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Author Topic: [News]Bramley Moore Dock update  (Read 472698 times)

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December 21, 2018, 07:29:13 AM
Reply #4215
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Ross


Love the ambition. Really do. But you’re Not having perspective here mate.

You want us to be catching the likes of city spurs and arsenal all in one shot.

Sometimes the business mind has to win over the sporting heart. Maybe we will stretch ourselves to thin if we go to 62k right away? Lots of factors at work here

Yeah but I’ve never stated it should be anything like 62k BN.

As for saying I’m being over ambitious here all I can say is this sort of figure would only be 1500 more seats than DK’s planned capacity, and we all know how people hated that for being “small time” (amongst other things).

No, you're right, it's kick it down the road.

Fact remains that it's not currently affordable for us to build a substantially larger stadium on that particular site.

The merits of a 52k seater on the docks vs a 55k or a 60k seater elsewhere is a different argument.


That’s the crux isn’t it, forget everything else.


« Last Edit: December 21, 2018, 07:37:12 AM by Ross »
There are only two things I can't stand in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures... and the Dutch.


December 21, 2018, 09:19:20 AM
Reply #4216
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arteta4spain


Argh went through those last three pages to not find any plans just people moaning about the capacity. Typical.

December 21, 2018, 11:46:55 AM
Reply #4217
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Goaljira

NSNO Subscriber
You brought turnover up not me hence the reference to Bale, not a great leap to make really. I said we were pretty much on par with Spurs around the time they decided to think big and are seemingly crossing the divide to the top clubs. I said we need to do something similar and by not being ambitious enough well never break through actually.

There’s actually many comparison between where we are now and where Spurs where at the same point. Be it attendance figures, finances and positions in the the league. They’ve been brave at a time we’re being timid that’s the biggest difference.

Would it be 'brave' for us to look to bridge that gap by charging £1000+ for a season ticket like Spurs do?  Surely us only charging £450 is us fearing ambition because if we believed in ourselves then our stand would pay.

If 52k was the max then it would lack ambition.  52k with plans and designs in place to increase to 62k 'if demand requires it' isn't small time at all, it's just being smart.


December 21, 2018, 12:09:51 PM
Reply #4218
Online

TheRam

NSNO Subscriber
This is probably one of the most brave and ambitious stadium constructions to ever happen in the game.

I mean, we are attempting to build a football ground on a world heritage site. I’m not sure that’s even been done?

The ambition already comes from getting the stadium built in the first place. Let’s not lose sight over a few thousand seats.

Hey there mister can you tell me what happened to the seeds I've sown
Can you give me a reason sir as to why they've never grown

December 21, 2018, 12:43:39 PM
Reply #4219
Online

Bluedylan


A few points about this:

1) It's perfectly reasonable for people to express their disagreement with this decision/proposal, without them being accused of 'moaning', being involved in 'dick swinging contests' etc. It's a complex issue, and whatever your opinion, it's not unreasonable to think we should aim for higher than we are, so let's swerve any ridiculing of opposing opinions please. (I'm not saying that to the majority on here, who are making reasoned arguments btw).

2) Ultimately, sport is about competition, whether that is on or off the pitch. So yes, it does matter what other teams are doing, in relation to what we are doing. We don't exist in isolation. It's right to compare with our competitors. I just don't get the point that gash made saying 'who cares what other clubs' capacities are?'. Of course we should care and it should be relevant. It shouldn't be the only consideration, but it has to be part of our thinking and of the decision making process.

3) We need to get away from this mentality of 'I only want diehard Evertonians in the ground, and sod outsiders/daytrippers/casual fans'. If we go along that route, we never grow and we get left behind. Football is a global market, and if you're not embracing that as much as you can, you're losing to your competitors. We should always be proud of our heritage and our roots and we always need to maintain that connection with L4 and the city generally, but this insular, small minded attitude is ultimately counter productive. If we're going to be successful, we need to open ourselves and sell ourselves to new people from different places. I know that's uncomfortable for some people, given that we use it as a stick to beat the other lot with, but it's just the reality of the situation.
''In the words of the prophet, today you sell your ring, tomorrow your watch, next week your chain and in 77 days, you won't have eyes to cry with''

Accattone - Pier Paolo Pasolini.

December 21, 2018, 01:34:12 PM
Reply #4220
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Gash

Global Moderator
You brought turnover up not me hence the reference to Bale, not a great leap to make really. I said we were pretty much on par with Spurs around the time they decided to think big and are seemingly crossing the divide to the top clubs. I said we need to do something similar and by not being ambitious enough well never break through actually.

There’s actually many comparison between where we are now and where Spurs where at the same point. Be it attendance figures, finances and positions in the the league. They’ve been brave at a time we’re being timid that’s the biggest difference.

The reason turnover and profit was brought up was because you seem to think a bigger stadium with more seats automatically means we'd have more of both, it's been pointed out that's not correct and that despite having a smaller capacity Spurs have generated far more revenue than we have over the last 10-15 years or so.

There's also absolutely nothing timid in what we're trying to do.
« Last Edit: December 21, 2018, 02:10:01 PM by Gash »


December 21, 2018, 01:43:23 PM
Reply #4221
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Gash

Global Moderator
I just don't get the point that gash made saying 'who cares what other clubs' capacities are?'

