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Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:04 am
by Gash
The likes of Sunderland have to go big and go early, they'll be fully aware of what's happened to the promoted teams over the last two seasons. I haven't paid much attention to who they've bought or what they've spent but I'm sure they'll have to pay all of the money to get the players they've bought as the selling clubs will know they're in a hurry and so will the players agents. Just because they've brought in a few players and spent a lot of money doesn't mean they've bought well though.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:14 am
by Bluedylan1
Out of Sunderland's signings, Adingra felt like maybe a slight missed opportunity for us for £21m plus addons.
Also noticed that KWP has agreed terms with West Ham. That could've been an opportunity for us.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:19 am
by TheRam
Impossible to tell with Sunderland’s signings as a lot are highly rated youngsters from inferior leagues. Can go either way with those signings but they will be a lot more competitive than previous promoted teams, as will Leeds who are building a really physical side.
Clubs like that are usually competitive because they’re big clubs and they always get it going at home.
Burnley have done good buisiness as well. Hartman is a very highly rated left back so they’ve done well with him.
There’s enough chaos with other teams like wolves, palace, and Brentford though to even it out.
Will definitely be a more competitive league next season though which is why it’s important to start the season with a strong squad and not leave points on the table. Sometimes you do just have bite the bullet on a player.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:23 am
by Sir Stealth
The Tete one was unfortunate I think - cos he would have 100% been our starting right back, and that position would be boxed off, with us happy enough with Patto, OBrien, Coleman sorting back up options between them
As it is - we need a right back
CB situation is ok Id say with Branthwaite, Tarks, O’Brien and Keane - happy to go with that
GK - Pickford, Travers, Tyrer - we will go with that
Striker - Barry’s signing means we’ve probably got a passable selection of strikers with him, main man Beto and Chermiti - though I wouldn’t mind another one if possible, but it’s not top of my priorities
Left back - there’s one in the squad , that’s a need, happy enough if it’s a free transfer/cheap back up option
Centre mid - Garner, Gana and young options in Armstrong and Iroegbunam - this is a big need . Want us to sign a starter. Needs big money investment - Hackney or Röhl would be the type I would go for, young with massive potential , but I still wouldn’t complain with a Luiz or Palhinha. At least 1 needed, preferably 2
Left mid/attacking centre mid - N’Diaye, McNeil and Alcaraz can all do both these positions - happy to stick with those options for now
Right Mid - not a single natural right sided midfielder in the squad - this is the priority signing I think - we need a starter and a back up
So ideally I think we need 2 right wingers/right sided midfielders, 1 starting right back, 1 back up left back, 1 starting centre mid, 1 back up centre mid so 6 players in and if possible another striker
We probably can’t get everything done that we need to so I expect we may have to go with some compromises, like O’Brien being our first choice right back for a season, Chermiti not going out on loan, Tim/Armstrong getting more mins than planned
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:25 am
by UnsyisaRhino
We're in a tough situation really, we need to add both numbers and quality while avoiding the same pitfalls that got us into this situation in the first place.
We're competing for players that probably have better options while trying to avoid being fleeced by teams and players who know we're desperate to bring people in.
I genuinely think we're trying to bring in the right people at the right price and we seem to be taking a very rigid approach.
At some point we might have to compromise slightly but its likely the club won't do that until they feel like they really have to. If that means a slower start to the season, then I'm betting they think it's worth it to get the right personnel in.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:27 am
by UnsyisaRhino
Sir Stealth wrote: ↑Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:23 am
The Tete one was unfortunate I think - cos he would have 100% been our starting right back, and that position would be boxed off, with us happy enough with Patto, OBrien, Coleman sorting back up options between them
As it is - we need a right back
CB situation is ok Id say with Branthwaite, Tarks, O’Brien and Keane - happy to go with that
GK - Pickford, Travers, Tyrer - we will go with that
Striker - Barry’s signing means we’ve probably got a passable selection of strikers with him, main man Beto and Chermiti - though I wouldn’t mind another one if possible, but it’s not top of my priorities
Left back - there’s one in the squad , that’s a need, happy enough if it’s a free transfer/cheap back up option
Centre mid - Garner, Gana and young options in Armstrong and Iroegbunam - this is a big need . Want us to sign a starter. Needs big money investment - Hackney or Röhl would be the type I would go for, young with massive potential , but I still wouldn’t complain with a Luiz or Palhinha. At least 1 needed, preferably 2
Left mid/attacking centre mid - N’Diaye, McNeil and Alcaraz can all do both these positions - happy to stick with those options for now
Right Mid - not a single natural right sided midfielder in the squad - this is the priority signing I think - we need a starter and a back up
So ideally I think we need 2 right wingers/right sided midfielders, 1 starting right back, 1 back up left back, 1 starting centre mid, 1 back up centre mid so 6 players in and if possible another striker
We probably can’t get everything done that we need to so I expect we may have to go with some compromises, like O’Brien being our first choice right back for a season, Chermiti not going out on loan, Tim/Armstrong getting more mins than planned
Totally agree with this assessment.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:46 am
by Shogun
The reason I mentioned Sunderland wasn't anything to do with the qualities of the players they've bought, it's that they've recognised they needed to improve the squad in a significant fashion and have immediately went out and done that without, on the face of it, particularly overpaying for any of those players.
It feels like we're sitting there going "Ah it's alright, we've got 23 players there. Only need a couple more. We can wait". As much as I don't rate the players that have left the club, they do still need to actually be replaced.
