October 16, 2019, 05:33:09 PM

Poll

Who should be the next England manager?

Gareth Southgate
1 (2.8%)
Glenn Hoddle
4 (11.1%)
Alan Pardew
0 (0%)
Sam Allardyce
12 (33.3%)
'Arry the Liquidator
5 (13.9%)
Gary Neville
1 (2.8%)
Brendan Rodgers
0 (0%)
Eddie Howe
2 (5.6%)
A different English manager
0 (0%)
A different foreign manager
11 (30.6%)

Total Members Voted: 36

Author Topic: Who should be the next England Manager?  (Read 12034 times)

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June 28, 2016, 03:42:29 PM
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hill135



June 28, 2016, 03:49:27 PM
Reply #1
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Macca77


It will be another FA puppet,  Southgate

June 28, 2016, 03:54:51 PM
Reply #2
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Bluedylan


I'm firmly in the England manager should be English camp, but then I'm a massive racist.

Nah, I've always felt that the point of international sport is that you test your best manager and players against another nation's best manager and players. If you start buying people in, and throwing money at non-English people to do the job, it negates the point, and you might as well start buying foreign players in and let every team have 3 non-nationals.

I'm aware that the are examples of non-English coaches being successful in rugby and cricket, but as I say, I think it negates the point of the entire thing. Just my view.

Anyway, as Ram was saying last night, I'd see if we could tempt Eddie Howe. He's young and seems to be progressive in his style of football, but his teams also press the ball (I think).

I would try to build something over a few years, a style of play and an identity. I would also make this clear when we appoint the manager as one of the key criteria for the new man - come up with a system and a way of playing that works for us, and stick with it for a sustained period of time

International management has traditionally been seen as a job for older managers, as more of a statesman figure. But as we've seen with Conte and others, that doesn't have to be the case (I'm not saying Eddie Howe is on par with Conte by the way). It seems to be more fluid now that managers can switch between club and international management.
''In the words of the prophet, today you sell your ring, tomorrow your watch, next week your chain and in 77 days, you won't have eyes to cry with''

Accattone - Pier Paolo Pasolini.


June 28, 2016, 04:05:58 PM
Reply #3
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blargins

NSNO Subscriber
Does it really matter? I'd say save money, pick someone off the street give them 100k a year. It won't be any worse. Still never win anything.
“The best way to not feel hopeless is to get up and do something. Don’t wait for good things to happen to you. If you go out and make some good things happen, you will fill the world with hope, you will fill yourself with hope.” Barack Obama

June 28, 2016, 04:24:39 PM
Reply #4
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hill135


Putting aside the question of a 'nationality requirement' for the moment and focusing on the systemic problems, I would like to know: why does our system of coaching badges fail to produce good managers? Perhaps it is time to address that.

Most major European nations I can think of have at least one (sometimes more) outstanding candidate in their field who the nation could get behind. Some are not realistic candidates for the national team job (e.g. Klopp to Germany, Pep to Spain), but some are (Conte at Italy, Deschamp, Blanc for France).

We don't have this. None of our managers are at the top of the game. Only three of them actually coach in our domestic top flight. The pool is therefore uninspiring.

Why?

June 28, 2016, 04:25:14 PM
Reply #5
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rbbrslmn




June 28, 2016, 04:49:57 PM
Reply #6
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ally2



June 28, 2016, 05:54:00 PM
Reply #7
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blargins

NSNO Subscriber
Putting aside the question of a 'nationality requirement' for the moment and focusing on the systemic problems, I would like to know: why does our system of coaching badges fail to produce good managers? Perhaps it is time to address that.

Most major European nations I can think of have at least one (sometimes more) outstanding candidate in their field who the nation could get behind. Some are not realistic candidates for the national team job (e.g. Klopp to Germany, Pep to Spain), but some are (Conte at Italy, Deschamp, Blanc for France).

We don't have this. None of our managers are at the top of the game. Only three of them actually coach in our domestic top flight. The pool is therefore uninspiring.

Why?

How many English coaches are there in the premier league? Now how many coaches of the same nationality on in the respective leagues you mentioned?

The Brexit should help fix all this ;)
“The best way to not feel hopeless is to get up and do something. Don’t wait for good things to happen to you. If you go out and make some good things happen, you will fill the world with hope, you will fill yourself with hope.” Barack Obama

June 28, 2016, 06:04:21 PM
Reply #8
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Alanvideo


As I said on another thread I've been watching England for 50 years and nothing changes. I've been disinterested  for years ,to the point where I'm not bothered if we lose. I feel sorry for fans who follow the team abroad though.
The players don't seem arsed until we get a game with a bit of needle in it. Whoever is the manager ,it's a bit of a poisoned chalice and they always play with caution instead of intensity.
 One thing that has changed over the decades is an increase in the number of friendlies and the huge number of fringe players who get a game . Being selected for England is almost meaningless now.
I guess the players like the World Cup but I bet they can't be arsed with the Euros ,most of them look like they wish they were on the beach somewhere.
I expected us to beat Iceland by the odd goal and then go to Paris and get shown up by the French so at least we're spared that.
We are special ,we are Everton.

