM
Sounds about right then ey

I'm basing the young promising striker being about the level of DCL now.  Whilst he's done well recently he's still nothing more than a young promising striker, I'd give him more than a new signing of similar standard because he's ours and already embedded in the nature of the club, so that's worth something.

Like I said doubling his wages seems fair for someone whose performances this season demand a pay rise, making him one of the club's top earners off the back of 6 months, of which he's only been scoring in the last 2, not so much
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 15, 2020, 11:08:28 PM
Heís been our main striker for three years, not six months.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 11:12:47 PM
Heís been our main striker for three years, not six months.

He's not been our main striker for three years, he's played no more part than Richarlison as a striker and Tosun even during the horrible Big Sam days.

This season he's improved massively and become first choice, but even then that's fairly recent, Richarlison was preferred at points earlier in the season in that striker role.

His development has been excellent of late, there's no denying that, and of course he deserves a new contract... But £100k a week is ludicrous
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 15, 2020, 11:22:50 PM
I'm basing the young promising striker being about the level of DCL now.  Whilst he's done well recently he's still nothing more than a young promising striker, I'd give him more than a new signing of similar standard because he's ours and already embedded in the nature of the club, so that's worth something.

Like I said doubling his wages seems fair for someone whose performances this season demand a pay rise, making him one of the club's top earners off the back of 6 months, of which he's only been scoring in the last 2, not so much

Ohhhh you're talking total bollocks my apologies
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on February 15, 2020, 11:26:02 PM
He's hit form at the right time for him, but from a contract perspective not a great time for us given his current deal is up in 2022.

Ideally I'd like to have seen him have another season to really show that sort of consistency he has of late before we put him on such high wages but we've kinda made a problem for ourselves by not getting an extension done sooner.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 15, 2020, 11:28:30 PM
Also - itís not just a 6 month stint ffs. Itís been clear heís a baller in the making for like 2yrs.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 15, 2020, 11:31:59 PM
How long do we wait?



Surely we offer him something in between the 100k heís worth if this form continues and the 30k he was worth when he wasnít scoring goals. With the promise of looking at it again in 6 months or a year if he continues to play well

If we give him 100k now for 5 years and he does fantastically heís still going to want more in 12 months. If we give him it and he starts to struggle for goals heís not going to take any less. Nothing wrong with asking for a longer run of 100k form before we commit to giving him at least that for years
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 15, 2020, 11:38:58 PM
Ohhhh you're talking total bollocks my apologies

Quite clearly not... His recent performances have made him first choice, but that's not even been since the start of this season.  You can say I'm talking bollocks all you like, but that's absolute fact
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 15, 2020, 11:52:44 PM
Weíre effectively giving the wages weíre shortly offloading from Niasse to secure one of the most promising talents in English football. As it stands his understudy earns vastly more than him and that needs addressing.

Canít understand all the fuss about it to be honest.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 16, 2020, 12:02:16 AM
He's not been our main striker for three years, he's played no more part than Richarlison as a striker and Tosun even during the horrible Big Sam days.

This season he's improved massively and become first choice, but even then that's fairly recent, Richarlison was preferred at points earlier in the season in that striker role.

His development has been excellent of late, there's no denying that, and of course he deserves a new contract... But £100k a week is ludicrous

Heís played no more than Richarlison and Tosun upfront?

Come on man. Heís been the main man, improved year upon year and now the goals have started to come the 100k is fully justified.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on February 16, 2020, 12:10:37 AM
If you think 100k is ridiculous for a player like Calvert Lewin in the current era we are fucked if we try and sign anyone who's even better than average
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 16, 2020, 12:18:23 AM
Heís played no more than Richarlison and Tosun upfront?

Come on man. Heís been the main man, improved year upon year and now the goals have started to come the 100k is fully justified.



He's not been first choice until recently, last season Richarlison played loads of games up top, start of this season too... When Sam was here he played Tosun every bit as much as DCL.

The fact is as a bonified first choice striker he's held that mantle for a few months, and whilst he's done great of late you dont throw £100k a week at a player whose oy just recently started to show premier league quality.

