May 20, 2018, 05:15:03 PM

Author Topic: [News]Klaassen: Adapting to English game has not been easy  (Read 17802 times)

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January 22, 2018, 09:12:12 PM
Reply #180
Online

Lincs Toffee


Can Davy really be that much worse than Schneiderlin for us to not try him in a side, against lower opposition, at home, where we should be attacking more ? I really think if we gave him  and Gueye a run of games we could actually be more productive from midfield.
ďI used to stick the ball in the net and bow three times to the Kop. They never liked me doing that.Ē - Dixie Dean


January 22, 2018, 09:31:39 PM
Reply #181
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formerKHL


some people have to realise.....just because he's not playing doesn't mean he's shit in training....

for me its more a case of the manager doesn't think he'll fit into his system....

and lets face it having an attacking midfielder in our team....well current performances sez it all.....

January 22, 2018, 09:40:14 PM
Reply #182
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GrantyBoy78


some people have to realise.....just because he's not playing doesn't mean he's shit in training....

for me its more a case of the manager doesn't think he'll fit into his system....

and lets face it having an attacking midfielder in our team....well current performances sez it all.....
Koeman and Unsworth didnít fancy him either


January 22, 2018, 09:53:07 PM
Reply #183
Online

Gash

Global Moderator
I think when you spend the thick end of £25m on a player you need to give him a bit more than 190 minutes in the Premier League to get him used to it, even the games he started he didn't get more than an hour, proper confidence sapping treatment. Short of taking his locker off him I think it's a bit shite the way he's been treated, especially by Koeman who wanted him then pretty much flung him on the scrapheap without giving him much of a chance.

Ironically the only two games where he was played for 90 minutes we won 3-0.
« Last Edit: January 22, 2018, 10:20:25 PM by Gash »

January 22, 2018, 09:57:14 PM
Reply #184
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Lxxx


He's had 6 months to get up to speed and still Sam said he's not showing enough in training to warrant a place in the squad. I suppose he's a Rooney/Sig-lite and if he can't find a place for both of them at once then he's not going to find a slot for Klaassan.

January 22, 2018, 09:58:32 PM
Reply #185
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formerKHL


at least they both tried him though....

I think its too easy to discard a player and use the excuse that he doesn't fit the system.....

players make systems not the other way around.......and continued non use of any player doesn't give them the opportunity to fit in



January 22, 2018, 10:11:33 PM
Reply #186
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blueToffee

NSNO Subscriber
There has got to be a fair amount of discontent in the squad at the moment. It can't be a great atmosphere around Finch Farm.

Klaassen, Sandro, Vlasic, Lookman, Davies, Robles, Keane, possibly even Rooney to a degree can't be over the moon with their personal situations right now. Add in even maybe Jagielka being pushed to the periphery and most of the team he's used to leaving, Baines and Coleman and now McCarthy out injured...I dunno it doesn't strike me as a situation where players would be in particularly great spirits.

January 22, 2018, 10:19:35 PM
Reply #187
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kramer0


It's relevant enough so here are some scattered thoughts on the midfield.

I think we generally look most competent with a midfield three, provided we have the right mix. In particular, we need:

1. someone who defends - Gana, Schneiderlin, McCarthy, Bangingime
2. someone who plays box-to-box - Davies, Klaassen (?)
3. someone capable of applying the final pass/finish - Sigurdsson, Rooney, Klaassen (?)

You can see the problem from a squad construction point-of-view. We have too many one-note defensive types and not enough players capable of affecting games going forward.

I'm not sure where Klaassen falls between 2 and 3. Ajax supporters seemed adamant that he was a box-to-box player but he hasn't influenced games much when he's played in that role. All of his best contributions have been deft touches or clever bits of movement around the penalty area to create chances for teammates/himself, which suggests to me that he's more of a "finisher."

I think where we've generally gone wrong over the past season-and-a-half is that we play too many players from category 1, which causes problems getting the ball into the final third, creating/scoring chances, and, strangely enough, defending (when we play 2 DMs, neither stays put, often leaving too much space in front of the defense). Koeman ran into this issue with the Schneiderlin/Gana combo after AFCON last season and at the beginning of this season. Allardyce is running into it again now, for some reason (he started with the balanced Gana-Davies-Rooney trio and hasn't gone back to it). Take Saturday, for instance. One of the reasons we were so ineffective in attack is that West Brom regularly forced us to check back to McCarthy when we built down the right and McCarthy isn't any good in the final third (they did the same thing with Cuco on the left but, unfortunately, we don't have another option at LB right now unless you're a Garbutt fan).

Allardyce would do well to stick with only one defensive type from now on. Any decent football we've played has come from that type of configuration. It's the only way we get any sort of control of the ball. Two DMs in a midfield three means lots of hoofs with no one to feed off the scraps.