Mykolenko, Ndiaye, McNeil or Gana get injured in pre-season/early in the season then instead of bringing in a replacement who is settled with a full pre-season at the club behind him, we're going to bringing in someone who hasn't even been at the club for a month to play a crucial role in the team, that's if we actually get players in by that point.
The squad is massively frail and to not have rectified that a lot more by now is disappointing and very likely to bite us at the start of the season. If we've waited all this time to end up with Soucek/Harrison at the end of August then my head will really fall off.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:48 am
by Risky
UnsyisaRhino wrote: ↑Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:25 am
We're in a tough situation really, we need to add both numbers and quality while avoiding the same pitfalls that got us into this situation in the first place.
We're competing for players that probably have better options while trying to avoid being fleeced by teams and players who know we're desperate to bring people in.
I genuinely think we're trying to bring in the right people at the right price and we seem to be taking a very rigid approach.
At some point we might have to compromise slightly but its likely the club won't do that until they feel like they really have to. If that means a slower start to the season, then Im betting they think it's worth it to get the right personal in.
I think this is a key point. Hopefully the club have already got it in their recruitment plan that there's a point where they need to loosen the approach a little if we haven't done what we want to by a certain point (and hopefully that point is not transfer deadline day).
It's interesting reading this thread, I think nearly everyone is on the same page with understanding our situation, what positions are priorities, wanting to see another couple of quality players coming in asap. I certainly have a higher degree of confidence that the club are doing sensible things in the background at the moment than I would have done in the past, so I've still got some optimism that we'll see something happen in the next few days. At the same time though I'm certainly nervous that this won't be the case.
I think it's definitely true though that the impact of not making signings until late on will be a slow start to the season. It's been said by others, but the promoted clubs have the potential to be better than those of the last few seasons and the league will likely be more competitive. It would be really nice to hit the ground running and be looking up rather than down coming the end of September time.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 10:59 am
by bigmanbob
You have to be realistic though, we had arguably a lot more than any club has had to do in this window. The takeover and restructuring of the board had to be in place, then the recruitment teams, then signing the out of contract players we wanted to keep, then wait for July for the PSR regulations to not impact before making signings. Some of these can be done at the same time but some can't. The time to criticise recruitment, or lack of it, is the end of the the window, not the end of July. Yes in a perfect we'd have most of our signings in before the USA tour, but those aren't realistic expectations given what I've highlighted
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 11:01 am
by TheRam
I’ve said it before on here that we are really, really bad at signing squad players.
Players that you can bring in for cheap who provide good cover but are good enough to play when they get the chance.
Steven Naismith being the perfect example.
Always just seen to wait to see who’s available on loan or a free to fill a squad position and they’re rarely good enough.
At the very least we should be looking at left back and centre mid and saying who can we get for cover so we’re not left short at the start of the season.
The big signings take time and patience, you can’t neglect the need for squad fillers.
Been a lot of free transfers and cheap signings that have passed us by. I wonder if we’re even bothering and just waiting to see who’s available on loan at the last minute which is a mistake.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 11:11 am
by AllyBlue14
Is what it is.
It's obviously frustrating and we'd like to see movement but we'll get the players we get. There may be any number of reasons why we don't end up with certain players but it doesn't necessarily mean we're not trying hard enough or that our strategy is wrong.
We've lost players and need to add both depth and quality, but given how we finished last season and the fact that we have money to spend – and Moyes recruiting (so, not Dyche or Benitez) - I'm not really getting worked up over it.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 11:13 am
by AjaxAndy
We obviously are bothering as we tried to sign Tete for free, the reason we've probably not gone for other out of contract options are their wages would be too high or someone like KWP doesn't fit the physical nature Moyes wants. I think there's a reason we wanted Tete and that's because he's quite tall for a full back.
We pretty much always start season's missing a number of positions and it costs us points so I don't want that to happen... We 100% need signings before the season starts and ideally as soon as possible.
I'm perfectly happy for us to approach it sensibly though and not just panic buy a bunch of players because we lacked patience.
Get Luiz in, he's exactly what we need... But have a deadline for moving on if it doesn't happen. The links this morning would potentially suggest we've reached that stage, then once we've got the alternative player there move on with signing the RW we desperately need.
Squad fillers can come later, if much rather we got the CM and RW positions sorted with quality and then looked at squad fillers than doing it the other way round.
I'd be more concerned if the players we were linked with weren't so similar, but it seems we know what we want and are actively pursuing those players, but the Luiz transfer is holding everything up. Once that's either done and dusted or we move on I expect things to move fairly quickly on other deals.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 11:33 am
by Cods
Depends who gets injured.
Depends what formation we play.
Depends who we play against.
We can play a balanced backline with just our four current entrebacks if push comes to shove.
We can play narrow and tight in the middle and even use Charly, McNeil, N'Diaye central if we need. Barry wide.
We can work around it, Moyes has done more with fewer and less quality than he currently has at his disposal (not much, but still)
It's kind of his strength. We'll manage if we only get 3 our 4 more, we'll work out a way.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 11:40 am
by Goaljira
The problem with aiming high and waiting for people who we're not their first choice is that as we've seen time and time before when we eventually miss out on them we're left with overpaying for a panic buy who's not what we wanted or 'We'll go with what we've got'.
Stop chasing the dream. If we can't agree a deal then move on to the next target.
Re: The Rebuild
Posted: Fri Jul 18, 2025 11:46 am
by Gary1878
The absolute priorities have to be CM and a right winger. We simply can’t go into the new season with what we have in these areas. Money needs to go on both of these positions.
Everything else, I am a bit more relaxed about. Frees/loans will do here.