For all we know he might not score again for the rest of the season, there's no guarantees with him because he's not shown anything over a prolonged period of time to suggest he should be one of our too earners.

Double his wages sure, then give him £100k a week in 18 months if he's continued to develop and is a genuinely integral part of our starting eleven.

People moan about us throwing daft wages about, let's not go down that route unnecessarily with our current players, be sensible and tell him we review again in 18 months
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 16, 2020, 12:19:51 AM
To add context.

Tammy Abraham is on 50k a week and is in talks for a new deal worth 100k.



Is this the Abraham that's been banging them in for the past few seasons at different levels, come into the premier league and continued that form and got called up for England Vs someone that has been in the premier league for 3 years and with the exception of the last 3 months has hardly ever looked like scoring comparison?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 16, 2020, 12:23:35 AM
Is this the Abraham that's been banging them in for the past few seasons at different levels, come into the premier league and continued that form and got called up for England Vs someone that has been in the premier league for 3 years and with the exception of the last 3 months has hardly ever looked like scoring comparison?

Yes mate.

Same lad who scored five goals in his only other season in the premier league and had been playing in the championship whilst DCL has been mixing it with the big boys week in week out.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 16, 2020, 12:24:08 AM
He's not been first choice until recently, last season Richarlison played loads of games up top, start of this season too... When Sam was here he played Tosun every bit as much as DCL.

The fact is as a bonified first choice striker he's held that mantle for a few months, and whilst he's done great of late you dont throw £100k a week at a player whose oy just recently started to show premier league quality.

For all we know he might not score again for the rest of the season, there's no guarantees with him because he's not shown anything over a prolonged period of time to suggest he should be one of our too earners.

Double his wages sure, then give him £100k a week in 18 months if he's continued to develop and is a genuinely integral part of our starting eleven.

People moan about us throwing daft wages about, let's not go down that route unnecessarily with our current players, be sensible and tell him we review again in 18 months

Why are you making out like heís just entered the team in the last six months?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Crackling on February 16, 2020, 12:26:37 AM
Seb Haller at west ham is on around 120k a week and cost 45m.
West ham may he a shitshow, but he still  doesn't look like a striker who will score 15-20 in the league yet/ever.

DCL is probably valued at 40m+ now, so why wouldn't we pay him the market rate when we know he can score goals in the pre and lead the line? With the mentality he has shown, he is extremely unlikely to get worse over the next 4/5 years.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 16, 2020, 12:27:01 AM
Why are you making out like heís just entered the team in the last six months?

I'm not, I'm saying previous to the last few months he wasn't deemed first choice and played sometimes, other times Richarlison was preferred, and before that even Tosun at times.

He's become a definite first choice part way through THIS season, so a few months... That's a hell of a short time to be slinging £100k a week in his direction
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 16, 2020, 12:31:55 AM
The hottest young marksmen in the game get paid like the hottest young marksmen in the game.

Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on February 16, 2020, 12:48:40 AM
I'm not, I'm saying previous to the last few months he wasn't deemed first choice and played sometimes, other times Richarlison was preferred, and before that even Tosun at times.

He's become a definite first choice part way through THIS season, so a few months... That's a hell of a short time to be slinging £100k a week in his direction

Thats not why he is getting it though is it? He's getting it because he's improved season on season and the fact is he's probably the best young English striker in the league
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 16, 2020, 12:57:52 AM
Thats not why he is getting it though is it? He's getting it because he's improved season on season and the fact is he's probably the best young English striker in the league

A new contract is because he's improved year on year yes. Don't think anyone's disputing that.

In terms of being a young premier league striker he's been one of the best over the last 2-3 months, but Abraham's goal tally is superior and has also been proven last year in the Championship too... and let's not forget Rashford whose streets ahead and done far more in the game then either DCL and Abraham. So one of the best yes, but THE best I'm not convinced that's true.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Silas on February 16, 2020, 01:02:07 AM
A new contract is because he's improved year on year yes. Don't think anyone's disputing that.

In terms of being a young premier league striker he's been one of the best over the last 2-3 months, but Abraham's goal tally is superior and has also been proven last year in the Championship too... and let's not forget Rashford whose streets ahead and done far more in the game then either DCL and Abraham. So one of the best yes, but THE best I'm not convinced that's true.

