June 20, 2018, 03:03:56 PM

Author Topic: The big man, the boss; Big Sam  (Read 115892 times)

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February 16, 2018, 05:48:02 PM
Reply #2265
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bogie


What teams? Because moving the likes of Sunderland and Palace up one or two places in the league isn't something to brag about really is it, that's his level though

And I can name one manager who improved his players after less than a week, Carlos Carvalhal at Swansea

what teams ?  I tell you what why dont you go work it out it is not really that hard I am sure even you could do it

and as for your 2nd point Big Sam comes in we win a few games and its fuck all to do with him Swansea get a new manager in its all down to him the same guy that got sacked a league below or did you forget about that and that would be the same league that (and here is you clue for the 1st point) Big Sam got 2 yes 2 teams up with


February 16, 2018, 07:27:02 PM
Reply #2266
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Audrey Horne

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what teams ?  I tell you what why dont you go work it out it is not really that hard I am sure even you could do it

and as for your 2nd point Big Sam comes in we win a few games and its fuck all to do with him Swansea get a new manager in its all down to him the same guy that got sacked a league below or did you forget about that and that would be the same league that (and here is you clue for the 1st point) Big Sam got 2 yes 2 teams up with

Where are you from Bogie?
I have to return some videotapes.

Vamos lŠ Everton!

February 16, 2018, 07:33:52 PM
Reply #2267
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cantoffee




February 16, 2018, 07:53:18 PM
Reply #2268
Online

Jamokachi


Where are you from Bogie?

A grim fucking place. Rhyl perhaps.

February 16, 2018, 07:57:01 PM
Reply #2269
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AllyBlue14



February 16, 2018, 08:08:10 PM
Reply #2270
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KoemansNumberTens


Are we really pretending he didn't do well at palace and Sunderland now? Wonder if their fans agree


February 16, 2018, 08:49:25 PM
Reply #2271
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Lxxx


Are we really pretending he didn't do well at palace and Sunderland now? Wonder if their fans agree

He did well in so much that they both didn't get relegated, which was his brief.

At Sunderland he had virtually a whole season, a season in which they were never out of the bottom three until the final weeks.

At Palace he was there 5 months in which time he only confirmed their Premier League status in the penultimate game of the season.

Are we really expected to hold this up as some kind of achievement worthy of entrusting the short term future of our club with? If we're looking for someone who'll keep us in the division then I suppose he's your man, possibly. If we have our sights set a little higher then I'd beg to differ.

February 16, 2018, 09:05:03 PM
Reply #2272
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Shropshire Blue

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75(?) teams relegated  since the PL formed so it's no mean feat when you look at what he had to work with.
Why are so many people afraid to acknowledge what he has achieved with limited or no resources at his previous clubs? It's no threat to sensible debate is it?
I don't think he's a long term prospect for us, I think he's short term to sort out the mess. The irony is that the reluctance to give him credit for anything is now looking totally ridiculous and actually undermining the very argument people are making as it all comes down to emotion rather than objective judgement.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2018, 09:06:27 PM by Shropshire Blue »
The Himalayas has the Yeti, Norway has Trolls, America has Hillbillies. You, good people, are blessed with Shropshire.

February 16, 2018, 09:19:58 PM
Reply #2273
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Lxxx


75(?) teams relegated  since the PL formed so it's no mean feat when you look at what he had to work with.
Why are so many people afraid to acknowledge what he has achieved with limited or no resources at his previous clubs? It's no threat to sensible debate is it?
I don't think he's a long term prospect for us, I think he's short term to sort out the mess. The irony is that the reluctance to give him credit for anything is now looking totally ridiculous and actually undermining the very argument people are making as it all comes down to emotion rather than objective judgement.

As Iíve said, if weíre giving out credit for keeping teams in the league by the skin of their teeth then by all means s give him a gold star.

Iím not quite sure what other credit in recent years youíre expecting him to be given. A 100% win record as England manager maybe?

February 16, 2018, 09:36:24 PM
Reply #2274
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Shropshire Blue

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As Iíve said, if weíre giving out credit for keeping teams in the league by the skin of their teeth then by all means s give him a gold star.

Iím not quite sure what other credit in recent years youíre expecting him to be given. A 100% win record as England manager maybe?
I think your reply makes my point very succinctly. ☺
The Himalayas has the Yeti, Norway has Trolls, America has Hillbillies. You, good people, are blessed with Shropshire.

