David Moyes

[Shogun]

McNeil comments were odd but I actually quite liked that from Moyes overall. Like all the home fans going to the matches he's clearly fed up of us being absolutely shit at home and it's starting to eat into the great away days because a lot of us will be thinking we've got Burnley and Tuesday and nobody would be remotely surprised if we don't win it.

Obviously Moyes in the manager and ultimately results fall on his shoulders but I'm glad he doesn't just seem content to pretend like it's okay that the away wins are covering the cracks of the home form.

Hope he's in the dressing room afterwards telling them it was a brilliant win and that they absolutely have to be beating Burnley on Tuesday night.

[Bluedylan1]

I know football isn’t xg, but that table has us in 13th, 6 points less, and 4 points off relegation.

We’ve been riding our luck this season, although we’ve probably deserved some of it due to our generally poor treatment by match officials and var.

Can't agree there. Xg is a far too reductive method of viewing a season (as you partially acknowledge). Far too many other variables. Sunderland are 19th in the Xg table. They're nowhere near that bad.

Xg can be handy for weighing up chance creation in individual games, and no doubt it can be illustrative of some wider trends for scouts and data analysts. It completely ignores game situations. It ignores red cards. We had a man sent off early at Old Trafford. Utd had loads of shots but very low quality chances, but they comfortably beat our Xg naturally. We absolutely deserved that win but it goes down as a heavy Xg loss.

Xg ignores long term injuries. It ignores players at Afcon. It ignores a million human aspects of running a football club. It ignores us barely being able to field a fit team in December and January.

I think to say we've been ''riding our luck'' is incredibly harsh given that we've won at Villa, Bournemouth, Man U, Fulham, Forest, Wolves. That's an incredible amount of luck to silence all those home crowds.

[Escalator]

Hard to understand why 14 of you think Moyes should be sacked at tge end of the season, not sure what you were expecting, CL ?

[Shogun]

Hard to understand why 14 of you think Moyes should be sacked at tge end of the season, not sure what you were expecting, CL ?

I'd have taken a few home wins.

The away wins are nice but it doesn't make up for the effort of travelling to the match throughout the winter in night matches to go and watch absolute shite and us get beat. We haven't won at home for 4 months.

If the home and away form was reversed then I don't think anyone would want Moyes out, but it does make a difference to the mood.

[Escalator]

Be careful what you wish for, anyway it’s a moot point as there isn’t the slightest possibility of him being sacked at the end of the season.

[sam of the south]

Can't agree there. Xg is a far too reductive method of viewing a season (as you partially acknowledge). Far too many other variables. Sunderland are 19th in the Xg table. They're nowhere near that bad.

Xg can be handy for weighing up chance creation in individual games, and no doubt it can be illustrative of some wider trends for scouts and data analysts. It completely ignores game situations. It ignores red cards. We had a man sent off early at Old Trafford. Utd had loads of shots but very low quality chances, but they comfortably beat our Xg naturally. We absolutely deserved that win but it goes down as a heavy Xg loss.

Xg ignores long term injuries. It ignores players at Afcon. It ignores a million human aspects of running a football club. It ignores us barely being able to field a fit team in December and January.

I think to say we've been ''riding our luck'' is incredibly harsh given that we've won at Villa, Bournemouth, Man U, Fulham, Forest, Wolves. That's an incredible amount of luck to silence all those home crowds.

Yeah, I get all that, and agree with much of it, but my worry is that shit has a tendency to level out to the mean at some point. Sandro’s goalscoring season and Martinez season 1 with all those worldies (and somewhat ironically built on the bedrock of Moyes’ solid foundations) are testament to this.

I’m just a worrier, and great away results are not sustainable for long. If the home performances were better than the poor home results I wouldn’t be worried so much, but we look dogshit at home, even most of the home victories were close and/or based largely on Grealish’s superhuman ability to retain possession of the football.

A few of those good away performances you quite rightly mentioned were achieved with a crop of our younger lads, who he just isn’t giving any game time to now, which does get me down a bit.

As is made obvious by a sizeable chunk of my posts, I really dislike his non-nurturing side towards young players, whilst seemingly giving a ton of leeway to seasoned vets and good honest pros, and this would be slightly more palatable if we didn’t have a transfer committee in place who seem to think differently; I fear for the house of cards falling down, and then parting ways with a manager who has a real gift for making clubs competitive at the very least, and then throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and getting in a Hurzeler who either gets hounded out the Club in a few months, and/or gets us relegated albeit with better xg results (which would further reflect much of the futility of my original post )

In truth, I’m in limbo with what I want and with what I believe in.