All opinions but he's a more rounded player than both and I believe his ceiling is higher
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 16, 2020, 03:54:12 AM
If DCL was playing for someone like Burnley and banging them in, and we were linked with him, how much would you be prepared to pay and what wage would you put on him?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 16, 2020, 04:16:10 AM
If DCL was playing for someone like Burnley and banging them in, and we were linked with him, how much would you be prepared to pay and what wage would you put on him?


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Ok, so how much would you pay Pukki per week if we signed him?
The point is nobody is denying he deserves a pay rise, that's obvious. The only debate is after 3 years of having an abysmal scoring record he has done well for 10 games, some think those 10 games warrant a 100k wage, others don't. If he continues at that rate, then we're all winners and he then gets rewarded for showing that consistency, however, if he doesn't and we give him that then were lumbered with a really high earner that we can't shift, we should learn from previous experience. But like others have said, this is purely speculative and I'd be surprised if that is what he'd get offered anyway
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 16, 2020, 04:22:59 AM
He is not getting offered a new contract off ten good games ffs
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bluedylan on February 16, 2020, 04:28:15 AM
He's good and he's worth 100k for me, given things like - cost to replace, sell on value, current market etc

This will come across as a diss. It's not meant that way, it's an observation but I do think he has a ceiling, which I don't think is a lot higher than his current level. I also think Rashford has a higher ceiling for example, but might not get as much as out of his talent as DCL will out of slightly lesser talent.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: sam of the south on February 16, 2020, 04:28:28 AM
If DCL was playing for someone like Burnley and banging them in, and we were linked with him, how much would you be prepared to pay and what wage would you put on him?


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We probably wouldnít be able to attract him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 16, 2020, 04:32:24 AM
He is not getting offered a new contract off ten good games ffs

I get that, but if you're saying this rumoured 100k per week that you think is deserved is for someone that for the previous 95% of his career has average about 1 goal in 5/6 games then I want what you're smoking. Take the previous 10 games out of it can you honestly say you think 100k per week would be about right?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 16, 2020, 04:50:59 AM
No one has a clue what is in his next contract offer.

Heís getting a pay rise and heíll get offered what we think heís worth and what will fit within our new budget.

Really have no idea why certain people are getting their knickers in a twist over what is essentially just newspaper speculation.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 16, 2020, 05:04:06 AM
Oh my word imagine thinking he was no good up until 10 games ago. Get out of town the lot of you.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 16, 2020, 05:47:48 AM
I get that, but if you're saying this rumoured 100k per week that you think is deserved is for someone that for the previous 95% of his career has average about 1 goal in 5/6 games then I want what you're smoking. Take the previous 10 games out of it can you honestly say you think 100k per week would be about right?

You get that he's 22 and these past years you keep referring to as being 'poor' were his development (which incidentally is still ongoing). Bit of a dense argument.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: youngysenior on February 16, 2020, 07:46:15 AM
I get that, but if you're saying this rumoured 100k per week that you think is deserved is for someone that for the previous 95% of his career has average about 1 goal in 5/6 games then I want what you're smoking. Take the previous 10 games out of it can you honestly say you think 100k per week would be about right?
I really don't give a fuck how much he gets paid.. it's  not our money!! As long as he keeps banging them in " I don't care",

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 16, 2020, 02:13:01 PM
No one has a clue what is in his next contract offer.

Heís getting a pay rise and heíll get offered what we think heís worth and what will fit within our new budget.

Really have no idea why certain people are getting their knickers in a twist over what is essentially just newspaper speculation.

I donít think anyone is getting their knickers in a twist. Just discussing a rumour. People always seem to want to add powerful emotions to what are just opinions to pass the time.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on February 16, 2020, 03:58:33 PM
You get that he's 22 and these past years you keep referring to as being 'poor' were his development (which incidentally is still ongoing). Bit of a dense argument.

