AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2026 3:48 pm
It's not exactly hard to negotiate a new contract.
Also what's your alternative plan? Or should we just consign a 20 year old to the scrap heap because you can't be arsed to allow him time to develop?
Its probably a little bit hard to negotiate assuming we are paying premier league wages to a player who would have spent 3 years not ready to play Premier league football for us
Its utter madness to suggest this season plus 2 on loan is okay for a player we spent best part of 40m on
If we loan him, I’d be looking at just the first half of the season and see where he’s at.
If we didn’t have Europe to push for in the last few games then I’m sure he’d get a few games in the run in.
If we do get Europe then he stays put as we need a bigger squad.
I have my doubts over him, but also hopeful he’ll step up.
777Kidnappings wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2026 4:44 pm
Its probably a little bit hard to negotiate assuming we are paying premier league wages to a player who would have spent 3 years not ready to play Premier league football for us
Its utter madness to suggest this season plus 2 on loan is okay for a player we spent best part of 40m on
But you're not offering what you think the alternative is? It's fine to question his development path, but also all you're doing is saying you don't think things will work rather than giving an alternative.
AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Thu Apr 09, 2026 6:01 pm
But you're not offering what you think the alternative is? It's fine to question his development path, but also all you're doing is saying you don't think things will work rather than giving an alternative.
Theres possibly not an alternative because he was a really poor signing. Id probably sell him for 20m and some add ons and cut our losses but theres no good choice really
I still don’t think he’s that good or at least he doesn’t want it enough. Send him on loan to Germany young players do well there, then if he has a good/great season out there, sell him on in summer of 2027.
I’m not ready to give up on him. He’s only 20 and has Grealish spaceman potential.
It’s possible that his style is too laid back and it’ll never work. It’s also possible that he needed a year to learn what’s required of him off the ball at this level. Southampton didn’t really develop that side of his game.
Next season will be telling. If he continues to not play, it’s possible that Moyes doesn’t trust him or rate him. But Moyes has slow-played the integration of younger players in the past to some degree of success. Maybe that’s the plan.
I get that it’s frustrating because of the fee paid and our immediate needs but he could absolutely sell for a Grealish type fee if we nail his development. I don’t mind this risk. His value isn’t going to crater if we ultimately decide he’s not worth the time.
kramer wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2026 12:15 pm
I’m not ready to give up on him. He’s only 20 and has Grealish spaceman potential.
It’s possible that his style is too laid back and it’ll never work. It’s also possible that he needed a year to learn what’s required of him off the ball at this level. Southampton didn’t really develop that side of his game.
Next season will be telling. If he continues to not play, it’s possible that Moyes doesn’t trust him or rate him. But Moyes has slow-played the integration of younger players in the past to some degree of success. Maybe that’s the plan.
I get that it’s frustrating because of the fee paid and our immediate needs but he could absolutely sell for a Grealish type fee if we nail his development. I don’t mind this risk. His value isn’t going to crater if we ultimately decide he’s not worth the time.
He doesn't have much of a value based off track record so far. We bought hype and potential and so far he hasn't delivered anything for us to warrant any kind of fee.
I don't think we have much of a choice. We either persevere and try to develop him or we find him a decent loan for a season where we have an understanding that he is going somewhere to (ideally) play every week under the right tutelage and hopefully increase in value.
I think it will either click with him or it won’t. It hasn’t clicked with him yet that he needs to be faster, sharper, more aggressive and more alert to the needs and tactics of the team.
I really hope it does, and if it does, we will have a heck of a player.
Gary1878 wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2026 1:00 pm
I think it will either click with him or it won’t. It hasn’t clicked with him yet that he needs to be faster, sharper, more aggressive and more alert to the needs and tactics of the team.
I really hope it does, and if it does, we will have a heck of a player.
Exactly. The Chris Waddle-esque playing style only works with an end product. If not you're a liability to the team work ethic.
kramer wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2026 12:15 pm
I’m not ready to give up on him. He’s only 20 and has Grealish spaceman potential.
It’s possible that his style is too laid back and it’ll never work. It’s also possible that he needed a year to learn what’s required of him off the ball at this level. Southampton didn’t really develop that side of his game.
Next season will be telling. If he continues to not play, it’s possible that Moyes doesn’t trust him or rate him. But Moyes has slow-played the integration of younger players in the past to some degree of success. Maybe that’s the plan.
I get that it’s frustrating because of the fee paid and our immediate needs but he could absolutely sell for a Grealish type fee if we nail his development. I don’t mind this risk. His value isn’t going to crater if we ultimately decide he’s not worth the time.
We need to learn lessons from the likes of Lookman and Moise Kean... We we're a basket case of a club and jettisoned because we weren't capable of developing players with the raw ingredients but lacking in certain fundamentals.
We are no longer such a car crash and need to double down on these type of investments. People are way too quick to write players off and label them crap.
If you take the cost out of the equation, he's just a young bloke with a few months of good footy at this level under his belt, and then signed for a club with big expectations... It's a lot to ask, and some players in this situation will look a bit lost.
As long as he's playing regularly to a high standard by the time he's 23 I honestly don't care what happens to him before then. Loans or bit part player here, whatever. We bought him for the long term so we just need to manage his development in a way that we reap the rewards for the investment down the line.
I don’t think anyone has said he’s crap that I remember.
What I don’t understand is why they dont play in the reserves a few times, just to keep them match fit and sharp.
AjaxAndy wrote: ↑Fri Apr 10, 2026 2:10 pm
We need to learn lessons from the likes of Lookman and Moise Kean... We we're a basket case of a club and jettisoned because we weren't capable of developing players with the raw ingredients but lacking in certain fundamentals.
We are no longer such a car crash and need to double down on these type of investments. People are way too quick to write players off and label them crap.
If you take the cost out of the equation, he's just a young bloke with a few months of good footy at this level under his belt, and then signed for a club with big expectations... It's a lot to ask, and some players in this situation will look a bit lost.
As long as he's playing regularly to a high standard by the time he's 23 I honestly don't care what happens to him before then. Loans or bit part player here, whatever. We bought him for the long term so we just need to manage his development in a way that we reap the rewards for the investment down the line.
What lessons. Kean apart from last season is shite and lookman took years and years and numerous failed moves before he became the player he is now. On both moves we did better than most out of them
The lesson with kean is when you find a sucker you sell and the lesson with lookman is if you buy good potential cheap its not much of a risk. The problem with dibling is he wasn't cheap. The lesson is you dont invest big money in a player you dont need
I find it almost incomprehensible that someone with his ability and premier league experience has had such limited game time to evidence what he can do, even if it's coming on for the last 20/30 minutes - there have been opportunities. The limited opportunities he had got have almost been stitch up too. Hes basically been chucked on the wing with a O'Brien 200 yards away from him, offering fuck all, and expected to beat the world. I do think he could help himself a bit more as he does have a languid appearance which doesn't help, but I don't think we've helped him one bit.
Moyes will always prioritise fighting spirit, physical toughness, and defensive solidity over aesthetic footballers to secure results, especially when he's trying to establish something. It's not necessarily a bad thing and results have been encouraging, but until we get a manager that trusts and invests in developing youth players this outcome is somewhat inevitable