If he absolutely has to play two DMs and go full-on anti-football, he should consider changing the shape to a 4-4-2, with another central player further forward to feed off of knockdowns from Tosun. Walcott, or maybe even Klaassen, might fit that role (Niasse needs to be kept on the bench; he's a fantastic sub).
« Last Edit: January 23, 2018, 01:21:57 AM by kramer0 »

January 22, 2018, 10:31:03 PM
Reply #188
Online

gizzblue


It's relevant enough so here are some scattered thoughts on the midfield.

I think we generally look most competent with a midfield three, provided we have the right mix. In particular, we need:

1. someone who defends - Gana, Schneiderlin, McCarthy, Bangingime
2. someone who plays box-to-box - Davies, Klaassen (?)
3. someone capable of applying the final pass/finish - Sigurdsson, Rooney, Klaassen (?)

You can see the problem from a squad construction point-of-view. We have too many one-note defensive types and not enough players capable of affecting games going forward.

I'm not sure where Klaassen falls between 2 and 3. Ajax supporters seemed adamant that he was a box-to-box player but he hasn't influenced games much when he's played in that role. All of his best contributions have been deft touches or clever bits of movement around the penalty area to create chances for teammates/himself, which suggests to me that he's more of a "finisher."

I think where we've generally gone wrong over the past season-and-a-half is that we play too many players from category 1, which causes problems getting the ball into the final third, creating/scoring chances, and, strangely enough, defending (when we play 2 DMs, neither stays put, leaving a ton of space in front of the defense). Koeman ran into this issue with the Schneiderlin/Gana combo after AFCON last year and at the beginning of this season. Allardyce is running into it again now, for some reason (he started with the balanced Gana-Davies-Rooney trio and hasn't gone back to it). Take Saturday, for instance. One of the reasons we were so ineffective in attack is that West Brom regularly forced us to check back to McCarthy when we built down the right and McCarthy isn't any good in the final third (they did the same thing with Cuco on the left but, unfortunately, we don't have another option at LB right now unless you're a Garbutt fan).

Allardyce would do well to stick with only one defensive type from now on. Any decent football we've played has come from that type of configuration. It's the only way get any sort of control over the ball. Two DMs in a midfield three means loads of hoofs with no one to feed off the scraps.

If he absolutely has to play two DMs and go full-on anti-football, he should consider changing the shape to a 4-4-2, with another central player to feed off of knockdowns from Tosun. Walcott, or maybe even Klaassen, might fit that role (Niasse needs to be kept on the bench; he's a fantastic sub).
This is brilliantly analytic of our situation ....how many years sports science did you do 😛👍.

In all seriousness though yet another fan can read perfectly the situations but the management wont even try it any other way ...fucking useless.

January 23, 2018, 01:47:16 AM
Reply #189
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Juanito


He's had 6 months to get up to speed and still Sam said he's not showing enough in training to warrant a place in the squad. I suppose he's a Rooney/Sig-lite and if he can't find a place for both of them at once then he's not going to find a slot for Klaassan.



45 million on Sigurdsson
24 million on Klaassen
150,000 on Rooney

All to occupy one position, while a reserve right back occupies our left back slot. Walsh, do one.

January 23, 2018, 01:55:27 AM
Reply #190
Offline

cantoffee


To be honest I have no idea what type of player he is.

Basically all I can say is that he seems to have a decent touch and maybe a clever bit of play in him.

Doesn't seem to fit the box to box mould, doesn't seem the type to put his foot on the ball, doesn't seem to have a range of passing, seems weak in the air and the tackle.

Maybe he'll prove to fit in and he admittedly has not had much time to settle in and get minutes but I really can't see what he brings to the side.

January 23, 2018, 01:58:44 AM
Reply #191
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Ell Capitan

NSNO Subscriber
He's had 6 months to get up to speed and still Sam said he's not showing enough in training to warrant a place in the squad. I suppose he's a Rooney/Sig-lite and if he can't find a place for both of them at once then he's not going to find a slot for Klaassan.

Could be he knows thereís no space for all 3 and politically itís easiest by far to get rid of Klaassen so why bother even giving him a chance.

January 23, 2018, 02:04:24 AM
Reply #192
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eugene


Koeman and Unsworth didn't fancy him either
From the little I have seen from klaassen, he seams to do a lot of running around without taking the ball with him!
The premier league may just be a little too alien.

January 23, 2018, 02:05:58 AM
Reply #193
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Ell Capitan

NSNO Subscriber
And I donít factor Unsworths dismissal of him as meaning much. Unsworthís team selections were very much trying to make the point to our board that he thought our transfer activity was a disaster. Look at his first team in his first game vs Chelsea - almost none of the new boys in there: Pickford, Baines, Williams, Jags, JJK, mirallas, Davies, Beni, Lennon, Rooney.

January 23, 2018, 02:16:32 AM
Reply #194
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Lxxx


Could be he knows thereís no space for all 3 and politically itís easiest by far to get rid of Klaassen so why bother even giving him a chance.

Could be a bit of that as well. Itíd pay for a new left back if he can tempt a buyer in the summer.