No, thats exactly the point im trying to make, he is still developing and will do for a number of years and I genuinely hope its on the same trajectory as the previous few months and we have ourselves our own Harry Kane, but there are no guarantees. The point im trying to emphasis is that you wouldnt think he is anywhere near a 100k a week player if it wasnt for the last few months. Like others have said he wasn't a regular, struggled for goals and there was debate about whether he was even good enough. These figures being quoted seem very reactive based on the fact hes started scoring, but whose to say that will continue? Otherwise we might as well give Davies 100k a week now in the hope he has a good run of games. Nobody is debating he deserves a pay rise as its obvious, but 100k seems excessive, and ill leave it there
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: van der Meyde on February 16, 2020, 04:22:45 PM
No one has a clue what is in his next contract offer.

Heís getting a pay rise and heíll get offered what we think heís worth and what will fit within our new budget.

Really have no idea why certain people are getting their knickers in a twist over what is essentially just newspaper speculation.
Spot on. The £100k a week rumours were £70k a week rumours barely a month ago.

At this point somewhere in the middle of that range is probably about right.

I'd bet on him maintaining this level, given he's "been looking at the percentages and where goals are scored more" - you know that xG bollocks half of you get pissed off over - but £100k a week after one season of doing it is probably still on the high side.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on February 18, 2020, 04:52:25 AM
To add context.

Tammy Abraham is on 50k a week and is in talks for a new deal worth 100k.

To even further context.

Tammy Abraham is holding out for £180k a week according to some news reports.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on February 18, 2020, 05:10:45 AM
To even further context.

Tammy Abraham is holding out for £180k a week according to some news reports.
And Hudson-Odoi got that having made less than 10 senior appearances. Thatís life in the big time, as fans, we need the stomach for it.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: GrantyBoy78 on February 18, 2020, 05:12:19 AM
Within 3 years weíll be paying someone £250k p/w.


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 18, 2020, 06:00:17 AM
Within 3 years weíll be paying someone £250k p/w.


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So like, a squad player on United.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: markB on February 18, 2020, 07:55:32 AM
how much has he saved us on taking a punt on a player to get that 15/20 goals a year

be happy he has signed it
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Confucius on February 18, 2020, 11:09:45 AM
All these amounts are just ludicrous. Itís pointless debating it actually Cos there is no real value at any of these prices nobody is worth even a tenth of what they make. It is all pretty much Monopoly money at this stage.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Goaljira on February 18, 2020, 02:37:56 PM
Anyone saying he should only be paid £60k a week and be a happy little boy will only be expecting us to get £25m for him if we sold him then, right?  Of course not.  They'd be the first saying we should be charging £50m because of his potential.

You can't have it both ways.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on February 18, 2020, 02:56:05 PM
Anyone saying he should only be paid £60k a week and be a happy little boy will only be expecting us to get £25m for him if we sold him then, right?  Of course not.  They'd be the first saying we should be charging £50m because of his potential.

You can't have it both ways.
Heís one good season off £80 million.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 18, 2020, 03:29:00 PM
Heís one good season off £80 million.

A lot of young players are.

They are also one bad season off £8m.

Letís get some perspective on the lad.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 18, 2020, 03:42:50 PM
Remember when a certain bloody someone was laughed out of town for saying heís worth £40mil.

:)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Escla on February 18, 2020, 04:34:39 PM
A lot of young players are.

They are also one bad season off £8m.

Letís get some perspective on the lad.

Get some perspective yourself and stop playing the sole authority on all things Everton, what I said is still a valid point, yes there are a few other young players in the same position, how does that negate my comment ?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Thornton_19 on February 18, 2020, 04:48:59 PM
Remember when a certain bloody someone was laughed out of town for saying he's worth £40mil.

:)
Sounds like fibbs that mate.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: KoemansNumberTens on February 18, 2020, 06:12:35 PM
Remember when a certain bloody someone was laughed out of town for saying heís worth £40mil.

:)

Quickly said he didnít mean it if my memory serves me right
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 18, 2020, 07:29:08 PM
Heís one good season off £80 million.

He's also one bad season off being worth £20m
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 18, 2020, 07:32:51 PM
He's one quite good season off being worth £28m
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: brap2 on February 18, 2020, 07:41:06 PM
We've now reached a point in this discussion I like to call Terminal Circularity, in which the conversation revolves in ever tighter circles until @Gash (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=14) eventually locks it.