This seems have become some people's sole issue, just because it"s not as big as Anfield or St James's etc. It's totally irrelevant what other clubs capacities are in relation to ours. We aren't going to spend money on a 60k stadium if all the data and research shows our absolute ceiling is 52k just because X, Y and Z have 60k seats stadiums.

I honestly don't see the big issue with the capacity or the reason to push for another 8-10k seats when you only need to look at bigger, more successful clubs struggling fill their grounds.

December 21, 2018, 01:50:31 PM
Reply #4222
Online

TheRam

NSNO Subscriber
A few points about this:

1) It's perfectly reasonable for people to express their disagreement with this decision/proposal, without them being accused of 'moaning', being involved in 'dick swinging contests' etc. It's a complex issue, and whatever your opinion, it's not unreasonable to think we should aim for higher than we are, so let's swerve any ridiculing of opposing opinions please. (I'm not saying that to the majority on here, who are making reasoned arguments btw).

2) Ultimately, sport is about competition, whether that is on or off the pitch. So yes, it does matter what other teams are doing, in relation to what we are doing. We don't exist in isolation. It's right to compare with our competitors. I just don't get the point that gash made saying 'who cares what other clubs' capacities are?'. Of course we should care and it should be relevant. It shouldn't be the only consideration, but it has to be part of our thinking and of the decision making process.

3) We need to get away from this mentality of 'I only want diehard Evertonians in the ground, and sod outsiders/daytrippers/casual fans'. If we go along that route, we never grow and we get left behind. Football is a global market, and if you're not embracing that as much as you can, you're losing to your competitors. We should always be proud of our heritage and our roots and we always need to maintain that connection with L4 and the city generally, but this insular, small minded attitude is ultimately counter productive. If we're going to be successful, we need to open ourselves and sell ourselves to new people from different places. I know that's uncomfortable for some people, given that we use it as a stick to beat the other lot with, but it's just the reality of the situation.

There’s absolutely nothing smalltime about this stadium though.

It’s amazing we’ve managed to pull off getting this built in such a location.
Hey there mister can you tell me what happened to the seeds I've sown
Can you give me a reason sir as to why they've never grown

December 21, 2018, 01:57:16 PM
Reply #4223
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Bob Sacamano

NSNO Subscriber
Still crying over 3000 seats lolol

December 21, 2018, 02:05:36 PM
Reply #4224
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Escla

NSNO Subscriber
According to Greater Manchester Police the average attendance at Man City is 46,000 and not the near 54,that they publish, anyone who watched the game against us last week will have seen the vast number of empty seats. On a separate note I don’t understand how we went from peddling half season tickets two years ago to now having a waiting list of 10,000, were we so successful ?

December 21, 2018, 02:19:08 PM
Reply #4225
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arteta4spain


Any idea when we’ll see any plans? Come on Dan give us blues a nice early Christmas present! ;-)

December 21, 2018, 02:20:43 PM
Reply #4226
Online

brap2

NSNO Subscriber
According to Greater Manchester Police the average attendance at Man City is 46,000 and not the near 54,that they publish, anyone who watched the game against us last week will have seen the vast number of empty seats. On a separate note I don’t understand how we went from peddling half season tickets two years ago to now having a waiting list of 10,000, were we so successful ?

And how come this 10k waiting list has only come up like a week ago?

Suspect stuff.
I knew that someday I was going to die, and I knew that before I died, two things would happen to me. That number one; I would regret my entire life, and number two; that I would want to live my life over again.

December 21, 2018, 02:26:22 PM
Reply #4227
Online

TheRam

NSNO Subscriber
And how come this 10k waiting list has only come up like a week ago?

Suspect stuff.

It’s been knocking about for a while to be fair.

But they’ve never advertised to go on a waiting list.

Last season they advertised to declare an interest in a season ticket and of any were available they’ll sort in on a first come, first served basis.

I managed to luckily get one, albeit on obstructed view but was only on the list for a matter of two weeks, if that.

Now that process has suddenly turned into a 10k waiting list?

Does anybody know anyone who’s on this waiting list?
Hey there mister can you tell me what happened to the seeds I've sown
Can you give me a reason sir as to why they've never grown

December 21, 2018, 02:36:23 PM
Reply #4228
Online

Macca77


Be arsed arguing about this all day today, some are happy, others arn't, I'm in the arn't category, just think we've missed a trick here, demand for tickets has never been so high, in my opinion 55K every other week is very achievable, but what do I know eh!

December 21, 2018, 02:37:34 PM
Reply #4229
Online

Macca77


It’s been knocking about for a while to be fair.

But they’ve never advertised to go on a waiting list.

Last season they advertised to declare an interest in a season ticket and of any were available they’ll sort in on a first come, first served basis.

I managed to luckily get one, albeit on obstructed view but was only on the list for a matter of two weeks, if that.

Now that process has suddenly turned into a 10k waiting list?

Does anybody know anyone who’s on this waiting list?

There is now a three tier structure just to get on the waiting list, I can't make head nor tail of it