I love that he has stabilised us, and given us our pride back, and given us hope, and I love that Grealish and KDH love him, but I don’t like how harshly he speaks about and treats our new young players, nor the dismissive, almost gammony way he spoke about McNeil yesterday, a man for whom life has been a struggle for with his partner’s health issues and his own mh.

I dunno I’m just rambling as usual, but I just want us to be moving forward (which we are) and I want us to be a modern club in all senses, in terms of progressive ideals, where promising young players can look at us and think they would like to play football for us.

[NickNack]

Yeah, I get all that, and agree with much of it, but my worry is that shit has a tendency to level out to the mean at some point. Sandro’s goalscoring season and Martinez season 1 with all those worldies (and somewhat ironically built on the bedrock of Moyes’ solid foundations) are testament to this.

I’m just a worrier, and great away results are not sustainable for long. If the home performances were better than the poor home results I wouldn’t be worried so much, but we look dogshit at home, even most of the home victories were close and/or based largely on Grealish’s superhuman ability to retain possession of the football.

A few of those good away performances you quite rightly mentioned were achieved with a crop of our younger lads, who he just isn’t giving any game time to now, which does get me down a bit.

As is made obvious by a sizeable chunk of my posts, I really dislike his non-nurturing side towards young players, whilst seemingly giving a ton of leeway to seasoned vets and good honest pros, and this would be slightly more palatable if we didn’t have a transfer committee in place who seem to think differently; I fear for the house of cards falling down, and then parting ways with a manager who has a real gift for making clubs competitive at the very least, and then throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and getting in a Hurzeler who either gets hounded out the Club in a few months, and/or gets us relegated albeit with better xg results (which would further reflect much of the futility of my original post )

In truth, I’m in limbo with what I want and with what I believe in.

I love that he has stabilised us, and given us our pride back, and given us hope, and I love that Grealish and KDH love him, but I don’t like how harshly he speaks about and treats our new young players, nor the dismissive, almost gammony way he spoke about McNeil yesterday, a man for whom life has been a struggle for with his partner’s health issues and his own mh.

I dunno I’m just rambling as usual, but I just want us to be moving forward (which we are) and I want us to be a modern club in all senses, in terms of progressive ideals, where promising young players can look at us and think they would like to play football for us.

Sums my thoughts up perfectly tbh

[Juanito]

Yeah, I get all that, and agree with much of it, but my worry is that shit has a tendency to level out to the mean at some point. Sandro’s goalscoring season and Martinez season 1 with all those worldies (and somewhat ironically built on the bedrock of Moyes’ solid foundations) are testament to this.

I’m just a worrier, and great away results are not sustainable for long. If the home performances were better than the poor home results I wouldn’t be worried so much, but we look dogshit at home, even most of the home victories were close and/or based largely on Grealish’s superhuman ability to retain possession of the football.

A few of those good away performances you quite rightly mentioned were achieved with a crop of our younger lads, who he just isn’t giving any game time to now, which does get me down a bit.

As is made obvious by a sizeable chunk of my posts, I really dislike his non-nurturing side towards young players, whilst seemingly giving a ton of leeway to seasoned vets and good honest pros, and this would be slightly more palatable if we didn’t have a transfer committee in place who seem to think differently; I fear for the house of cards falling down, and then parting ways with a manager who has a real gift for making clubs competitive at the very least, and then throwing the baby out with the bathwater, and getting in a Hurzeler who either gets hounded out the Club in a few months, and/or gets us relegated albeit with better xg results (which would further reflect much of the futility of my original post )

In truth, I’m in limbo with what I want and with what I believe in.

I love that he has stabilised us, and given us our pride back, and given us hope, and I love that Grealish and KDH love him, but I don’t like how harshly he speaks about and treats our new young players, nor the dismissive, almost gammony way he spoke about McNeil yesterday, a man for whom life has been a struggle for with his partner’s health issues and his own mh.

I dunno I’m just rambling as usual, but I just want us to be moving forward (which we are) and I want us to be a modern club in all senses, in terms of progressive ideals, where promising young players can look at us and think they would like to play football for us.

Beautifully put and 100% agree

[Toddacelli]

It will be very interesting if, as we are led to believe, he will have funds in the summer to significantly improve the squad.

We’re on the right side of PSR or whatever it’s called now, and we supposedly have a record breaking shirt sponsorship deal that will all go towards squad funds - plus some lucrative events lined up for HDS.

He should be judged by what he builds and we’re largely moving in the right direction.

I just really wish he’d make better use of our younger players between now and the end of the season in order to give them some development. Going into next season with the amount of minutes they currently have, does not move the dial for players like Dibling, Rohl and Patterson, but playing them more just might.

[Toddacelli]

If we have money to bring in some good quality AND we’ve put minutes into our younger players this season - we could have real strength and depth for the next campaign.