Hold on tight ladies and gentlemen, this baby is set to Spin.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on February 18, 2020, 07:45:27 PM
£29.5 mill plus addons
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 18, 2020, 08:43:01 PM
We paid 28 for Kean.

DCL is English. He's young. He's recently discovered how to score goals. He's a bit of a handful up front. He wears snazzy clothes around the city.

Got to be worth at least 30, hasn't he?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 18, 2020, 09:40:35 PM
We paid 28 for Kean.

DCL is English. He's young. He's recently discovered how to score goals. He's a bit of a handful up front. He wears snazzy clothes around the city.

Got to be worth at least 30, hasn't he?

I had him pegged at 31.7m, so close
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Lxxx on February 19, 2020, 12:39:41 AM
We've now reached a point in this discussion I like to call Terminal Circularity, in which the conversation revolves in ever tighter circles until @Gash (https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?action=profile;u=14) eventually locks it.

Hold on tight ladies and gentlemen, this baby is set to Spin.

I think AI took over this discussion a while ago.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on February 19, 2020, 03:27:54 AM
We paid 28 for Kean.

DCL is English. He's young. He's recently discovered how to score goals. He's a bit of a handful up front. He wears snazzy clothes around the city.

Got to be worth at least 30, hasn't he?

The fact that DCL is English pushes his valuation closer to the £100m mark. His goals per minute has improved a fair bit since Ferguson took to the caretaker manager role. There's potential to improve his game and to maximise his goal scoring threat. Most of all, DCL is in the top 7 under 23 strikers in Europe.

Some people will scoff at my valuation. However, strikers are expensive, particularly English ones.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 19, 2020, 03:29:56 AM
The fact that DCL is English pushes his valuation closer to the £100m mark. His goals per minute has improved a fair bit since Ferguson took to the caretaker manager role. There's potential to improve his game and to maximise his goal scoring threat. Most of all, DCL is in the top 7 under 23 strikers in Europe.

Some people will scoff at my valuation. However, strikers are expensive, particularly English ones.
Given the choice of Lukaku or DCL for 80 mill which one would you go for?


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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 19, 2020, 03:47:35 AM
The fact that DCL is English pushes his valuation closer to the £100m mark. His goals per minute has improved a fair bit since Ferguson took to the caretaker manager role. There's potential to improve his game and to maximise his goal scoring threat. Most of all, DCL is in the top 7 under 23 strikers in Europe.

Some people will scoff at my valuation. However, strikers are expensive, particularly English ones.

We've gone from DCL is worth £100k a week, to him bring worth £100m... Jesus wept 🤣🤣🤣

Looking forward to in 10 pages time his valuation being around the £500m mark and wages of £1 billion a week
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 19, 2020, 03:47:45 AM
Given the choice of Lukaku or DCL for 80 mill which one would you go for?


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It's a trap!

(Lukaku)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Goaljira on February 19, 2020, 03:51:56 AM
It's a trap!

(Lukaku)

Lukaku's trapping nothing!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Martip on February 19, 2020, 03:52:31 AM
The fact that DCL is English pushes his valuation closer to the £100m mark. His goals per minute has improved a fair bit since Ferguson took to the caretaker manager role. There's potential to improve his game and to maximise his goal scoring threat. Most of all, DCL is in the top 7 under 23 strikers in Europe.

Some people will scoff at my valuation. However, strikers are expensive, particularly English ones.
DCL is nowhere near a £100m striker yet ffs
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 19, 2020, 04:19:49 AM
The fact that DCL is English pushes his valuation closer to the £100m mark. His goals per minute has improved a fair bit since Ferguson took to the caretaker manager role. There's potential to improve his game and to maximise his goal scoring threat. Most of all, DCL is in the top 7 under 23 strikers in Europe.

Some people will scoff at my valuation. However, strikers are expensive, particularly English ones.

Iíve got your back bro
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Mick 1995 on February 19, 2020, 04:51:41 AM
He's not worth anywhere near £100m. Not even half of that.

But we'd have to spend damn near that to replace him.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on February 19, 2020, 05:07:18 AM
Given the choice of Lukaku or DCL for 80 mill which one would you go for?