June 28, 2016, 06:45:18 PM
Reply #9
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blargins

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Nigel Farrage. At least he wouldn't pick Sterling.
“The best way to not feel hopeless is to get up and do something. Don’t wait for good things to happen to you. If you go out and make some good things happen, you will fill the world with hope, you will fill yourself with hope.” Barack Obama

June 28, 2016, 08:50:44 PM
Reply #10
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kramer0


I'm not English so these are observations from afar1. I think there are two main reasons why there aren't many good English managers:

(1) There aren't a lot of good role models for young English managers (or young English managers aren't seeking them out).

(2) The English football pyramid is sack-happy.

W/r/t (1): Think about the world's current best managers. We all have differing opinions but a generic list might include Jose Mourinho, Carlo Ancelotti, and Pep Guardiola. Now think about where these men came from. Jose Mourinho worked closely with Sir Bobby Robson at Porto and Barcelona and stayed on at Barca after Robson left to work as an assistant to Louis van Gaal. Carlo Ancelotti played for Arrigo Sacchi and served as his assistant with the Italian national team at the beginning of his career. Pep Guardiola played for and learned from Johan Cruyff, Bobby Robson, and Louis van Gaal at Barcelona; he also sought advice from and studied the tactics of Marcelo Bielsa (proving that young managers can seek out their own mentors).

Important point: the best managers of today learned from the best managers of yesterday. It's not about adhering to successful tactics of the past -- all of these men have deviated from their mentors' approaches to achieve what they have -- but they learned to think about the game from some of football's all-time greatest minds and that experience has helped them succeed over a long period of time.

Now think about where the average English prospective manager learns to think about the game. It shouldn't be too surprising that there aren't many good ones2.

W/r/t (2): This is pretty apparent. Relegation is a serious fear at all levels of the English pyramid making on-the-job learning very difficult.

To revisit of generic "best managers" group -- Guardiola managed Barcelona B in the Spanish league system (a team that understandably has little relegation fear). Ancelotti started with Reggiana in Serie B. Mourinho managed Barcelona some (van Gaal let him take charge for certain games) before getting full control at Benfica, União de Leiria, and Porto3.

A young manager needs time to learn from his mistakes and young English managers aren't getting it (at the Premier League and Championship level, at least, although I don't think there's much patience in League One or League Two either).



1. Although you can easily point out that we have similar problems in America (mostly (1); (2) is less problematic because nobody cares too much if you lose in the MLS).

2. It's disappointing that for all of his success in England, Sir Alex Ferguson didn't produce one capable English assistant (or maybe he did -- someone please correct me if I'm wrong). Ditto for Wenger (again, correct me if I'm wrong).

3. Yes, these guys were all instant successes. The point still stands.

Also, here's an article on this type of this thing if you're interested:

http://statsbomb.com/2016/06/how-do-coaches-learn/
« Last Edit: June 28, 2016, 08:53:16 PM by kramer0 »

June 28, 2016, 08:53:35 PM
Reply #11
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Tony Clifton


Roberto Martinez linked with both England and Spain! 

Alan Partridge Pardew would be fun.

June 28, 2016, 09:24:07 PM
Reply #12
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blueToffee

NSNO Subscriber
I want them to give it to someone who is good at their job and already has a job in management, basically doing this on the side.

I don't think the national coach need be a full time job for someone in their sunset years. IF we want to give it to Howe for example let him keep his day job and keep truly active in management where he'll still be up to date on all these players anyway.

Pardew, Southgate, these names just defy any sort of logic. I don't know if I could even watch the England team and not get really angry anytime the camera panned to the bench.

June 28, 2016, 10:39:25 PM
Reply #13
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Alanvideo


Southgate's finest hour............
We are special ,we are Everton.

June 28, 2016, 10:52:05 PM
Reply #14
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Haile GAZrselassie


Redknapp.

As crooked as he comes across I think he'd be the best choice.

He's tactically decent, strong minded and, most importantly would be picking players based on form and fitness.

Hodgson's main problem was his loyalty to players who weren't physically up to the job and trying to crow bar his favourites into a team and fitting a system around them.

After that, I'd probably see how Eddie Howe does with Bournemouth in the first 6 months of this season and if he appears to be continuing to keep them progressing I'd give it him.

Well. I'd offer it him. At this stage of his career would he want to work part time?
Stealth ya flaming galargh!!!