February 16, 2018, 09:47:16 PM
Reply #2275
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Lxxx


I think your reply makes my point very succinctly. ☺

If you'd made your points a little more accurately you'd get some credit for them.

You mention the little or no resources he's had but at Palace he spent over £30m in the January transfer window and he was only there 5 months.

He gets credit for having a long management career but let's not kid ourselves he's actually achieved anything. Which in itself isn't really an issue as most managers outside the top 3-4 clubs don't actually 'achieve' anything of real note in this country.

I was actually on board with him at the start and said as much on here. I was willing to give him the benefit of the doubt but I don't see anything to get excited about in his time with us. He's managing us in the same way he's managed all his clubs, which is to dampen any expectation and play conservative football. Clearly he'll have till the end of the season to show everyone that next season might be different. After we've got to 40 points obviously.


February 16, 2018, 09:52:17 PM
Reply #2276
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KoemansNumberTens


He did well in so much that they both didn't get relegated, which was his brief.

At Sunderland he had virtually a whole season, a season in which they were never out of the bottom three until the final weeks.

At Palace he was there 5 months in which time he only confirmed their Premier League status in the penultimate game of the season.

Are we really expected to hold this up as some kind of achievement worthy of entrusting the short term future of our club with? If we're looking for someone who'll keep us in the division then I suppose he's your man, possibly. If we have our sights set a little higher then I'd beg to differ.

A Sunderland side that has since finished bottom of the premier league and could now drop out of the championship too. You can argue the job he did doesn't transfer to what we require. Really don't see how you can argue he didn't do a good job though

February 16, 2018, 10:01:02 PM
Reply #2277
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AllyBlue14


He did well in so much that they both didn't get relegated, which was his brief.

At Sunderland he had virtually a whole season, a season in which they were never out of the bottom three until the final weeks.

At Palace he was there 5 months in which time he only confirmed their Premier League status in the penultimate game of the season.

Are we really expected to hold this up as some kind of achievement worthy of entrusting the short term future of our club with? If we're looking for someone who'll keep us in the division then I suppose he's your man, possibly. If we have our sights set a little higher then I'd beg to differ.

To be fair, Palace and in particular Sunderland were absolutely horrendous - the fact he kept them up at all shouldn't be underestimated. Just look how Moyes fared there last year and how they're doing this season.

Allardyce is a solid manager, he gets teams to about where they belong in the league. We're unlikely to break through any glass ceilings with him - I think his time for that probably started and finished at Bolton - but he's a relatively safe pair of hands.

We're right to want more than that, especially with the investment we're able to throw around these days. But I also think a lot of people lose sight of how we may be perceived outside the club - we could well be looking for our 5th manager in 2 years, resorted to a 'safe pair of hands' type manager in November, expensive signings not paying off etc. - we might not be as attractive a proposition to the kind of people who could really take us forward. So it's fine to want to look beyond Allardyce, but who are the realistic and available options we can bring in that will genuinely make a difference?

(More a hypothetical question that should become clearer in the summer).

February 16, 2018, 10:12:15 PM
Reply #2278
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arteta4spain


Not gonna lie, Iíve not read the last 4 pages so sorry if Iím echoing a lot of whatís been said, but, I think we should assess the results at the end of the season, see where we are and what improvements have been made.
If we do achieve 7th you do have to give Allardyce credit in sorting this team to get the points needed. Yes weíve stood still but heís literally taken us from relegation threatened to bagging a European place.
For that he deserves to be kept on, with stipulations. Iíd bring him into the office and state that this is Everton Football Club we are not one that wants to be perceived as just staying in the league. Sam, you need to instil belief in the fans that we are on the up and are going the compete for Europe, at a minimum. This will give the players confidence in you and themselves as you see us as a team that can do that. None of this underdog crap and we are lucky to get a draw at (insert relegation candidates here)
Show us that you want to and believe that this can be achieved. If not hereís the door. Donít let it hit your fat arse on the way out.

February 16, 2018, 10:17:01 PM
Reply #2279
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Lxxx


A Sunderland side that has since finished bottom of the premier league and could now drop out of the championship too. You can argue the job he did doesn't transfer to what we require. Really don't see how you can argue he didn't do a good job though

As I've said, if we're looking for a man who'll keep us in the league he's as good an appointment as any. He'll have done a solid job if we finish the season tucked in behind the top 6 bearing in mind the way we started this campaign.

The summer is the chance to wipe the slate clean though and plan for the future and you don't do that with a man with 12 months left on his deal and someone you had to tempt out of retirement to take the role in the first place.