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In the here and now - I'd go for Lukaku. But for trajectory, I may well punt on DCL.
Title: DCL
Post by: blargins on February 19, 2020, 05:56:05 AM
In the here and now - I'd go for Lukaku. But for trajectory, I may well punt on DCL.
Actually that's kind of my feeling.

With Lukaku we know what we would be getting. Guaranteed goals but with DCL we get a proper team player as well as a few goals and of course the
Most exciting, the unknown.

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 19, 2020, 05:32:52 PM
Haaland to Borussia Dortmund - Ä20m

Everton fans - DCL must be worth what? £100m 🤣🤣🤣

I love DCL, think his attitude to his development is exceptional, but people have got mega carried away with him after the last 2 months.  Same fans probably who moan when others build up a player too much which then leads to that player becoming a boo boy when things stop going quite so well.

Everyone just needs to chill there boots a bit with DCL, he's done well recently but we've been here before with players... let's not go overboard!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Macca77 on February 19, 2020, 05:41:12 PM
DCL with TCL on his sleeve, mind blowing
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Jamokachi on February 19, 2020, 05:45:38 PM
Haaland to Borussia Dortmund - Ä20m

Buy out clause.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on February 19, 2020, 05:46:32 PM
Buy out clause.

You forgot to add a billion emojis.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 19, 2020, 05:50:53 PM
Haaland to Borussia Dortmund - Ä20m

Everton fans - DCL must be worth what? £100m 🤣🤣🤣

I love DCL, think his attitude to his development is exceptional, but people have got mega carried away with him after the last 2 months.  Same fans probably who moan when others build up a player too much which then leads to that player becoming a boo boy when things stop going quite so well.

Everyone just needs to chill there boots a bit with DCL, he's done well recently but we've been here before with players... let's not go overboard!

How much do you think heís worth?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 19, 2020, 06:11:16 PM
You forgot to add a billion emojis.

Apologies 😂😂😂🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️😬😬😬🤗

Hope this makes up for it 😜
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 19, 2020, 06:15:49 PM
How much do you think heís worth?

Probably £30m-£40m in reality.  If he scores 15 by the end of the season, and repeats it next you'd have to be looking closer to £60m.

15 goals isn't all that amazing but obviously his all round adds to his value.  If he can move up to 20 goals a year over the next couple of season then you're starting to look at that £80m - £100m mark.

Let's not forget his improved goal return is in a two up top as well, so as most teams play with one striker you'd have to take that in to account in terms of how much a team would pay.  No one is going to pay crazy money for a player who might not hit 10 in their formation.

He's doing great, I'm not trying to piss on his chips, it's just very early days for him to be talked about in the elite level player transfer fee area.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: TheRam on February 19, 2020, 06:23:10 PM
Probably £30m-£40m in reality.  If he scores 15 by the end of the season, and repeats it next you'd have to be looking closer to £60m.

15 goals isn't all that amazing but obviously his all round adds to his value.  If he can move up to 20 goals a year over the next couple of season then you're starting to look at that £80m - £100m mark.

Let's not forget his improved goal return is in a two up top as well, so as most teams play with one striker you'd have to take that in to account in terms of how much a team would pay.  No one is going to pay crazy money for a player who might not hit 10 in their formation.

He's doing great, I'm not trying to piss on his chips, it's just very early days for him to be talked about in the elite level player transfer fee area.

Think pretty much everyone will be in agreement with that.

Only one person mentioned a £100m figure, and thatís very much way down the line.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 19, 2020, 08:00:33 PM
Think pretty much everyone will be in agreement with that.

Only one person mentioned a £100m figure, and thatís very much way down the line.

I don't know how to feel about people being in agreement with something I've posted... I'm not used to it!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 19, 2020, 08:07:17 PM
I don't know how to feel about people being in agreement with something I've posted... I'm not used to it!

I wouldn't remain used to it.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: ajax_andy on February 19, 2020, 08:08:30 PM
I wouldn't remain used to it.

Haha I'm going to ride this wave all the way to the next goal Pickford concedes!
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on February 19, 2020, 08:10:40 PM
Haha I'm going to ride this wave all the way to the next goal Pickford concedes!

According to the calendar you have 4 days to enjoy this lol
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 19, 2020, 08:44:56 PM
Trying to put a value on a player is kind of pointless. His value is dependent on other factors rather than his performances. Was Dembele worth 125M when Barcelona bought him? No but they had a pocketful of cash and were desperate to spend it on a supposed superstar in order to appease their fans. Was Van Dijk worth 75M? Not at the time, but Liverpool considered him the final piece of their puzzle in order to compete for the title and they were willing to overpay for him.
The only figure that really matters is how much money would it take for us to agree to sell him. Brands and Ancelotti both seem to rate him highly, he fits into our style of pay, hasn't caused any problems. I reckon it would take minimum 50 million before we even started to listen to offers.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Undisputed_blue on February 21, 2020, 08:05:31 AM
Trying to put a value on a player is kind of pointless.

The reality is there is no magic tree of strikers. Strikers are a rarity and often fetch their asking price.

Obviously, we haven't learnt our lesson from buying a dud like Tosun for £30m, have we?
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Hesmenos on February 21, 2020, 01:14:56 PM
The reality is there is no magic tree of strikers. Strikers are a rarity and often fetch their asking price.

Obviously, we haven't learnt our lesson from buying a dud like Tosun for £30m, have we?
Tosun is another example of what I mean. If we're buying him at the start of summer to complement and provide competition to the striker we already have, then we offer 10-12M, if they don't agree we move on. There's plenty of strikers in the Tosun bracket available for that kind of money.
If we find ourselves in a relegation dogfight in January and suddenly realise that we don't actually have a reliable goalscorer in the squad, then we pay 27M. He's not a better player in January, we just value him higher because we are desperate and the cost of relegation is much higher than the 17M difference.
After a long time we are now in a financial position were we don't need to sell our best players. If Man Utd came in for DCL in January we would not sell. But if he was desperate to go and we could find a replacement then we would ask for 80M and start negotiating from there.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Dr. Sponge on March 02, 2020, 12:20:47 AM
This thread is too low down for my liking.

What an upturn in form since Fergie-Carlo, only 4 goals off the top of the scoring charts.

All the hard work for him paying off, he looked really up for it from the start of the season, he's just need the right direction.

I even thought he had two good games before Silva (the absolute weapon) dropped him for Tosun.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Waltzer on March 02, 2020, 12:25:20 AM
This thread is too low down for my liking.

What an upturn in form since Fergie-Carlo, only 4 goals off the top of the scoring charts.

All the hard work for him paying off, he looked really up for it from the start of the season, he's just need the right direction.

I even thought he had two good games before Silva (the absolute weapon) dropped him for Tosun.
Since Carlo took over he's the leading scorer in the league

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Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on March 02, 2020, 12:39:01 AM
https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=94432.0

:)

(https://i.imgur.com/VU9DL48.png)
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on March 02, 2020, 12:55:42 AM
Since Carlo took over he's the leading scorer in the league

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Any idea where he is when you remove pens, since we don't get any, ever?

I bet there's some daylight between him and the next guy.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: blueToffee on March 02, 2020, 12:58:00 AM
Was great today.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Bob Sacamano on March 02, 2020, 01:05:54 AM
https://www.nsno.co.uk/forums/index.php?topic=94432.0

:)

(https://i.imgur.com/VU9DL48.png)

Youíll have to get in line with your ďcalled itĒ Iím afraid. 😎
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Shogun on March 02, 2020, 01:14:30 AM
Might still be in with a shot of top scorer. Only four off.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: kramer0 on March 02, 2020, 01:21:47 AM
He must be a nightmare to play against.

He wins everything in the air and he's beating most defenders for pace, as well.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Goaljira on March 02, 2020, 01:24:49 AM
He was brilliant today.  So much more involved than last week.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: YankeeBlue214 on March 02, 2020, 01:29:24 AM
Might still be in with a shot of top scorer. Only four off.

Well not now that you said it out loud. Way to go Shogun, way to go.
Title: Re: DCL
Post by: Risky on March 02, 2020, 01:30:54 AM